The Doomworld Computer Garage

[leejacksonaudio]

I'm starting this thread mainly to get the talk about building a new Music Computer out of the "Lee Jackson" thread, but also so that everyone can have a place to discuss computer builds, parts, and upgrades. Anything along the lines of PC hardware is fair game. Mac and iOS stuff, not so much (sorry, but y'all don't build your own computers too often). So, complete builds, individual parts, you name it - let's talk about it, show it off, or whatever! Have at thee!

[leejacksonaudio]

I'll start things off with my current parts list from PCPartPicker:

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-12700KF 3.6 GHz 12-Core Processor  (Purchased For $465.46) 
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black 82.52 CFM CPU Cooler  ($119.02 @ Amazon) 
Thermal Compound: ARCTIC MX-5 Incl. Spatula 4 g Thermal Paste  (Purchased For $7.58) 
Motherboard: MSI MPG Z690 EDGE WIFI DDR4 ATX LGA1700 Motherboard  ($335.56) 
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory  ($297.68 @ Newegg) 
Storage: Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive  ($379.99 @ GameStop) 
Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 2060 6 GB SC ULTRA GAMING Video Card  (Purchased For $585.63) 
Case: Fractal Design Define R5 ATX Mid Tower Case  (Purchased For $135.30) 
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS 750 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (Purchased For $113.65) 
Case Fan: Noctua A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan  ($26.95 @ Amazon) 
Case Fan: Noctua A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan  ($26.95 @ Amazon) 
Keyboard: Microsoft LXM-00001 Wired Ergonomic Keyboard  (Purchased For $49.62) 
Total: $2543.39
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2021-11-16 15:21 EST-0500

[leejacksonaudio]

Here's a shot of my current inventory pile (to be added to soon):

 

[Boaby Kenobi]

I've been meaning to build a new system for a while now. I bought a PSU and a case a couple of years ago and was planning on buying the rest every couple of months until I had everything I needed but then the lockdowns began and prices for PC parts reached ridiculous levels so that put a halt on my plans. I ended up getting a laptop to do me for now. It wasn't cheap but it's a pretty decent system and I'm very happy with it so far.

 

MSI GP66 Leopard

 

 

[leejacksonaudio]

Now, with all of the above out of the way, I have a question. As you can see, I've got DDR4-3200 RAM on my list. I would like to know if there would be any benefit to buying DDR4-3600 or DDR4-4000 and running an XMP profile on one of them, versus running an XMP profile on the DDR4-3200 RAM. There's not a big price differential between the three, at least where G.Skill Ripjaws V RAM is concerned, so I'm wondering if I should indulge myself and try to go for a little more speed. Comments? Advice?

[Dimon12321]

I think doesn't make much difference. It depends on which clock speed is your goal. I'm living with my 2666 MHz and feel OK =)

XMP usually guarantees a stable clock speed, but it still depends on the quantity of your RAM specimen. In DDR3 times, everyone who knew how to overclock RAM, was usually looking for Samsung 1333 MHz because its overclocking potential was even better than some Kingston's RAM. Then again, I doubt anything has changed since then.

 

GPU choice is wise =). Crappy mining doesn't let one buy a powerful GPU.

Edited November 16, 2021 by Dimon12321

[leejacksonaudio]

10 minutes ago, Dimon12321 said:

GPU choice is wise =). Crappy mining doesn't let one buy a powerful GPU.

 

Yeah, the damned miners have priced everyone out of the market. I had to go the used route via eBay, and even then it took me 5 tries to get one without getting sniped at the last minute by (I'm guessing) a bot. It's still a ridiculous price to pay for a 2060, but I'm at least getting some bang for the buck. Besides, my #1 priority with this system is going to be running music production software (Cakewalk by Bandlab, Wavelab Pro, and their constellation of plugins), so I don't need 30XX GPU levels of performance. A 2060 will do just fine - better than the old 970 that's in my current system.

