The 2021 Cacowards Thread Sidebar [Split]

[Morpheus666]

Honestly don't understand people complaining about not getting recognition, In a community, there's people who casually work, and people who bust there asses doing work. The people who Bust there ass for the passion of something deserve a cacoaward more then someone who whipped up a map in like 10 minutes and expect to get highly praised, it's not a competition to see who makes the best content, that's not what a community is about. The Purpose of a community is to collectively share a hobby or passion and help each other improve and become better at said hobby, If you have talked to any of the big mappers before you will know they are modest, kind people who work hard to get the reputation they earned. I don't mean this to discourage people from making Doom Content but sometimes you just have to face the fact that your content will be overlooked, and that's fine, you need to move on with yourself and keep at it, eventually you will hit gold.

[lokbustam257]

guys what happen here

[AtticTelephone]

This thread is too long to read, but it seems downright awful.

Anyways, nice to see a new Cacowards, will check out the wads and can't wait for Cacowards 2022.

2 minutes ago, lokbustam257 said:

guys what happen here

I have no idea, it probably doesn't matter though.

[ZeMystic]

2 minutes ago, lokbustam257 said:

guys what happen here

 

free entertainment happen here.

 

Also, I really liked @Remilia Scarlet's idea of having two different kind of award seasons, however that does seem like more opportunity for "why didn't I win I'm mad" scenarios and probably more stress on some of the writers.

 

[antares031]

8 hours ago, Peter said:

Yeah whatever about what specific tone I used. If I'm making a point, then I'm making a point, I'm not all that interested in how polite my performance appears as.

 

Here's my honest advice, for your sake: DO NOT have this kind of attitude, when you're representing the group you're in, because this is one of the most terrible attitudes for any spokespeople. You told us that you're here "on behalf of every musician involved", so every post you write here reflects not only your own opinion, but also the voice of your group as well. Because of this, any impolite attitude will give negative reputations to not only just you, but also the group you're representing. While I understand the reason about your frustration in this thread, please always remember to respect the others first, when you want respect from the others. Especially when you're making a point, while you're representing your team.

[Gez]

3 hours ago, Revenant100 said:

I eventually found it in the sidebar of 2017's Gameplay Mod Awards page. That's buried pretty deep among unrelated content for something that's "difficult to miss."

The problem here isn't the sidebar but the section. The "neat stuff safari" being neither runners-up nor honorable mentions, they're not covered by the Doom Wiki articles.

[Pechudin]

Maybe Cacowards should have a Wadazine-like publication? Probably not the first one to have such an idea. Could cram more content in there.

 

Although of course this would add a large amount of work to what is already a large amount of work.

[Remilia Scarlet]

30 minutes ago, Pechudin said:

Maybe Cacowards should have a Wadazine-like publication?

We already have our own awards, if I'm not mistaken ^_^

[Kinsie]

5 hours ago, Remilia Scarlet said:

Anyway, some of the discussion led me to have a somewhat random thought.  Since I usually see discussions year after year regarding things like visibility (such as if the sidebar is easily visible or not), why not split the Cacowards up into a twice-a-year thing?  The Summer Hell Awards and Cacowards.  There's various ways you could split them up (do maps and mods during the Cacowards, while speedrunning, music, and whatever else during the summer awards, as an example).  It may also help keep the total work done during a single awards session down.  Or at least it might for a while, since I'm sure the content amount will eventually catch up with it anyway :-P  There's always other ways to split them as well, like half and half.  Or just two sets of 10 maps + the usual other awards, though that's a lot of work.

While we're very open to ideas and suggestions on ways to adapt and improve our approaches for the next year (and there are things mentioned in this thread that are being actively discussed), I'm not sure that "do twice the work in half the time for free" is the most workable suggestion, to put it lightly.

 

31 minutes ago, Pechudin said:

Maybe Cacowards should have a Wadazine-like publication? Probably not the first one to have such an idea. Could cram more content in there.

 

Although of course this would add a large amount of work to what is already a large amount of work.

