[Boom] Grotto of the Scorned - Big non linear level for Doom II

[Valhen]

Hey everyone,

After months of work, I'm finally publishing a new level. It's a non linear Boom compatible map for Doom II. Tested with PRBoom+ 2.5.1.4 , DSDA-Doom (both on -complevel 9), ZDoom, Zandronum and GZDoom 4.6. Expect the difficulty to be on par with something like Plutonia. Recommended skill level is Hurt Me Plenty.

 

Here's some Screenshots:

 

Download link:

Version 2:

gotsv2.zip

 

Version 1:

gots.zip

 

NOTE FOR ZDOOM/ZANDRONUM/GZDOOM PLAYERS: There's an error in this map where if you play it with the compatibility settings set to "Boom (strict)", any action that's activated by scripts using conveyor belts break and activate immediatly when the map starts, possibly softlocking the player. To avoid this, please set the compatibility settings instead to "Boom" only or "Default". I also recommend playing using the Software renderer instead of Hardware (especially on Zandronum), since playing on Hardware can cause lag on some of the bigger fights.

 

Mods that alter enemies might also break the custom Dark Imps enemies.

 

Credits:

- CWILV00 lump created with Doom Writer
- Green Key from "Various Doom Keys" (Realm667 link) by Disguise, Blue Shadow, MagicWazard
- Palette and Colormap from 32in24-15tex
- Textures from 32in24-15, Jimmytex (sewage flats and blue rock flats), Greenwartex (exit sign textures)
- Sprites from Skulltag
- Music ("Simple Solutions") from Strain, composed by Mark Klem
- Decorate created with 3saster's Dehacked-to-Decorate converter

 

Special thanks to:
- FrancisT218, Jimmy and Peccatum Mihzamiz for playtesting
- The Joy of Mapping + The Hellforge Discord servers for additional help and support :)

Edited August 22, 2021 by Valhen

[Doomkid]

Looks really nice, great scenes in those screenshots!

[azerty]

Fun map! I will play this in multiple parts(idk how much yet). I really like what I have seen so far. I just got one thing to say and that is that there are a bit to much surprises so far which makes the surprises to come a bit predictable. I hope it's helpful and I will play the rest as soon as possible.

 

[TheNoob_Gamer]

Wow, this map was absolutely stunning! While the basic progression is just "get all 3 keys and exit", the approach to it is so good and sprawling I never got bored. The multiple weapon spawns (SSG, Rocket Launcher, Plasma Rifle) give relative freedom to which route you are going to approach, this I found really nice.

The routes also appear to represent multiple styles: green route is very open-ended in layout (and green); blue is a bit cramped and claustrophobic (and wet) and red seems to be a mix of both (and bloody). Again, this gives you multiple ways to tackle the map - although a way to indicate each routes' styles would have been nice.

Visuals are really well-done and usually thematically relevant to each section of the map: some examples include marble + blood + flesh; deprecated yard with vine-filled ceiling bars (that later got flooded) - no areas feel oversized nor underdetailed, which is very impressive considering the scale and progression.

As for gameplay/progression - it's indeed tough, and I have my ass handed to me many, many times (shown in the gameplay video below). Very fun encounter designs (though the last battle was a bit too hardcore for my tastes, so I did a classic trick :P) that feel fair. Progression can be made clearer at certain spots though, which I'll dive deeper into my comments - it should be noted I had to resort to cheating to get where to go next:

• The lift at 38:10 (or the lift in the fully unlocked starting room of the red key portion) is a bit too obscured by darkness and vagueness in texture use. I think usage of things like candles, impaled corpses could help here.
• A similar situation also presents in the green key arena (specifically, the part where I pressed the switch, all hell broke loose, Cyberdemon and co. appeared). (1:20:14 for reference). The linedef triggering the switch here is too obscure, especially considering the combat chaos and others might assume the linedef is merely a decoration and could have been there since they first enter the arena. One suggestion is to make a separate switch block entirely that slowly rises as the setpiece progresses.
• Also talking about the green arena (at 1:00:35) about the Archvile. Its placement, alongside with the enemy horde teleporting in makes its role more or less a slightly buffed cannon fodder, as there's a lot of cover around it (and I think the matter of gameplay mod is irrevelant, since plasma gun can easily kill it with good movements, or rocket launcher from afar). Thus, flame boi can instead wait a little bit until later, and preferably somewhere else as a surprise.
• ...Before getting to that sequence though, there's a sort-of indoors (and apparently full of vines) section that you have to pass through (at about 57:30 onwards), with completely sunk platforms that must be raised back up by a switch semi-hidden. I personally found this rather redundant, since the acid doesn't damage you and you might backtrack for loot. Perhaps it can be either removed altogether or make falling into the acid liquid a punishment.
• And the dark room a bit after; the reward for triggering a fake lift. I personally found this room a bit frustrating to beat due to tiny layout that may require memorization and too dark, and combined with the rocket skeleton + flame boi combo; this give player very little room to improvise nor finding the exit. I don't really know how to fix up this particular part, but perhaps a tweak in lighting, candles with gradient lighting, or just enemy changes/clearer switch indicators in general would help wonders.
• The Dark Imp featured in this mod, I found is the only thing that comes close to a "criticism" in this map - a bit too tanky, looks boring and is basically a mini Cacodemon without sweet holes. However, that aside, this Imp (along with the apparent pistol change?) can easily break mod compatibility (the video is my 3rd run now lol, after having noticed visual artifacts and super bizarre gameplay oddities), specifically enemies mod - you might want to edit in an additional note in your OP. The pistol change doesn't seem too concerning myself, so there's that.
• (Nitpick?) The final Cyberdemon fight may need some fixing - you have little room for dodging and there are enemies attacking you from all sides. Unless I've missed something (which is highly likely), a non-secret BFG can be added as a room-clearer. My apologies for cheesing that part, my brain literally melt down by that point, after relentless slaughtering I decided it was best to break up the pace a bit :P
• The blue room key seems like a test of trial-and-error, which I felt like was another major weak point of the map. Any particular strategies to beat it?

