Going Through The Serious Sam Games Again

[Rudolph]

Oh yeah, speaking of Serious Sam mapping, are there good custom maps and campaigns worth checking out? Revolution has a Steam Workshop page, but there does not seem to be any kind of curating effort and I do not really feel like digging through piles of trash in the hopes of finding a hidden gem.

 

Anyway, The Random Encounter really has some absurd difficulty spikes towards the end and I find myself having to restart from the beginning again and again in order to adequately prepare myself for the ordeal and farm as many items as I possibly can while battles are still manageable.

 

However, I absolutely dig the game's cartoon art style and I really wish it could be used in more games.

[Antroid]

6 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

Oh yeah, speaking of Serious Sam mapping, are there good custom maps and campaigns worth checking out? Revolution has a Steam Workshop page, but there does not seem to be any kind of curating effort and I do not really feel like digging through piles of trash in the hopes of finding a hidden gem.

I think there were definitely some high quality maps that came from Seriously, and maybe from other places, but I was mainly about the incredibly janky stuff our smaller community had. Can't really help with this. Looking at the highest rated singleplayer levels, I believe Military Decay was pretty impressive back in the day. Portals was a personal nostalgic favorite. I truly have no idea how they hold up in terms of gameplay tho. "Serious Sam: Underground" might be a bit of a meme recommendation, I dont actually think it's something I would recommend right off the bat, but it was one of my favorites from back in the day.

 

I don't think the workshop has very many of the old good maps. You might wanna consider a dive into Seriously's archive if that still exists - I imagine the way to insert your own levels, namely dropping the *.gro files into the game's root directory and then launching them from the "custom level" menu should work without the workshop.

[Rudolph]

Thanks for the recommendation. Never heard of Seriously! before, but apparently, the site is closing its doors. It does have a Discord server, however, so I might check it out... once I am done with the vanilla games, that is!

[Rudolph]

And I am done with The Random Encounter. It was pretty sweet, although as I said, those difficulty spikes are insane: I do not think I would have been able to beat the final world had I not stocked on items and started spamming them. The fact that a bug caused the game to give me two more Cannons did not hurt either. However, since it was merely a commission done by a very small team with most likely a short deadline, the flaws are forgivable, although again, I would love to see the cartoon art style be used by more games.

 

Also, I have decided to go back to playing the HD versions, as the Revolution port does not feel much of an improvement after all. Sure, the different lighting in the Tomb of Ramses is nice and it feels somehow easier to dodge Kleer attacks, but overall, it still looks much worse than the HD version in addition to being not as well optimized, weirdly enough. I might go back to Revolution some day to give Bright Island a shot since there does not seem to be a HD remake, but for the time being, I intend to just power through the first two Encounters.

[Rudolph]

Has anyone here played Serious Sam: The Next Encounter? Is it worth tracking a copy or is it really nothing special, being a console exclusive?

[Antroid]

I played it on an emulator. It's got a combo system that gives you bonuses for killing enemies in a row without stopping but I didn't care too much for it overall.

[Rudolph]

Bummer. As I noticed earlier, the game seems to feature locations never seen in other Serious Sam games. :(

 

Anyway, I stumbled upon a guide to modify the difficulty in Serious Sam Fusion and I think I can use it to design a difficulty setting that feels just right. So far, I have been playing with Serious enemy spawns and damage "recived" (sic), but Normal enemy health, speed and ammo. Combat is much more fun now that I am given more time to react to the more egregious (if not downright cheap) ambushes and ammo being much scarcer means that I have to be smarter about the way I use the arsenal; as such, I am using the Revolvers more often and I have even discovered that the Combat Knife can be an effective weapon against Gnaars and, surprisingly enough, Kleers! :o

[Rudolph]

Man, the Oasis Marsh Hopper fight on Serious (vanilla, not the modded one I mentioned) ought to be one of the worst fights I have ever experienced in a video game: there just does not seem to be any way to beat that fucking thing without taking massive damage or running out of Chaingun ammo.

