Let's discuss the term boomer shooters....

[dew]

Come to think of it... the term is also false advertising. Maybe except Redneck Rampage.

[ketmar]

i like to be called old! grandpa always knows better, and now i can rightfully say "you kids don't understand XYZ" and never bother to bring any other arguments on the table.

[Nikku4211]

The only real Boomer Shooter to me is TeamTNT's Boom sourceport of Doom for DOS.

[ChopBlock223]

Boomer Shooter was something someone said ironically at some point, and then some sleazy guy in a suit somewhere snapped it up and used it in marketing.

Now this stupid name is used liberally, and I hate it a lot, it brings up mental images of a corporate twitter account trying to be hip, it doesn't help that there's no clear differentiation between the actually old games and these new revival ones when someone says "boomer shooter" because people use it interchangeably.

 

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics. Procedural level generation that is offensively dull, haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics, voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines, unimaginative enemy design, intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

[LadyMistDragon]

1 hour ago, ChopBlock223 said:

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics. Procedural level generation that is offensively dull, haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics, voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines, unimaginative enemy design, intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

 

Shots fired....ooooo

[Mr. Freeze]

2 hours ago, ChopBlock223 said:

 

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics. Procedural level generation that is offensively dull, haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics, voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines, unimaginative enemy design, intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

 

I dont agree 100% but I will always support a strongly voiced opinion on trivial matters. 

[scalliano]

6 hours ago, ChopBlock223 said:

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics. Procedural level generation that is offensively dull, haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics, voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines, unimaginative enemy design, intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

Evidently you haven't played Amid Evil yet.

[Major Arlene]

20 hours ago, scalliano said:

Evidently you haven't played Amid Evil yet.

or Dusk. or....

 

forreal @ChopBlock223 , I'd love to see specific examples of things you've actually played that fit that description, otherwise it's a lot of speculation.

[Mr. Freeze]

18 minutes ago, Major Arlene said:

I'd love to see specific examples of things you've actually played that fit that description, otherwise it's a lot of speculation.

 

From what I can gather:

 

Quote

Procedural level generation that is offensively dull

 

Strafe. 

 

Quote

 haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics

 

Not sure. 

 

Quote

voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines

 

Ultrakill (although I'd disagree here), HROT, Dusk, Ion Maiden. 

 

Quote

unimaginative enemy design

 

Ion Maiden. 

 

Quote

intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

Strafe, Cruelty Squad. 

[Midnight_00]

Stat mechanics might be a reference to Project Warlock or maybe Nightmare Reaper.

[roadworx]

if any of you can think of a catchier name for it then feel free to say it. otherwise, i'mma continue calling them boomer shooters; maybe it's because i'm part of the new generation (gen z) but i see zero problems with it. sure, the name isn't accurate, it's hyperbole. but i don't think it's a big deal tbh

 

On 9/2/2021 at 10:52 AM, ChopBlock223 said:

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

not really? most of the newer games in the genre are indie, not aaa-titles.

[whybmonotacrab]

I don't necessarily think it's a shot at the games and audience of said games being old. It's specifically a shot at the kind of people who look down at everything young people play and unironically say shit like "back in my day games used to be so much better". I feel like Boomer is more of an attitude than an actual age thing. The retro crowd is notoriously negative to any type of fps that isn't their own and super gatekeepy in general so I 100% get the term being applied.

[hybridial]

On 9/2/2021 at 5:52 PM, ChopBlock223 said:

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics. Procedural level generation that is offensively dull, haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics, voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines, unimaginative enemy design, intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

 

It's good to know I am far from the most negative person on the forum these days :P

[Sergeant_Mark_IV]

1 hour ago, Major Arlene said:

I'd love to see specific examples of things you've actually played that fit that description

I remember seeing an interview long ago where the Dusk dude says he made Dusk to look like that because "he missed games with that aesthetic" (despite the fact that 90s games had better models than that).
Basically, all NewBlood games are purposely made to look bad because the devs enjoy this style, and this is what prevents me from getting into them.
Like I played 3 hours of Dusk and 2 hours of Ultrakill and I don't feel like playing them anymore.