That's all I can think of, great map! I played this on UV (which slowly turned out to be a big mistake lol), but nonetheless really enjoyed it. Just need a couple of fixing gameplay-wise.

 

 

Edited August 17, 2021 by TheNoob_Gamer

[Dusty_Rhodes]

Gorgeous screenshots and a concise write up. Really wish my PC wasn't broken because this looks sick. 

[Valhen]

@TheNoob_Gamer Thanks for playing! About the comments:

 

8 hours ago, TheNoob_Gamer said:

The lift at 38:10 (or the lift in the fully unlocked starting room of the red key portion) is a bit too obscured by darkness and vagueness in texture use. I think usage of things like candles, impaled corpses could help here.

...

A similar situation also presents in the green key arena (specifically, the part where I pressed the switch, all hell broke loose, Cyberdemon and co. appeared). (1:20:14 for reference). The linedef triggering the switch here is too obscure, especially considering the combat chaos and others might assume the linedef is merely a decoration and could have been there since they first enter the arena. One suggestion is to make a separate switch block entirely that slowly rises as the setpiece progresses.

I'll try to fix this when I publish a new version of the map soon-ish :)

8 hours ago, TheNoob_Gamer said:

...Before getting to that sequence though, there's a sort-of indoors (and apparently full of vines) section that you have to pass through (at about 57:30 onwards), with completely sunk platforms that must be raised back up by a switch semi-hidden. I personally found this rather redundant, since the acid doesn't damage you and you might backtrack for loot. Perhaps it can be either removed altogether or make falling into the acid liquid a punishment.

That switch was actually used for an earlier version of the revs + zombies ambush in the room, where it served more of a purpose there. I just never bothered to remove it so now it's there being useless. I'll probably delete it :P

8 hours ago, TheNoob_Gamer said:

The blue room key seems like a test of trial-and-error, which I felt like was another major weak point of the map. Any particular strategies to beat it?

My main strat was to ignore the Cyberdemon and try to kill the imps and then the revs with the rocket launcher as quickly as possible. Then, when the second wave of revs shows up, I quickly try to kill the most revs I can from both sides before they can get out of their closet. Most of the time I end up alive :)

Edited August 17, 2021 by Valhen

[DevilMyEyes]

"Grotto of the Scorned" is the edgiest but coolest map names i've ever seen.

[pavera]

THIS LOOKS GOOD

[Valhen]

Quick update: Altered a few encounters and made some of the progress more clear based on feedback. New download in the main thread :)

[Bobby :D]

Some of the enemy placement was good, some wasn't the most amazing, and once it was annoying (blue key fight). That fight is incredibly different from every other fight in terms of strategy, requiring the player to play in the most boring way possible and hide in a corner to avoid getting obliterated by a damage roll. Otherwise, not bad! This wad was solid, and although I think in terms of detailing the direction could be towards more texture nuance than subtle and cheeky micro adjustments and details, it was a solid and mostly consistent visual romp. The progression reminded me of a less cool Warp of Time (no offense, not much is as cool as that map!), but alot more fair for a blind player due to the thing placement. I hope that you have a good one and I can't wait to see what you offer next.

[Clippy]

Hey buddy - I made it as far as I could .... not very far

 

From what I did play it was pretty cool - diving deep into caves and beautiful waterfalls and scenery.

 

Things were tough all over but I tried my best .. then the blue key room happened....

 

The first wave or rev/imps wasn't too bad but that second wave of revs on both sides with a cyber in the middle and no cover in such a cramped room.

