Modern wads that are relatively empty?

[deflatedhissy]

I fired up ancient aliens and sunlust but you spend more time shooting than navigating the level.  I know of that one in the cacowards with zero monsters, but am wondering if there's anything modern that has closer to iwad/early pwad enemy amounts.

[Deadwing]

Deathless might be are you are looking for

Also, 25 Years on Earth

[SilverMiner]

Doomer boards projects maybe?

[deflatedhissy]

9 minutes ago, SilverMiner said:

Doomer boards projects maybe?

 

Trying Evil Egypt.  Is there any near-foolproof, easy way of telling what port a wad is made for, just by gameplay?  Or by command console?  I always like to know if it's boom, vanilla or zdoom, but not badly enough to read the text file.

[Major Arlene]

2 minutes ago, deflatedhissy said:

 

Trying Evil Egypt.  Is there any near-foolproof, easy way of telling what port a wad is made for, just by gameplay?  Or by command console?  I always like to know if it's boom, vanilla or zdoom, but not badly enough to read the text file.

don't be lazy, read the text file. it's somewhere around the middle.

[deflatedhissy]

1 minute ago, Major Arlene said:

don't be lazy, read the text file. it's somewhere around the middle.

 

What are some clear indicators that a game is for a certain port?  E.g no crouching likely boom, no fancy portals = zdoom, and such.  I suppose some vanilla wads are indistinguishable to someone making their first modern level who doesn't feel like using custom textures and the like.

[Major Arlene]

1 minute ago, deflatedhissy said:

 

What are some clear indicators that a game is for a certain port?  E.g no crouching likely boom, no fancy portals = zdoom, and such.  I suppose some vanilla wads are indistinguishable to someone making their first modern level who doesn't feel like using custom textures and the like.

I don't always use portals even though I map for GZDoom. the architecture doesn't actually mean much. read. the. text. file. :)

[Scotty]

Couple of recommendations (remember you can scale down monster counts even further by lowering the difficulty, there is no shame in it):

 

Avactor (Boom; definitely try this on HNTR difficulty)

Back to Basics (vanilla)

Suspended in Dusk (vanilla)

Verdant Citadel (UDMF)

[Horus]

5 minutes ago, deflatedhissy said:

 

What are some clear indicators that a game is for a certain port?  E.g no crouching likely boom, no fancy portals = zdoom, and such.  I suppose some vanilla wads are indistinguishable to someone making their first modern level who doesn't feel like using custom textures and the like.

 

There is a 'Tested with' line about half way down the text file that tells you this information. Likewise, many WADs that are Boom/UDMF also have an 'advanced engine needed' at the very top of the text file. So it really takes 2 seconds to do, and is the quickest method of finding the information that you are looking for.

 

e.g. for my latest map, I put the following in the text file

===========================================================================
Advanced engine needed  : prBoom+, GZDoom, ZDoom or Eternity

===========================================================================
Tested With             : prBoom+ 2.5.1.5, GZDoom 4.4.2, Eternity 4.02, ZDoom
                          2.8.1

[deflatedhissy]

38 minutes ago, Major Arlene said:

don't be lazy, read the text file. it's somewhere around the middle.

 

I just thought the concept of judging wads by their gameplay was interesting and am curious about how often you'd be wrong.

[SilverMiner]

57 minutes ago, deflatedhissy said:

 

Trying Evil Egypt.  Is there any near-foolproof, easy way of telling what port a wad is made for, just by gameplay?  Or by command console?  I always like to know if it's boom, vanilla or zdoom, but not badly enough to read the text file.

Limit removing

EDIT:

No fancy line actions is somewhat proof

[NiGHTMARE]

There isn't really any general gameplay indicator. I've seen wads that are ZDoom-only but have disabled jumping and crouching.

[Obsidian]

54 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Suspended in Dusk (vanilla)

 

Seconding Suspended in Dusk, the architecture is quite excellent (and made even more so by the fact that it's vanilla-compatible). Back To Basics is similar, but a tad more...brown, which may not be to your liking.

[magicsofa]

1 hour ago, deflatedhissy said:

 

I just thought the concept of judging wads by their gameplay was interesting and am curious about how often you'd be wrong.

 

You would always be wrong. Firing up a wad in a random port in order to guess which port it is supposed to run in... is wrong. If you had the wrong port, it might even still run, just without certain features, which may not be apparent right from the start, and you may not even notice through the entire playthrough because you didn't know that line was supposed to be transparent or that those "bloody mess 2" actors were supposed to be a new monster. Also, there are many crossover features which means that finding a feature in one port does not exclude others. If for some strange reason you didn't have the text file, you could open up the mod with editing tools to try and discern which port it's intended for. But again, there's frequent overlap that would confuse your deduction process. For example, a vanilla-compatible wad could still include a DECORATE lump (if only for mapper convenience), making you think it's not vanilla-compatible.

Long story short, guessing ports is fruitless, and will most likely lead to experiences where you are playing through a wad not realizing that it's only half-working, until some game breaking point where you realize you've been in the wrong port the whole time.

[KevvyLava]

2 hours ago, Deadwing said:

Deathless might be are you are looking for

Also, 25 Years on Earth

 

Just started Deathless.....to me, this is the essence of Doom. Not endless trap rooms with 45 Revenants. Really a big fan of the first episode so far.

[Deadwing]

19 minutes ago, KevvyLava said:

 

Just started Deathless.....to me, this is the essence of Doom. Not endless trap rooms with 45 Revenants. Really a big fan of the first episode so far.