[Xcalibur]

On 8/31/2021 at 1:45 PM, [McD]James said:

We've had this discussion at least 5 times here now. Maybe even 6 or 7 times. I'm not exaggerating. The term boomer has evolved to no longer specifically refer to baby boomers, but rather anyone who is perceptibly old and out of touch. This new application of the term is a lot more flexible, even though I'd never facetiously call someone a boomer myself.

 

The term boomer shooter is largely tongue in cheek. It's extremely catchy, and in my opinion; mildly humorous. Referring to older FPS games as "Doom clones" quickly became antiquated, and "retro FPS" just isn't very catchy or punchy sounding in the way boomer shooter is.

 

If you don't like the term, that's fine. I get that. But it isn't going anywhere and its pervasiveness is only going to continue to increase. 

 

Can we please stop having this conversation already?

 

this is true. but it's also yet another example of inter-generational tension.

[Bridgeburner56]

On 9/3/2021 at 4:52 AM, ChopBlock223 said:

Boomer Shooter was something someone said ironically at some point, and then some sleazy guy in a suit somewhere snapped it up and used it in marketing.

Now this stupid name is used liberally, and I hate it a lot, it brings up mental images of a corporate twitter account trying to be hip, it doesn't help that there's no clear differentiation between the actually old games and these new revival ones when someone says "boomer shooter" because people use it interchangeably.

 

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics. Procedural level generation that is offensively dull, haphazardly thrown in stat progression mechanics, voiced characters with boring and generic personalities and lines, unimaginative enemy design, intentionally ugly graphics instead of looking like they were made within limitations, but together with modern filters and post processing effects which clash horribly.

 

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

I think you need to get out more

[Sergeant_Mark_IV]

18 minutes ago, Xcalibur said:

this is true. but it's also yet another example of inter-generational tension.

I don't see this as "tension", it's just a way to classify generations in which games came out. I made this image to explain:

[Xcalibur]

1 hour ago, Sergeant_Mark_IV said:

I don't see this as "tension", it's just a way to classify generations in which games came out. I made this image to explain:

not bad.

in this case it's just classification, but labels like "boomer", "zoomer" etc do in fact refer to a larger conflict between generations. that stupid "ok boomer" meme that used to be around is a prime example of this. I think partly it's because of accelerated social/technological change. it also has to do with issues like the middle east wars, the 2008 crash, etc in which younger generations had to pay for the mistakes of the older folks.

[jazzmaster9]

On 9/3/2021 at 12:52 AM, ChopBlock223 said:

I wouldn't complain as much if the revival games weren't all shallow trash which apes the classics superficially, but fails to nail the gameplay, style and tone, or even the graphics.

Well thank god in reality this isn't the case, and the Boomer Shooters coming out are actually good.

On 9/3/2021 at 12:52 AM, ChopBlock223 said:

It's like classic FPS being gentrified, and I loathe it.

Ohh boy prepare to have an aneurysm with the new releases next year. 

[Jello]

I'm not going to enter a dog in this fight. I would just like to mention that when I visited the forum just now, despite seeing "Let's discuss the term boomer shooters" for the last four days, I briefly read it as "Let's discuss the term boner shooters". And I laughed.

 

That is all.

[Immorpher]

Probably don't need another dissenting opinion on the matter, but hell I can't resist as I don't understand how the NES era relates to the generation which fought WW2 in the chart above.

The term retro is often used to classify classic games, but I do not think that is technically correct. Things that are retro, are products which are intentionally designed with aesthetics of the past. When Doom and Quake were designed, they were designed to be cutting-edge, thus not retro. The term retro FPS applies to games such as Dusk, Amid Evil, and Prodeus which are intentionally taking elements from games of the past, and not necessarily games of the past themselves. In fact the "Retro" category people like using on Twitch for classic games is not a genre, but a specific game called "Retro" which is a compilation of modern takes on arcade classics.

