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Dusty_Rhodes

What are some sleeper wads?

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Glaive - 9 short maps in the style of Scythe. There's also Glaive 2, which I haven't played, but if the first is any indication it should also be fun.

4 Seasons of Doom - Four lengthy maps, one for each season.

Bury My Heart Knee Deep - Sprawling techbase with Metroidvania-style progression.

Donuts - 11 assorted maps by A2Rob, the author of Running Late and Running Late 2 (a Cacoward winner).

Sucker Punch 2 - 9 short maps that pack a punch (heh).

Dark Scythe - A megawad's worth of creative interpretations of its concept. Maps 29 and 30 are a must.

Tetraptykon - 4 modern maps with an old-school slaughter flavor.

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1 minute ago, Shepardus said:

Glaive - 9 short maps in the style of Scythe. There's also Glaive 2, which I haven't played, but if the first is any indication it should also be fun.

4 Seasons of Doom - Four lengthy maps, one for each season.

Bury My Heart Knee Deep - Sprawling techbase with Metroidvania-style progression.

Donuts - 11 assorted maps by A2Rob, the author of Running Late and Running Late 2 (a Cacoward winner).

Sucker Punch 2 - 9 short maps that pack a punch (heh).

Dark Scythe - A megawad's worth of creative interpretations of its concept. Maps 29 and 30 are a must.

Tetraptykon - 4 modern maps with an old-school slaughter flavor.

These all sound cool, but Dark Scythe sounds right up my alley. I'll definitely check these out.

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4 hours ago, Dusty_Rhodes said:

Yeah Zone 400 is great, but fairly well known.

 

No, it was not supposed to be well known. But it ended up been well known hehe.

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1 minute ago, pcorf said:

 

No, it was not supposed to be well known. But it ended up been well known hehe.

Hey man it's good stuff. It and Doom 404 really scratch my Demonfear / Scythe fanboy itch

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24 minutes ago, Dusty_Rhodes said:

These all sound cool, but Dark Scythe sounds right up my alley. I'll definitely check these out.

Erick Alm had one big obsession, and he tried like 48 times to make the map he thought was perfect, but simple at the same time, dead simple.
Problem is that he never realice that he needed another mapper to made it right.

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1 hour ago, Dusty_Rhodes said:

Ooooh I love Marathon. Those Aleph One guys are awesome.

Yeah, but it can be so easy to get lost in those levels and die in frustrating manners. It has not aged as well as Doom! :S

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8 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

Yeah, but it can be so easy to get lost in those levels and die in frustrating manners. It has not aged as well as Doom! :S

Very, very true. The art style, gameplay, and narrative aged very well, but a lot of the level design did not. So I definitely agree. :D

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Apologies as this pick does not fit the criteria but I am surprised at how little love or attention Struggle seems to get. It was just great FUN to play for me, but seems to get overlooked in most best/worst/underrated/overrated/difficulty/demo etc related threads. If you can say such a thing, I'd suggest it's become a bit of a sleeper despite winning awards.

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Struggle is indeed fantastic and at least as good as the big boys like AA, Valiant, BTSX, etc.

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11 hours ago, P41R47 said:

oh, please, i didn't called it a joke wad.

i called it a SERIOUS joke wad.
I made a thread explaining the difference between the joke wads and the serious joke wad, for short, the later actually have good design and offer quite a challenge, but are silly in nature, pretty much for the laughs of it, or just as a political idiological rant/joke, kinda like Mars War and Doom 2 In Spain Only.

 

I wasn't actually mad :P. I'm mostly stoked that people played and enjoyed it!

 

If anyone is looking to play it themselves after reading this thread (Link below) map 03 and map 16 are particularly great ;)

 

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5 hours ago, Steveb1000 said:

Apologies as this pick does not fit the criteria but I am surprised at how little love or attention Struggle seems to get. It was just great FUN to play for me, but seems to get overlooked in most best/worst/underrated/overrated/difficulty/demo etc related threads. If you can say such a thing, I'd suggest it's become a bit of a sleeper despite winning awards.

I have heard of that one, but like with STRAIN, I do not like the DeHackEd modifications of the weapons and monsters.

 

I wish there could be a vanilla-friendly version of it, like Valiant: Vaccinated Edition.

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I always go back to BioWar. It shows its age in places but damn is it one epic quest as a total package. 

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Was JPCP (Japanese Community Project) mentioned here? If not, then play that megawad soon. Exomoon and 2002: ADO are also great.

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3 hours ago, Rudolph said:

I have heard of that one, but like with STRAIN, I do not like the DeHackEd modifications of the weapons and monsters.

 

I wish there could be a vanilla-friendly version of it, like Valiant: Vaccinated Edition.

Ah, I love the dehacked stuff in STRAIN. I'm actually not in love with the maps though lol.

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2 hours ago, Megalyth said:

I always go back to BioWar. It shows its age in places but damn is it one epic quest as a total package. 