 

I used to think the same, but nowadays I like both haha (as long as maps aren't too big)

[HavoX]

This reminds me of a certain Quake level set that had no monsters, but relied on difficult puzzle elements instead.  No thanks.

[Bauul]

I'd also point out that lower difficulty levels have fewer enemies. If you want to enjoy a mapset without being overwhelmed with enemies, slap on ITYTD and enjoy the stroll. 

[deflatedhissy]

What's the name of that map that combines every doom 2 map into the one level?

[P41R47]

Most modern wads are made for veteran players, being ''Hey, Not Too Rough'' the Ultra Violence of wads from old times.

But to solve that, you can play on ''I'm too young to die'', it will be quite difficult still, but you will have x2 ammo pickups, and halve the damage done to you.

It would be cool that more modern wads embrace a proper difficulty for new or casual players, at least on ''Hey, not too Rough''. That way most of the population will have a chance to beat it, and not be secluded of enjoying it because they don't have the needed skill to play it.

If what you are seeking is an experience more in line with the IWADs, the obvious asnwer is the Doom The Way Id Did serie, with releases for Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 respectivelly. Both greatly enjoyable and both challenging on the hardest difficulty.

 

Another good one is Doom: Damnation for Ultimate Doom.

It offers a more atmospheric and moody approach to the gameplay, but still offers a good challenge for average players.

If you want something with a different look from the IWADs but still remain moderatelly challenging, then Back to Saturn X Ep.1 on Hey not too rough will be good. IT is still on a mid point between Doom 2 UV and Plutonia HMP, but it is greatly enjoyable, too.

 

You need to know that playing UV its not ''how doom must be played''.
Most mapsets are designed to offer a good challenge on whatever difficulty you choose, albeit, some more difficult than others.

So, since you play on your own with nobody looking, don't be shy to try to play on lower difficulties.

Thats what locks a lot of new players away from enjoying most modern mapsets.

 

 

[Pistoolkip]

Though not 'empty' by any means, I find that Auger Zenith has a good balance of exploration and monsters

[Shepardus]

3 hours ago, deflatedhissy said:

What's the name of that map that combines every doom 2 map into the one level?

Memorial.wad

 

Try Doom 64 for Doom II (worth playing even if you've already played Doom 64 IMO).

 

[TheMagicMushroomMan]

I wouldn't really call any of the iwads "relatively empty". Many WADs can be scaled down in terms of enemy count by choosing a lower difficulty level. Try any of the DBP WADs on HNTR/HMP, or even BTSX.

Edited August 5, 2021 by TheMagicMushroomMan

[kalensar]

UAC Vinur Prime Redux. It is a extremely large map. It has slaughter sections but is not on the whole slaughter style at all. Extremely pretty and well thought out single map for GZDoom. I only play on GZDoom so thats where these can run the best at.

 

https://www.moddb.com/games/doom-ii/addons/uac-vinur-prime-research-base-redux

 

FireTop Mountain. Another awesome Single map that is pretty and well thought out.

 

https://www.moddb.com/games/doom-ii/addons/firetop-mountain-for-gzdoom

 

Foursite! This map is billed as the largest single Doom 2 map ever made. Its massive and super fun.

 

https://www.moddb.com/games/doom-ii/addons/foursite-4-in-1-map

 

Here is HellBound, my all time fave Megawad.

 

https://www.moddb.com/mods/hellbound/downloads/hellbound

 

And last, Ascent on Titan found here on Doom World. I cannot praise this mapset high enough, 2nd only to HellBound.

 

https://www.moddb.com/mods/hellbound/downloads/hellbound

 

 

And Don't overlook Freedoom Phase 1 or Phase 2. Both are close to exactly what you are looking for. If you don't like the Freedoom art style you can use the Beautiful Doom mod to make it look like you are playing normal Doom style instead. Smooth Doom doesn't work that well with Freedoom due to missing animation frames.

Edited August 5, 2021 by kalensar : adding on extra thoughts.

[dmdr]

DBP11s first few maps are very relaxing -- not many monsters and a nice garden theme. It gets more intense later on but certainly not to Sunlust's level

 

https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/levels/doom2/Ports/d-f/dbp11

[galileo31dos01]

TVR's megawad "Revolution!", from exactly two decades ago, so while not modern it's got a difficulty on par with doom 2 with not many monsters.

 

Another actually somewhat fresh wad like doom 2 is called "KINDa", a quick search on idgames is all you need to get it for free.

 

Just keep in mind what everyone here says regarding skill settings and have fun!

[TheNoob_Gamer]

This is a gameplay mod that is specifically made for travelling around empty levels. I suggest you checking that out.

https://jp.itch.io/doom-tourism

 

Quote

This mod, for GZDoom 3.0 or later, changes that behavior: monsters still spawn, but they're invisible, silent, and will automatically be killed as soon as they engage you. Situations like the above will function as intended.

This mod also adds some features that let you customize your exploration experience: you can toggle player invulnerability, dim out items or get rid of them entirely, and change how the item collection percentage is tallied during intermission. See the included readme for details.

 

[m8f]

Shameless self-promotion. In case you play with GZDoom, this mod can automatically reduce monster population: 10.5x.

[deflatedhissy]

12 hours ago, m8f said:

Shameless self-promotion. In case you play with GZDoom, this mod can automatically reduce monster population: 10.5x.

 

Interesting, I asked about this a couple of years ago and was told it was impossible to do!  Does it have the potential to break a level?

Edited August 7, 2021 by deflatedhissy

[m8f]

It shouldn't. 10.5x works by killing enemies when they are alerted, so natural map progress is preserved. A level may break only if it contains complicated scripts, like, if it requires monsters to be killed in a specific place.