 

I mean I tried but I felt like that requires luck more than anything else .. luck I didn't seem to have.

 

I did have two hours free to play it but since I got stuck here I can't even imagine what struggles were next.

 

Hope what video I can share is useful even tho it probably isn't

 

You def turned up the scope and torment to 11 from the other maps I played of yours: Infested Base & Station of the Doomed

 

Video is processing but I must go on an adventure!

 

 

[Clippy]

You already seen this but I'll share here as well

 

I still think that blue keyfight is bogus but the rest of the map was actually fantastic. I didn't realize I could approach it differently so I'm glad we had a chat and by taking the blue key last made for a much better experience

 

This map is 95% awesome bud. 

 

I had to cheat at the end because yes I did have dynamic lights on and stuff to make my videos look cool and didn't realize

 

I don't even know what the real solution was to the ending haha 

 

Anyway the exploration and look and feel of this map and the architecture and stuff was all top notch

 

 

 

[EmoLevelDesigner]

Non-linear map with a variety of environments and impressive scare at the beginning.

Depressing environments in style of Plutonia Experiment; marble hellish buildings with partially disassembled walls; caverns with plenty of waterfalls, all connected with impressive hub carved in a rock. Usage of shadows increases visual detail and aids the mood. Each place you're going to visit has a lot of colour of the key you have to find.

Non-linearity does a good job in adding incentive to keep playing. If you die at one place, you can visit a different one and then return better equipped. Places are different enough to add motivation to see everything as when the environment starts to feel getting old, you find something new at the right moment.

 

Good use of game mechanics and new textures to decorate and change the environments. Whole parts of the floor get under water, vines hang from the ceiling to reinforce the feel of wet environment. Passages open and close when least expected. These, in additional of occasional need to jump, take the most out of the layout.

Bug: got stuck at 12:00

Glowing crack on the floor at 20:40 reminds of John Romero's Sigil.

Disassembled walls are going as far as pile of small bricks at 1:26:08, which is a nice touch. If there's a way to make details that small, why not use it?

1:35:00 - making the walls flash when the player approaches them is a great touch.

Throughout the variety of places, feeling of coherence, a harmonious part of bigger environment, not just some random locations glued together is retained thanks to common arhitectural elements such as arches and curved walls.

The battles should be approached more like a puzzle game than an action game, with a lot of trial and error required before you figure out the solution, and even actually pulling the solution off might require some luck. Especially the crowd of revenants that guards the blue key (have to say: blue lighting does a great job of adding unique character to that place). The author warns that the map is long, but if you're going to play it, you have to be prepared: it's long because you're going to die and retry a lot.

It is very well balanced for this kind of puzzle gameplay. Nothing stands on your way of solving it. Persistence gets rewarded. You will never run out of health and ammo, so you can focus on going forward and not searching every nook and cranny of areas you've already visited.

 

Speaking of rewarding persistence, if you're patient enough to reach the end, you'll be stunned by otherworldly environment in style Amid Evil's last levels. Impressive and unexpected use of Doom engine, and a great way to end the map.

 

 

[LVENdead]

Just wanted to pop in and say I played through this earlier today. This map is a lot of fun; it's action packed the whole way through, and never feels like a slog despite its higher monster count. As with your previous maps, I love how frequently the map transforms and loops back on itself, often recycling/recontextualizing old arenas in an "escalating" fashion. The styling of this map is great and a lot different than your previous techbase themed maps. The detailed natural look mixed with "hell fortress" and the consistent use of liquids is great.  I love how each area emphasizes the color of the key you're hunting to give each one its own theme without violating any kind of overall consistency. 

 

I liked most of the encounters as well. I think my favorite path was for the green key with just how open it was and how the main arena gets reused multiple times with new mixes of monsters. I ran through the blue path first which was probably the hardest one, and of course the blue key fight is a LITTLE bogus but not undoable if you take some risks; but I think maybe ONE weakness of this hub and spoke type of design is that it kind of gets easier as you progress through the level, since each path seems to be balanced from possibly being approached from pistol start. 

 

The final area - I love the spectacle of it, but I think it really lets the finale down. I played what seems to be a different version than the recordings posted, and I'm not really sure how you're supposed to survive with revenant homing rockets, cyberdemon rockets, baron projectiles, and like 30 dark imp projectiles at any given moment in such a small space. I ended up just turning on god mode and finishing it up b/c it didn't seem like a fair or fun challenge. I'm assuming you tested it and it's doable in some way, but I didn't have the patience to dissect the proper way to do it. 

 

Overall I really enjoyed it and walked away with only a few minor nitpicks. It's a shame you didn't get more of a response to this when you released it, because this is an enjoyable map I think most Doom players will enjoy.

 

 

[galileo31dos01]

Hello, I just played your map, prboom+ UV because of the comparison with plutonia said in the OP. 