[DynamiteKaitorn]

NGL going from a GTX 960 to an RTX 3060 makes one hell of a leap in terms of performance and gaming.

[PsychEyeball]

I upgraded my PC recently and back when I did it, I decided to just stay with 16 GB of RAM. Reading that Lee is getting 64 GB RAM for their system, it's now making me wonder... did I undershoot with just 16 GB?

 

For reference, the backbone of the system is an AMD Ryzen 7 5800X and a Geforce RTX 3070 Ti. I play games, do streaming and hold the vague thought I might go back to making music (and my music equipment is heavily plugin-based), so would I be a case subject for putting more RAM in their machine?

 

Sadly I don't remember what's my RAM anymore, only that I have 16 GB of it.

[leejacksonaudio]

12 minutes ago, PsychEyeball said:

I upgraded my PC recently and back when I did it, I decided to just stay with 16 GB of RAM. Reading that Lee is getting 64 GB RAM for their system, it's now making me wonder... did I undershoot with just 16 GB?

 

For reference, the backbone of the system is an AMD Ryzen 7 5800X and a Geforce RTX 3070 Ti. I play games, do streaming and hold the vague thought I might go back to making music (and my music equipment is heavily plugin-based), so would I be a case subject for putting more RAM in their machine?

 

Sadly I don't remember what's my RAM anymore, only that I have 16 GB of it.

 

For plugin and VST-based music, I would say that 16 GB of RAM under Windows 10 or Windows 11 is cutting things a bit slim. My old Music Computer was running 32 GB, and it was having a hard time with all of the virtual instruments I was throwing at it, hence the upgrade to 64 GB. If you use virtual instruments frequently, I would recommend 32 GB as a bare minimum, and 64 GB as a more relaxed requirement.

[Arrowhead]

16 minutes ago, PsychEyeball said:

...did I undershoot with just 16 GB?

...Sadly I don't remember what's my RAM anymore, only that I have 16 GB of it.

Honestly, I don't think 16GB is too shabby, there are virtually 0 video games on the market that require more than that right now.

 

I don't know squat about music programs' RAM usage though, so I can't comment much on that. Lee seems to be the expert on that! :)

 

I just bought a pre-built, (i9, 16GB RAM, 2TB SSD, RTX 3080) and I haven't had any issues playing games yet.

 

Honestly, I was thinking of taking the (2) Trident 8GB out of there, and putting in (2) 16GBs, probably Ballistix brand...

[leejacksonaudio]

18 minutes ago, Arrowhead said:

Honestly, I was thinking of taking the (2) Trident 8GB out of there, and putting in (2) 16GBs, probably Ballistix brand...

 

Any particular reason for going with Ballistix? I'm just curious. I mean, I normally go with G.Skill Ripjaws V for my builds, as does my son. Is there a compelling argument for choosing the Ballistix over the Ripjaws V? I haven't purchased my RAM yet (waiting for Black Friday), so I might be swayed.

[Arrowhead]

25 minutes ago, leejacksonaudio said:

 

Any particular reason for going with Ballistix? I'm just curious. I mean, I normally go with G.Skill Ripjaws V for my builds, as does my son. Is there a compelling argument for choosing the Ballistix over the Ripjaws V? I haven't purchased my RAM yet (waiting for Black Friday), so I might be swayed.

I had asked some folks on the Newegg discord if I should buy (2) more of the Trident brand (8GB), and they said I shouldn't because Trident has the potential to use different chips between batches of RAM - apparently ballistix always has the same chips, so there's no chance of messing up the timings, as there is w/ the Trident RAM... I don't know much about computers, admittedly, but that's what I was told. I don't know enough about RAM to know if Ripjaw does the same as Ballistix, but I would assume so, as it's a high quality brand. I think you'd be good to just stick w/ the Ripjaw stuff - I'm only buying Ballistix for the above reason. :)

[Lippeth]

58 minutes ago, leejacksonaudio said:

For plugin and VST-based music, I would say that 16 GB of RAM under Windows 10 or Windows 11 is cutting things a bit slim. My old Music Computer was running 32 GB, and it was having a hard time with all of the virtual instruments I was throwing at it, hence the upgrade to 64 GB. If you use virtual instruments frequently, I would recommend 32 GB as a bare minimum, and 64 GB as a more relaxed requirement.