 

In fact, I am giving up on beating it legitimately, as I just do not know what to do at this point.

[Rudolph]

On 1/22/2022 at 11:01 PM, Pyborg said:

The part with the Kleer Skeletons is fine, although extremely repetitive, but the part with the werewolves is terrible. They just throw a crap ton of them at you expecting you to be able to handle it. Even if you use the minigun, there's no way to gun them down with getting hit at least once.

Hey, I do not know if you have since figured it out on your own, but I have found that the Grenade Launcher works really well against the Werebulls.

 

Just drop a handful of grenades on their trajectory will make short work of them!

[pyborg]

2 minutes ago, Rudolph said:

Hey, I do not know if you have since figured it out on your own, but I have found that the Grenade Launcher works really well against the Werebulls.

 

Just drop a handful of grenades on their trajectory will make short work of them!

Okay. I guess I haven't tried it because I thought it would be too slow. Thanks!

[Rudolph]

15 minutes ago, Pyborg said:

Okay. I guess I haven't tried it because I thought it would be too slow. Thanks!

Well, it is slow, but since it does not explode immediately and if you time it right, you can sort of use it as an improvised timed mine, so to speak.

 

I am currently playing it through TFE in Serious, which is really a handful, but I have found the Grenade Launcher to be really helpful against waves of Werebulls, especially in the level 'Dunes'.

[Antroid]

If you play FE/SE in Fusion, be aware that it really fucks with some of the enemies' movement and physics. Enemies no longer collide with each other in Fusion I think, they also zip around much more and seem to hit you from farther away or weird angles. In my experience, it affects Kleer, Werebulls, the frogs, and SE's Kukurbito the most. However even a simple group of Gnaar can be weird in Fusion because due to the seeming lack of collision they all merge into one space and really go wailing.

 

I think the basic HD versions weren't like this, so if you really don't want to do the OGs due to the graphics, I would recommend keeping in mind the Fusion weirdness.

[Rudolph]

Damnit, is there no version of Serious Sam without annoying technical issues? :(

[Antroid]

IMO the classic versions are good (still work fine), Revolution if you dont mind the trees in a few levels where it's relevant (mainly Palenque 01 and probably visible in a few other places) disappearing a bit closer to the camera, or standard HD remakes (standalone, not part of Fusion). I think the HD remakes do some very minor tweaks but they should be fine. They run well too, I beat both of them again just last year. This is only for the first games mind you, SS2 and SS3 work perfectly fine as they are on steam. SS4 and Siberian Mayhem... well, that's another story lmao

 

Edit: actually, I also did beat the Fusion versions on Serious last year too, after doing the HD versions, they are overall fine, you can definitely deal with the changes to the enemy physics. I noticed it way more because I'm so used to playing the classic versions, and felt Fusion was way harder when I first tried it.

[Spooner5020]

On 1/10/2022 at 10:53 AM, ducon said:

I remember that there were Serious Sam-like games at the time: Will Rock, Nitro Family and the Painkiller series.

It’s funny you say that about Nitro Family cause it actually USES the Serious Sam engine. I think Nitro Family is way more fun too.

[Rudolph]

That Nitro Family game looks rather offensive - actively so, in a Postal kind of way - and I read it is also both irritatingly difficult and unpleasant to play overall, but I reckon the concept of a triple-wielding protagonist is not without its charm.

 

Maybe Croteam could use that for a Serious Sam spin-off, e.g. "Serious Sam: Triple Threat"?

[Rudolph]

8 hours ago, Antroid said:

IMO the classic versions are good (still work fine), Revolution if you dont mind the trees in a few levels where it's relevant (mainly Palenque 01 and probably visible in a few other places) disappearing a bit closer to the camera, or standard HD remakes (standalone, not part of Fusion). I think the HD remakes do some very minor tweaks but they should be fine. They run well too, I beat both of them again just last year. This is only for the first games mind you, SS2 and SS3 work perfectly fine as they are on steam. SS4 and Siberian Mayhem... well, that's another story lmao

 

Edit: actually, I also did beat the Fusion versions on Serious last year too, after doing the HD versions, they are overall fine, you can definitely deal with the changes to the enemy physics. I noticed it way more because I'm so used to playing the classic versions, and felt Fusion was way harder when I first tried it.