 

2 hours ago, M1911Biatch said:

First ever WAD I played was Dark Universe, made me strategize and hunt for secrets all the time.

I have never heard of either of these, so that might be interesting.

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8 hours ago, Steveb1000 said:

Apologies as this pick does not fit the criteria but I am surprised at how little love or attention Struggle seems to get. It was just great FUN to play for me, but seems to get overlooked in most best/worst/underrated/overrated/difficulty/demo etc related threads. If you can say such a thing, I'd suggest it's become a bit of a sleeper despite winning awards.

well, Antares won another cacoward last year with Antaresian Reliquary, that is excellent without doubt, but i vastly prefer Struggle over it, mostly as its not a recollection of different community maps into one package.
So i don't think at all that Struggle is a sleeper one.
Its surelly up there with Valiant, Eviternity and all the most known mapsets of all the time.

 

1 minute ago, Dusty_Rhodes said:

Ah, I love the dehacked stuff in STRAIN. I'm actually not in love with the maps though lol.

Have you played Return to Daro?
It uses STRAIN resources and dehacked patch but offer a good number of new maps.
Made by Ryath, obviously.

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5 minutes ago, P41R47 said:

well, Antares won another cacoward last year with Antaresian Reliquary, that is excellent without doubt, but i vastly prefer Struggle over it, mostly as its not a recollection of different community maps into one package.
So i don't think at all that Struggle is a sleeper one.
Its surelly up there with Valiant, Eviternity and all the most known mapsets of all the time.

 

Have you played Return to Daro?
It uses STRAIN resources and dehacked patch but offer a good number of new maps.
Made by Ryath, obviously.

I have not, I'll have to play that. I never thought about using STRAIN.deh to make a new map set, but I should.

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18 hours ago, Rudolph said:

I see. Well, so far, this does not seem like it is the case in Vile Flesh, but again, I am only 12 maps in. 

 

Maybe Back to Saturn X was not the best comparison, as the maps are nowhere near as vast and detailed, but, save for maybe one map or two, I am having no difficulty finding my way around. Granted, I have played through the Marathon Trilogy, but I also struggle with No End In Sight's third episode and Doom II Reloaded's infamous MAP32, so I do not know...

One of these days, I want to finish Marathon:Infinity but it's the weakest game in the series, and its lack of music really started finding motivation difficult

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Just now, LadyMistDragon said:

One of these days, I want to finish Marathon:Infinity but it's the weakest game in the series, and its lack of music really started finding motivation difficult

I quite like Marathon Infinity, but no music is lame. My favorite is actually the first one, despite the occasional obtuse design.

 

The new weapon and big enemy sandbox are what make Infinity fun for me.

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12 hours ago, Steveb1000 said:

Apologies as this pick does not fit the criteria but I am surprised at how little love or attention Struggle seems to get. It was just great FUN to play for me, but seems to get overlooked in most best/worst/underrated/overrated/difficulty/demo etc related threads. If you can say such a thing, I'd suggest it's become a bit of a sleeper despite winning awards.

Yeah, Struggle - Antaresian Legacy is very good. But I struggle (heh) to call it a sleeper WAD. It is a cacoward winner and currently sits at 20th place at Doomworld Community Top WADs of All Time (current), higher than SIGIL, Japanese Community Project, Vanguard and Lunatic.

 

For my choice of a sleeper WAD, I'd like to second "180 Minutes Pour Vivre". This megawad has:

- An amazing difficulty curve. The difficulty goes all the way up from "easy like Doom 2" to "Fight through archvile-infested castle and challenge 3 cyberdemons at once" and beyond. But the increase in difficulty is pretty smooth, so there is no "compared to the previous map, the new one feels almost unfair" feeling.

- Two cool new monsters, which greatly complement Doom 2 bestiary, and have clear strengths and weaknesses. Those new monsters get introduced relatively early, but do not outstay their welcome. In fact, some of the more challenging maps have no new monsters in the key fights.

- Lots of super-diverse maps, in both theme and gameplay. For example, the WAD has: a gold mine adventure, a pistol-and-rocket-launcher carnage map; a map which at first feels like a TNT:Evilution map, but ends with a Ribbiks-inspired combat puzzle; a map which plays completely differently depending on difficulty setting, and many other amazing things.

- A lot of moments reminiscent of classic PWADS.

- On top of all that, most of the maps can be completed rather quickly, but do not feel too short. 

Overall, "180 Minutes Pour Vivre" is amazing, and likely has at least one fun map for any doom fan. But sadly the megawad is rarely mentioned on Doomworld, despite being a runner up at the 2020 cacowards.

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4 hours ago, LadyMistDragon said:

One of these days, I want to finish Marathon:Infinity but it's the weakest game in the series, and its lack of music really started finding motivation difficult

Infinity's first half is rough, but let us not forget that Durandal's final map is horribly designed: on harder difficulty settings, you have little choice but rush to the exit terminal, frantically skip the story text and hope you get teleported before you die.