Modern music production is a careful balancing act with 8 to 16 GB of RAM, but it's something I've always had to do in the past, and have had a lot of technical success producing and mixing on my old potato Mac Mini, taking special care to render everything I'm not immediately using to audio files, or freezing them in some way, and routing busses like crazy if I'm using the same plugin settings on multiple instruments to conserve what little resources are available. The 32GB DDR4 3600 (CORSAIR Vengeance LPX) I have in my pc feels like more than I'd ever need considering my ultra-conservative DAW habits, but I can only imagine the comfort of doubling that.

 

I like Corsair's LPX RAM just because it's low profile and fits snug under my massive CPU heatsink.

[Xaser]

Bah, this thread is reminding me that my current build is all nice and up-to-date except for the damned GPU. I've got a 980 Ti that's served me well since 2016-ish, but it's definitely starting to show its age (Deathloop gave me trouble recently; goddamn good game otherwise though).

 

Normally I'd be all "meh, whatever, I'll just play on Low and laugh at the pixels", but the game that forced me to upgrade in 2016 was Dark Souls 3, and Elden Ring is just around the corner. As ironic as it would be for a Fromsoft game to make my PC die, I'd kinda rather play the game. :P

[leejacksonaudio]

I've been on the Newegg Discord server, talking with a few of their "techies," and I've been given some advice concerning my earlier question about DDR4-3600 and DDR4-4000 RAM vs. DDR4-3200. According to them, RAM timing will do more for me than RAM frequency will ever do. So, with the DDR4-4000 RAM I've been looking at, the timings are 18-22-22 - not the best in the world, and not better than the 16-18-18 from the DDR4-3200 RAM I'd originally chosen. However, I was pointed to this set of RAM:

 

https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-64gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820232900

 

This is a set of G.Skill Flare X 64 GB DDR4-3200 RAM, with timings of 14-14-14. Impressive, according to the techies. It's also about $100 more than the base 3200 RAM, but the techies insist it's worth it. I've updated my PCPartPicker list to include it, therefore. It bumped my build price up over $2650, but I'm just going to have to deal with that. Good lord.

[leejacksonaudio]

Parts list update ...

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-12700KF 3.6 GHz 12-Core Processor  (Purchased For $465.46) 
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black 82.52 CFM CPU Cooler  ($119.02 @ Amazon) 
Thermal Compound: ARCTIC MX-5 Incl. Spatula 4 g Thermal Paste  (Purchased For $7.58) 
Motherboard: MSI MPG Z690 EDGE WIFI DDR4 ATX LGA1700 Motherboard  ($346.39) 
Memory: G.Skill Flare X 64 GB (4 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 CL14 Memory  ($411.34 @ Newegg) 
Storage: Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive  ($379.99 @ GameStop) 
Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 2060 6 GB SC ULTRA GAMING Video Card  (Purchased For $585.63) 
Case: Fractal Design Define R5 ATX Mid Tower Case  (Purchased For $135.30) 
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS 750 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (Purchased For $113.65) 
Case Fan: Noctua A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan  ($26.95 @ Amazon) 
Case Fan #2: Noctua A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan  ($26.95 @ Amazon) 
Keyboard: Microsoft LXM-00001 Wired Ergonomic Keyboard  (Purchased For $49.62) 
Total: $2667.88
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2021-11-17 22:36 EST-0500

 

...and now, some bad news. A household finance problem is going to shut down most of my purchases until after the new year. My budget just got unceremoniously slashed to just over $400, which is a drop in the bucket compared to how much I need to complete the build. I might be able to get one Black Friday special, but that's about it. I'm not a happy camper about the situation, either. :( :( :(  Don't ask.