Well, both the Classic versions and Revolution have a screen resolution issue that prevents me from playing at full screen resolution. I know there is a workaround, but still, it is a baffling optimization oversight. I do like that the Classic port features a separate key for the Grenade Launcher, however.

 

I will still try to power through TFE and TSE on Serious to get the achievements, but the main reason why I want to stick with Fusion is that it comes with an editor that allows me to alter the difficulty settings in a way that makes the game much more fun to play. I have yet to find a similar method for the other versions.

[Rudolph]

Oooh boy, the fucking Metropolis level... Somehow, I feel like it has both the best and the worst The First Encounter has had to offer so far. 

 

Okay, maybe "worst" is a bit too harsh, as nothing can beat the Marsh Hopper fight in Oasis in terms of sheer bullshit, but the first two areas are Plutonia's Odyssey of Noise on steroids, with hordes of Kleers that pop out of nowhere every ten meters while Arachnoids spawn on high grounds to snipe you with their minigun or Reptiloids to spam you with aggressively homing fireballs. I do not know how many times I have had to restart those parts...

 

But I also say best, because the third area is one long large corridor that let you see enemies come from afar and give me enough time to prepare as well as plenty of ammunition to shoot at large waves of incoming enemies and never let go of the trigger. Now that is what I came to expect from a Serious Sam game! The secret Cannon really comes in handy here, although a Railgun like in Bogus Detour would have been nice too.

[Rudolph]

I remember I had bought The Legend of the Beast DLC years ago. Since it chronologically takes place between Metropolis and Alley of the Sphinxes, so I figured I would play this one before the latter. For some reason, it does not have very good reviews on Steam. So far, I really do not understand why: the first level is vast but there is a lot of enemies already roaming in it, and even when enemies do get spawned, they usually do so from far away. And since the level seems fairly open-ended, the enemies get to flank you in ways that feel more organic and interesting.

 

Already, I like it much better than the original TFE levels! :D

[Rudolph]

On 2/2/2022 at 6:39 PM, Pyborg said:

Okay. I guess I haven't tried it because I thought it would be too slow. Thanks!

Disregard my previous advice: a single charged Cannon Ball will make short work of Werebulls if you can get to run towards you in a straight line!

 

The Grenade Launcher and the Rocket Launcher can still be useful, but against a horde of Werebulls, what you want is a Cannon.

[Rudolph]

Finally! I did it: I have beaten The First Encounter on Serious. What a ride. It was extremely frustrating at times - again, fuck the Kleer - and I have still very mixed feelings about the level design, but I feel like that final fight with Ugh-Zan III alone made the whole ordeal worth it; at first, I hated having to run the gauntlet to the Great Pyramid, constantly dying to Werebulls and BioMechs, but then I have realized that the game does allow me to backtrack to the beginning of the level to heal and restock on ammo. I have also realized that the game can be switched to a third-person view, which made keeping track of Ugh-Zan's attacks a lot easier, although it still made me wish there could have been some sort of Max Payne-like dodge roll move. Oh well. Once I figured out how the fight worked, I started having a lot of fun with it, although for some reason, I could only get half of the total enemy count and I have no idea where the other half was or how to get it to spawn.

 

All in all, now that I have gotten all the secrets, I might revisit The First Encounter on a lower difficulty setting or with my modified Serious difficulty in the near future. In the meantime, on to The Second Encounter!

[Antroid]

4 hours ago, Rudolph said:

In the meantime, on to The Second Encounter!

I wonder if you'll hate several rooms in the latter half of the Mayan episode as much as I do. Certain "fun" rooms around the end of Teotihuacan, I think, and in the Pit.