So the category I would put Doom, Quake, and others FPS games in the 90's is "classic FPS" and not "retro FPS". Now classic has the caveat of being good, so perhaps bad old FPS games wouldn't fit into that, and the term "vintage FPS" would be used to categorize them. But I dont like bad FPS games anyway so "classic FPS" works for that era for the games I want to play from then.

Now since, in my mind, "retro FPS" and "classic FPS" are separate categories with distinct eras in my mind with no overlap. The term "boomer shooter" is vague enough to cover both categories in a single genre. Now I admit "boomer" sounds kind of clunky. But I prefer it over terms like "doom clones", "wolfendooms", and "quakendooms", as there were fun FPS games before these games which don't have id influences similar to what Arlene mentioned. Heck it could be argued even later games like Goldeneye, have more influences elsewhere (like rail shooters which it began as), than id FPS games.

TLDR on my viewpoint:
classic FPS: great old FPS games of the 90's such as Doom, Quake, Goldeneye, Turok...
retro FPS: modern games with classic aesthetics such as Dusk, Amid Evil, Prodeus, Wrath...
boomer shooters: a category vague enough to encapsulate both "classic FPS" and "retro FPS" into one
 

[Sergeant_Mark_IV]

23 minutes ago, Immorpher said:

 I don't understand how the NES era relates to the generation which fought WW2 in the chart above.

There are currently 9 videogame generations. Count the generations backwards and compare each one to people's generations.

[BaileyTW]

What if they were Loomer Shooters and you just shot thread at everyone

[Teo Slayer]

8 hours ago, Sergeant_Mark_IV said:

I don't see this as "tension", it's just a way to classify generations in which games came out. I made this image to explain:

The Genesis and SNES on silent? But there was going a war between them

[Sergeant_Mark_IV]

1 hour ago, Teo Slayer said:

The Genesis and SNES on silent? But there was going a war between them

Well, then they were in Korea.

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Those cons with newer fps games are just begging someone to spend a 5-page long post shitting on older games. Those games were never perfect.

[dew]

11 hours ago, Sergeant_Mark_IV said:

There are currently 9 videogame generations. Count the generations backwards and compare each one to people's generations.

Lol this is such an arbitrary bullshit game theory. It completely falls apart when the "10th" gen consoles come out far sooner than a new population cohort even materializes and it completely ignores that FPS was not a console phenomenon at least until Xbox and Halo. Stupid reductionist fantasy.

[Somniac]

I don't like or understand the term. I'm a "millennial" who was playing so-called "boomer shooters" as a kid since the mid 1990s.

 

I also don't like these weird generational identifiers like "boomer" or "milennial" for what it's worth.

[LadyMistDragon]

21 hours ago, roadworx said:

if any of you can think of a catchier name for it then feel free to say it. otherwise, i'mma continue calling them boomer shooters; maybe it's because i'm part of the new generation (gen z) but i see zero problems with it. sure, the name isn't accurate, it's hyperbole. but i don't think it's a big deal tbh

 

 

See this is the problem with kids these days. You don't know what it was like with your boomer shooters, and your e-cigs, and your Cardi B, and your hard seltzer, and your use of the word goat to mean the best, and your godawful music and your shitty streamlined 'role-playing games' and your.....

Edited September 4, 2021 by LadyMistDragon

[Komenja]

I like the term. It rolls off the tongue, it rhymes, and it's an easy way to refer to both actual old school shooters and the newer games inspired by them. Before the term came around on 4chan threads a few years ago, I used to call games like Dusk and Amid Evil the "New wave of old school style shooters" which is rather unwieldy in conversation. But you say "boomer shooters" and everyone, even people less-versed in the genre (which is pretty much all of my real life friends and co-workers), knows what you're talking about. Is it entirely accurate? No. But I don't see a reason to care that much unless someone wants to be pedantic about it.