I'm not convinced that trading in a lightweight, mobile-friendly webpage for a bulky print-centric PDF file would be an upgrade from a readability and layout perspective. Also, I haven't touched InDesign in probably half a decade at this point so nobody needs to be subjected to whatever text-layout-centric horrors I'd usher forth into the world.

 

6 hours ago, Revenant100 said:

I beg to differ to differing. The sidebar is unquestionably where content goes to be lost and forgotten.

 

(words ensure)

I mean, the wiki is a wiki. If something's missing, add it.

[Dynamo]

6 hours ago, Quasar said:

This part is probably the mistake; it's a lot of work but we should really go back through and have summaries of every year's sidebar content in the articles. That they started life originally as one gigantic article that had grown to the point of being unmaintainable is one reason the content is so laser-focused.

 

3 hours ago, Gez said:

The problem here isn't the sidebar but the section. The "neat stuff safari" being neither runners-up nor honorable mentions, they're not covered by the Doom Wiki articles.

https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Cacowards_2016 there actually was a discussion being held on this very topic some days ago as I was combing through the previous awards. I guess it's topical to bring it up.

[Revenant100]

2 hours ago, Kinsie said:

I mean, the wiki is a wiki. If something's missing, add it.

 

4 hours ago, Gez said:

The "neat stuff safari" being neither runners-up nor honorable mentions, they're not covered by the Doom Wiki articles.

 

57 minutes ago, Dynamo said:

https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Cacowards_2016

Indeed. As I hadn't made it overtly clear enough in my previous post, the omission of sidebar content in the Doom Wiki articles is not merely an oversight. It is very much by design. Combined with the Cacowards' own lack of any available indexing or summary of this material each year, the sidebar content has always unquestionably been difficult to discover and search through, easy to miss, and ultimately destined to be overlooked and forgotten.

 

You might even say it's doomed to obscurity!

[Horus]

Some suggestions for 2022:

- Rename 'Top Twelve / Runners up' to 'Gold / Silver' to match the new icons

- Consider replacing the sidebar with a dedicated page or two

- If you wanted to make your lives a little easier, do we really need the Mordeth award? It sticks out in my mind as the only award that has nothing to do with quality

[Gez]

The Mordeth Award will be retired when Mordeth is actually released, and not one year before.

[Dynamo]

31 minutes ago, Revenant100 said:

 

 

Indeed. As I hadn't made it overtly clear enough in my previous post, the omission of sidebar content in the Doom Wiki articles is not merely an oversight. It is very much by design. Combined with the Cacowards' own lack of any available indexing or summary of this material each year, the sidebar content has always unquestionably been difficult to search through, easy to miss, and ultimately destined to be overlooked and forgotten. 

 

You might even say it's doomed to obscurity!

If you check the timestamps for the messages in that discussion, you will find out that not only do they predate this whole "controversy", but they predate the 2021 cacowards altogether. There are many considerations to be made for the wiki, given that expanding the articles even further means even more missing content for the mods themselves (articles don't write on their own), not to mention the fact that there's only a handful of contributors active right now. I really wouldn't want for the talk message to be taken out of context and weaponized to advance whatever agenda it is that a handful of people here are pursuing, demanding that the awards be shaped in their own vision whilst completely ignoring the very good points brought up by people like Not Jabba, Kinsie, MTrop and others. The wiki is a collaborative effort: if you think something is wrong with it, collaborate. The last thing any of us on the wiki want is for conspiracy theories like this to be spread around, as if we were somehow purposefully trying to keep sidebar content out of sight and out of mind: the fact that people like Quasar (DoomWiki admin) spoke in favour expanding the format means the very opposite is taking place, if anything. I do sincerely appreciate criticism and I'm glad people are pointing out that they *do* want to see this content on the wiki, but we are not trying to hide it, at all. That I can guarantee.

Edited December 20, 2021 by Dynamo

[baja blast rd.]

"Relegated" this awful derail since it was started by salt/entitlement that has grown tiresome and was killing everyone else's good vibes. Also some bonus awards! 

 

Peter

 

 

Revenant100