[Rudolph]

Well, playing through the Palenque Demo, I can already say that I do not care much for the new Reptiloid type that fires an indestructible lava ball that is even harder to track than the regular Reptiloid's homing ball. The Curcubito is also much deadlier on Serious than I expected it to be.

 

In any case, The Second Encounter seems to introduce new weapons that make it much easier to manage groups of Kleers, so that is something already.

 

Also, I do love how some enemies have an unique death animation when chainsawed.

[Rudolph]

Hmmm... okay, so the Flamethrower does not seem to be as satisfying to use as its Bogus Detour counterpart, which is a shame. Also, in Fusion, it is bound to the same key as the Laser Rifle, for some reason... Same goes with the Sniper Rifle, which shares the same key as the Cannon.

 

However, the Sniper Rifle is absolutely godly. Like, holy shit! I still would have preferred a Railgun, but this is fine too.

[Antroid]

13 hours ago, Rudolph said:

Well, playing through the Palenque Demo, I can already say that I do not care much for the new Reptiloid type that fires an indestructible lava ball that is even harder to track than the regular Reptiloid's homing ball.

If you're playing Fusion, I believe those guys also behave a bit different from how they used to originally. In the original version you just strafed and forgot about their ball, but in Fusion there's a high chance they'll hit you anyways. However, in Fusion specifically, I believe, their balls actually are destructible, however it might need "physical projectiles" such as rockets or laser blasts. When I was replaying Fusion, I used to pretty much spam rockets into them as soon as I saw one, and their ball would reliably get destroyed by one of the rockets.

[Rudolph]

Yeah, that is what I ended up doing as well. Still, I do not understand what Croteam was going for with these guys: Serious Sam already has the Highlander as a more dangerous Reptiloid variant. Heck, in Serious difficulty, two of them appear as early as the first level!

 

I guess once I am done with Fusion, I might force myself to go through Revolution to see the differences and also try Bright Island.

[Rudolph]

Oh man, I am only two levels in - so roughly the equivalent of the Palenque Demo - and I already feel like this is basically the Serious Sam equivalent of Doom II. At least, when it comes to the much-needed additions to the arsenal.

 

The new monsters, however, feel unnecessary: while I love the look of the Cucurbito and the Zumb'ul, I reckon they serve more or less the same purpose as the Werebull and the BioMech, respectively, and the Fiendian Reptiloid, while more manageable now that I know how to destroy its projectiles, does not seem to bring anything new to combat. I have not seen much of the Zorg so far, but I get the feeling that it is not going to be much different from the ranged Beheaded enemies. Nothing bad, just nothing particularly game-changing like Doom II's additions.

 

But again, that Sniper Rifle, my goodness... I have just found that it can even one-shot Werebulls. It really is amazing! Upon further experimentation with the Flamethrower, I find it incredibly useful too, especially against hordes of Kleers and Kamikazes in the "Follow The Light" room. I guess the weapon is just a bit lacking in terms of visual and audio feedback. The music is still great and und unlike Doom II, the levels are really beautiful so far, even when they rely on gimmicks that I do not particularly care for, like platform jumping.

[Rudolph]

On 2/8/2022 at 11:34 PM, Antroid said:

I wonder if you'll hate several rooms in the latter half of the Mayan episode as much as I do. Certain "fun" rooms around the end of Teotihuacan, I think, and in the Pit.

I just went through a bouncing room where the gravity seems to randomly switch on and off. Is that what you were referring to?

 

If so, then it was not too bad: I made sure to use all the Serious Bombs I had gathered so far to clear each wave. Not particularly fun, sure, but not even remotely as bad as the Marsh Hopper fight in The First Encounter's "Oasis", which I could not have gone past without rocket-jumping my way to safety.

[Scrabbs]

I personally find the second encounter to be the best of the games

[Antroid]

2 hours ago, Rudolph said:

I just went through a bouncing room where the gravity seems to randomly switch on and off. Is that what you were referring to?

That's one of them. I don't love all the weird bouncing and gravity rooms they shoved in that part of the game. I'd rather be stuck on a normal fight for hours than have to deal with that sort of stuff, lol.