[leejacksonaudio]

Probably the last thing I'm going to buy before the hiatus is my SSD, and it probably won't be the Samsung 980 Pro shown above. I got on Newegg's Discord server overnight and talked with a couple of their "techies" about which SSD to buy, but not before I did some of my own additional research. I saw some reviews that named Western Digital's WD Black SN850 2TB drive as faster than the 980 Pro, but hotter temperature-wise at the same time. I asked what the techies thought might be the better drive for my purposes. Their answer? Neither! They pointed me toward the Seagate FireCuda 530 2TB NVMe drive, which uses newer technology. It's also more expensive, but for the performance gain, it might have been worth it.

 

"Might have," past tense, because I continued doing research after the techie session and found a newer, faster drive: the Kingston KC3000 2TB NVMe drive. It uses the same new technology as the FireCuda 530, but it runs it at a faster speed. It's also available at a lower price from a different vendor, thanks to pre-Black Friday discounting. I got on with the Newegg techies again and presented my findings - they agreed, the KC3000 was a better deal if purchased from the different vendor (it's sold through a 3rd party vendor on Newegg at a significant markup).

 

So, like I said, it looks like my last purchase before the pause is going to be an SSD, and it's more than likely going to be the Kingston KC3000 2TB drive. The only things holding me back are a) the sale of a piece of hardware I'm going to take care of today and the income it brings, and b) a discussion of the matter I'm going to have with my co-builder, a.k.a. my son, sometime tomorrow. Wish me luck, please.

[The BMFG]

look at all of you guys with your fancy computer setups

[leejacksonaudio]

Well, two things have been purchased. The Kingston SSD got bought, after some analysis and discussion back and forth with my son. Also purchased was the G.Skill Flare X 64 GB CAS 14 RAM. I had to fight to get the SSD, but I won't go into details on that. Suffice it to say that if I hadn't bought it when I did, I may not have got it at all. Those things are selling like hotcakes.

 

Now, the hiatus begins. So close, and yet so far. Just under $529 left to get all the remaining parts to the system, and they're going to have to wait. Sigh.

[leejacksonaudio]

While I'm on hiatus, I have a question for those of you who've "transplanted" the guts of an old computer into a new one. How did you handle the change in software and drivers for your new motherboard?

 

For example, my old system has an ASRock X99 chipset in it to support an i7-6700 Intel chip. My new system is going to be running a Z690 chipset for an Intel i7-12700 CPU. They're obviously not the same, so what will happen if I take my old hard drive (or the mirrored equivalent thereof), plonk it into my new system, and try to boot it up? Will I just get errors, or will I do actual, irreparable damage to either the registry or, heaven forbid, the new hardware?

 

Those of you who've faced a similar situation: how did you handle it? What did you do? Were you successful? If not, how did you recover?

[vyruss]

I actually just did something like this, upgraded from an i7-7700K to an i7-12700KF with a Z690 chipset (from Z270).  The only real PITA I had to put up with was Windows going "NYEHRRRR, YOU CHANGED YOUR HARDWARE BUY A NEW LICENSE".  (Oh that, and the fact that the F1 BIOS version of my MOBO decided to refuse to acknowledge the existence of my 980 PRO as an M.2 device... Gigabyte UD Z690 DDR4 mobo btw -> had to do a BIOS update.  Cannot speak for your MSI you're looking at.)

 

Other than those minor annoyances, everything is working fine.

[leejacksonaudio]

1 hour ago, vyruss said:

The only real PITA I had to put up with was Windows going "NYEHRRRR, YOU CHANGED YOUR HARDWARE BUY A NEW LICENSE".

How did you resolve this?

 

Also, did you install the Z690 chipset drivers over the top of the Z270 drivers, or did you uninstall/new install?