 

A very neat and pretty challenging map, offering a wide range of set piece combat ideas and lots of little visual eye candies, plus one of the best STRAIN midis imo. Some of the stuff in here wouldn't feel out of place in sunlust and combat shock -early- levels of violence (or alien vendetta on an architectural/detailing side), with a demand in movement-reaction that escalates quite quickly, specially in the key-centric spots, surpassing plutonia without a doubt, which means it probably isn't the most accurate comparison difficulty wise, but I still liked that unexpected brutality.

 

Of all the fights, my favourites include the BK cramped setup, the whole GK section repopulating more than once, and the finale for its ceremonial buildup. I also liked most of the smaller traps, the way you transformed areas for second rounds, like the bloody room with revs and dark imps - these generally can be sort of predicted when it's a switch or a weapon grab that usually marks a change is going to happen somewhere, but often times it can be a lift-alike platform that instead releases a trap in your back - subverting that predictability in fun ways.  

 

Anyways, here's my brief list of assorted things I'd like to point out:

 

Spoiler

 

- Careful with berserk packs in the middle of fight-centric areas - if it's not needed for anything, it becomes an obstacle you want to avoid, lest you end up auto-switching in an inconvenient moment, e.g. the one in the roofless rectangular room in the blue wing, since you're afforded a soulsphere as well.

 

- There is a particular detail in the BK setup that might need attention: a reliable strategy to kill the revs in the next phase is to hang in the corners next to the cyb and pump rockets to the visible ones, switching corners to clear half of both sides, then finnish stuff with PR and it's basically done, but during RL use it's possible to blow yourself on a brick if you're in a bad angle (unlikely perhaps, I tried not to glue myself to the corner so it didn't happen to me, though it's a concern since it's a risk from detailing). All I'm saying is, careful with such things :P

 

- There's a weird visual glitch going on here, either software or opengl display it from many angles.

 

- Teleporting monsters (imps/revs/darks) in the bloody room happening at a slow pace isn't "good awkward", with gaps of nothing spawning in between for a few seconds, even after the floor raised to the top. This made RL an instant no-no, because I almost blew myself when a zombie appeared out of nowhere. Since there's enough ammo to SSG/CG for a while, you can hold onto using rockets until it's safe, so it doesn't urge tweaking, but I think it'd still be better if things came into quicker to not discourage RL, unless you did wanted slow teleportations...

 

- A few things teleport by grabbing the first CG in the red wing. Because I already got one in another wing, I didn't go for that CG at first but until much later, so only then those monsters spawned in. I would suggest, in a case like this, to have the CG-only monsters spawn simultaneously with the other stuff if you already explored another wing before. Minor thing though...

 

- I do want to add, I had no effing idea where you hid any of the secrets, not with all the effort and wall-humping of the world was enough to find a single one, which felt concerning (the green wing megasphere on a metal pillar didn't even count as one, though that's totally fine!). I wholeheartedly support well hidden secrets, official or unofficial, but after taking a look at the editor, I'm not sure what to think - some of these, like the mega behind a slimefall behind thin metal trims that don't look at all that they're midtex, or the one requiring to spot a very slightly brighter piece of bloodfall, or even the ultra-hyper-mega hidden switch in the same secret, are a little too cryptic imo for a map where the majority of the content is straightforward and/or in sight. The berserk in the blue wing is as far as I get, that one doesn't feel ridiculous, but then there's the mega behind the cyb needing two miniature switches in different but barely notable spots. The one behind a lost souls closet has no texture differences.... so I don't know, they stick like a sore thumb to me, but there's no rule that says how secrets must be done so, maybe it's personal judgement...

 

 

Some people have commented about the final fight being on the unfair side. Here's what I did, if it's of any help:

 

Spoiler

When the cyberdemon spawned, I immediately started shooting plasma in the usual zigzag pattern. Then, when the rest of the crowd arose, I changed to moving moderately slow in a circular shape while never losing sight of the cyb, since now dodging direct rockets was less of a cakewalk. Once he vanished, I kept moving in the same pattern and speed while rocketing revs, later the imps - this way I never got hit by fireballs. That's pretty much it, even when there're fewer imps left you can switch to the barons. 

 

Note that this went with the flow, so it wasn't planned or anything. There could be other ways too, but the slow movement in circles seemed to be the key to avoid too many hits at once. It'd be easier to show in a demo but I can't be arsed right now :x

 

[kalensar]

This was a good deal harder than Plutonia on HMP. I aint gonna knock it because there is some spectacular work going on here. The only thing I can advise slow those cacoballs down by a lot. Those balls are moving Fast speed while everything else is normal speed and thats a bad thing in a map that is harder than traditional slaughter maps; aka this is a tactical style map rather than mowing down hordes with a lawnmower approach and almost zero opportunity to cause infighting. This map is a rough customer..