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13 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

Infinity's first half is rough, but let us not forget that Durandal's final map is horribly designed: on harder difficulty settings, you have little choice but rush to the exit terminal, frantically skip the story text and hope you get teleported before you die.

Oh yes, I've seen people handle the ridiculousness of that last room, but being that you can't save everywhere, i had NO interest in finding out, it's hard enough as it is to clear a path to the last terminal.

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56 minutes ago, LadyMistDragon said:

Oh yes, I've seen people handle the ridiculousness of that last room, but being that you can't save everywhere, i had NO interest in finding out, it's hard enough as it is to clear a path to the last terminal.

 

1 hour ago, Rudolph said:

Infinity's first half is rough, but let us not forget that Durandal's final map is horribly designed: on harder difficulty settings, you have little choice but rush to the exit terminal, frantically skip the story text and hope you get teleported before you die.

THAT is why I play on Major Damage, and NOT on Total Carnage.

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5 minutes ago, Dusty_Rhodes said:

 

THAT is why I play on Major Damage, and NOT on Total Carnage.

I just played on Normal, because that game gets really aggravating otherwise.

 

2 hours ago, Azure_Horror said:

 

- Lots of super-diverse maps, in both theme and gameplay. For example, the WAD has: a gold mine adventure, a pistol-and-rocket-launcher carnage map; a map which at first feels like a TNT:Evilution map, but ends with a Ribbiks-inspired combat puzzle; a map which plays completely differently depending on difficulty setting, and many other amazing things.

 

Is that combat puzzle from Map 17? I can't think of too many maps that start out TNT-esque that end anything like that.

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On 9/12/2021 at 4:36 PM, P41R47 said:

 

Lots of maps 

 

Duly noted. While I've played a lot of them, I lose track of my maps easily, so I'll use your list to check I dont miss something good. 

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2 hours ago, Azure_Horror said:

Yeah, Struggle - Antaresian Legacy is very good. But I struggle (heh) to call it a sleeper WAD. It is a cacoward winner and currently sits at 20th place at Doomworld Community Top WADs of All Time (current), higher than SIGIL, Japanese Community Project, Vanguard and Lunatic.

 

For my choice of a sleeper WAD, I'd like to second "180 Minutes Pour Vivre". This megawad has:

- An amazing difficulty curve. The difficulty goes all the way up from "easy like Doom 2" to "Fight through archvile-infested castle and challenge 3 cyberdemons at once" and beyond. But the increase in difficulty is pretty smooth, so there is no "compared to the previous map, the new one feels almost unfair" feeling.

- Two cool new monsters, which greatly complement Doom 2 bestiary, and have clear strengths and weaknesses. Those new monsters get introduced relatively early, but do not outstay their welcome. In fact, some of the more challenging maps have no new monsters in the key fights.

- Lots of super-diverse maps, in both theme and gameplay. For example, the WAD has: a gold mine adventure, a pistol-and-rocket-launcher carnage map; a map which at first feels like a TNT:Evilution map, but ends with a Ribbiks-inspired combat puzzle; a map which plays completely differently depending on difficulty setting, and many other amazing things.

- A lot of moments reminiscent of classic PWADS.

- On top of all that, most of the maps can be completed rather quickly, but do not feel too short. 

Overall, "180 Minutes Pour Vivre" is amazing, and likely has at least one fun map for any doom fan. But sadly the megawad is rarely mentioned on Doomworld, despite being a runner up at the 2020 cacowards.

That sounds excellent, I will gladly play that.

 

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3 hours ago, Azure_Horror said:

Yeah, Struggle - Antaresian Legacy is very good. But I struggle (heh) to call it a sleeper WAD. It is a cacoward winner and currently sits at 20th place at Doomworld Community Top WADs of All Time (current), higher than SIGIL, Japanese Community Project, Vanguard and Lunatic.

 

This list is really valuable for remembering "sleepers." I'll have to start with one because I saw like 20 of mine lol and that would be overburdening.

 

But Spidersilk by zan-zan-zawa-veia (aka yakfak) is great, an intricate and enigmatic "dungeon map" that I really need to replay sometime too. yakfak is in the same category as mappers like Dobu or the last few years' Ribbiks -- has the design chops of a talented modern mapper but works more like an outsider artist. They stay away from the more common tropes and embrace confusion and abrasiveness, and worlds as spaces to conquer yourself rather than smooth fun machines. 

 

NzYftkm.png 2t7BIsL.png 

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2 hours ago, Dusty_Rhodes said:

That sounds excellent, I will gladly play that.

 

It might be the best megawad since at least Eviternity thanks to its pure embodiment of modern Doom with a very European outlook in visual design and maybe gameplay too (though that seems like a tough thing to label, lol). There's also Struggle, but the fact it's by a single author probably will start to showt (I still need to play that one, lol). Beware of Wilou84 though, he's a huge sadist (I guess Oxide , JC, and Roofi have their moments too, but I dunno I'd call them as unrelenting).

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