[vyruss]

I ended up just buying a new license for Windows 10 (since this would be the third hardware configuration my old license was used against).

 

And yea I just installed the chipset drivers over the old, doesn't seem to be having any problems since behind the scenes (to my limited understanding) Windows will automatically take care of the drivers for the chipset.

[leejacksonaudio]

My plight over the last $529 has been reported in PC Gamer and in USA Today!

 

https://www.pcgamer.com/heres-your-chance-to-have-the-composer-of-duke-nukem-write-a-song-for-you/

 

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2021/11/duke-nukem-3d-composer-pc

 

I'm going to crosspost this in my "essential info" thread because it has to do with Commissions.

[leejacksonaudio]

My first commission, along with an eBay sale, has allowed me to finally get the last parts off of my PC build list! At last, everything is inbound. So, one last time, here is my PCPartPicker list, with everything purchased:

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-12700KF 3.6 GHz 12-Core Processor  (Purchased For $465.46) 
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black 82.52 CFM CPU Cooler  (Purchased For $119.02) 
Thermal Compound: ARCTIC MX-5 Incl. Spatula 4 g Thermal Paste  (Purchased For $7.58) 
Motherboard: MSI MPG Z690 EDGE WIFI DDR4 ATX LGA1700 Motherboard  (Purchased For $336.39) 
Memory: G.Skill Flare X 64 GB (4 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 CL14 Memory  (Purchased For $411.34) 
Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 2060 6 GB SC ULTRA GAMING Video Card  (Purchased For $585.63) 
Case: Fractal Design Define R5 ATX Mid Tower Case  (Purchased For $135.30) 
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS 750 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  (Purchased For $113.65) 
Case Fan #1: Noctua A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan  (Purchased For $26.95) 
Case Fan #2: Noctua A14 PWM chromax.black.swap 82.52 CFM 140 mm Fan  (Purchased For $26.95) 
Keyboard: Microsoft LXM-00001 Wired Ergonomic Keyboard  (Purchased For $49.62) 
Custom (NVMe SSD): Kingston KC3000 PCIe 4.0 NVMe M.2 SSD - High-performance storage for desktop and laptop PCs -SKC3000S/2048G  (Purchased For $426.57) 
Total: $2704.46
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2021-12-04 11:47 EST-0500

 

I also bought a couple of custom PCIe power cables from CableMod to power the fancy motherboard I just bought. Those set me back $49.80, making the grand total spend $2754.26.

 

This is the first time I've been able to go high end on everything (save for the video card) for a build. I can't wait to see what this monster can do.

[leejacksonaudio]

I splurged. Bought a Noctua NA-HC4 chromax.Black Heatsink Cover for my NH-D15 heatsink. If I don't like it, or if it reduces performance, I'll return it.

 

[Murdoch]

On 11/24/2021 at 7:10 AM, vyruss said:

I ended up just buying a new license for Windows 10 (since this would be the third hardware configuration my old license was used against).

 

Fun fact: old Windows 7 licenses from big brand name computers like HP, Toshiba etc can be used to install Windows 10 - and presumably Windows 11 too though I have not tried it yet. So if you have an old laptop lying around and need a Windows license for a new build, you can swipe that and save money.

[vyruss]

1 hour ago, Murdoch said:

 

Fun fact: old Windows 7 licenses from big brand name computers like HP, Toshiba etc can be used to install Windows 10 - and presumably Windows 11 too though I have not tried it yet. So if you have an old laptop lying around and need a Windows license for a new build, you can swipe that and save money.

Yea, unfortunately I don't have any of those laying around which I could have harvested a key from.  The cost was negligible(for me) anyhow.

[leejacksonaudio]

Speaking of keys, I'm wondering if I'll be able to pull a key off of my old computer anyway. One of the perks of working on my last big music job was that I got a new Origin computer out of the deal. It's never been upgraded, so maybe I can use its key to install Windows 11 Pro. Won't know until I try.