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Captain Keen

Where do you think gaming will be in 20 years...

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The problem is GOG belongs to CD Projekt, which is in some seriously hot water right now because of the unironically dystopian disaster that is Cyberpunk 2077. It is a good thing that the site allows direct downloads without requiring a launcher, because its future looks uncertain to me.

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8 hours ago, Azuris said:

 

I've took your Post and edited it to my View of Things haha.

When I said platforms, I wasn't talking about publishers...

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Whatever people think gaming will become, keep in mind it needs to be accessible and comfortable.

 

I'm not sure where VR will be in 20 years in terms of home use. I know regardless of its improvements I still rather sit on my chair in private for hours, only have to move my fingers and wrists to control my games fluently and not have foreign objects attached to my face. We need to talk about some serious hardware innovations for people like me to consider replacing my PC setup with VR.

 

However, we know the mobile gaming market is huge and it's very accessible in terms of mobility, simplicity and affordability (entry at least). If VR can do away with the bulky wired head sets, the high cost and perhaps make the games appear in your current environment, being flexible wherever you are, that would provide plenty freedom to play at moments we want to be more energetic with our games. I can see it grow huge capturing its own market.

 

In regards to PC games in 20 years time, I think (and hope) they will be able to more efficiently create quality assets, maps and content that are highly customisable with advance user friendly editors. Do away with manually producing 100 pieces of foliage and clothing that requires custom animation and textures for every game installment, rather the engines would be powerful and refined enough to help artists build new environments and content with simple tools while not feeling samey. Furthermore this tech would enable more sophisticated mechanics. I like games like Total War series where you play the campaign map that influences the battles that take place and vise versa if you can optionally play the battles (which feels like an entirely new game in itself) that could drastically alter the results post battle (you could be an effective general and turn a losing situation into a victory because you personally commanded the army in battle). I like to see more of that. Games like spore attempted including multiple game types as you evolved but the butter was spread way too thin.

 

I think games might become cheaper to produce overtime and indie developers would become stronger contenders in the gaming market.

 

Everything I've suggested has started in a very basic and infant form.

Edited by Chezza

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A few predictions of mine:

 

- Physics simulations will be unified, rather than disparate, allowing for full interaction of every object. This will even include temperature and chemical changes, opening up new gameplay avenues. 

 

- Graphics will be ideal; artists will have total control over levels of detail and overall style/art direction. Real-time ray tracing will become the standard for lighting, and if not, a highly optimized method that achieves the same results. The non-Euclidean geometries of dreams will be fully realized. 

 

- NPCs will have pre-programmed simulated lives, providing them not only with memories but context for the worlds they inhabit. You'll be able to follow an NPC and watch them live an independent, unscripted life based on their simulated history. This will make conversation and giving orders much more intuitive. 

 

- Hyper dimensional environments will allow gamers to view worlds with more than three dimensions, with every surface nested in a larger dimensional space. The appearance could be adjusted based on a preferred projection method. This would include rendering higher temporal resolutions, making it possible to see a multitude of future outcomes before making a decision. 

 

- Augmented reality will allow for real spaces to be used for gameplay. In-game entities will respond to the lighting and physics of the real world. 

 

- Virtual reality will be near- or full-sensory; you will not only have unique tactile feedback for every surface, but will be affected by the density of in-game surfaces. The impact will be cushioned to prevent injury (such as falling a great distance in-game), possibly achieved with future breakthroughs in quantum levitation. 

 

-Virtual reality will also allow for smell and taste by essentially hacking your neurology. This could be achieved wirelessly, possibly with something as simple as a wearable band or bracelet. 

 

- The mind's eye will act as a potential source for content. Dreams, visions, and conscious thoughts will be penetrable, interactive spaces, represented as massive data sets of animated, dynamic voxels. 

 

- AIs will generate their own games.  Unexpectedly innovative concepts will arise from their experiments. You'll be able to ask an AI network to create games for you based on user input. There will even be games that are built from the ground-up as one plays, making for truly unpredictable experiences. 

 

- Both players and game devs alike will participate in generating game content through large scale cooperative efforts. AIs will assist by intuitively taking orders, greatly reducing dev cycles.  

 

Edited by Koko Ricky

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14 hours ago, Chezza said:

I think games might become cheaper to produce overtime and indie developers would become stronger contenders in the gaming market.

 

That won't happen. Quite the opposite. I expect another price hike for making AAA games, because there will be less competitors but ones with very deep pockets, so to outcompete each other they will have to invest ever more money to be in the lead.

 

If this really becomes a subscription platform war between Sony and Microsoft it'd also eliminate most of the risk of having a dud, because the platform fees will lower the financial risk considerably. They'd know how much money they can safely burn in a year, which makes planning a lot easier.

 

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I think people need to stop assuming the indie market will save gaming, it almost by definition can't.  Not to say that indie games aren't important to the industry (a lot of big games are indie games) but that the industry as a whole won't be fixed if we all stop buying AAA games, Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo (or whatever platform you buy games from on pc) still make money when you buy them and they have a huge hand in all of the problems with the industry, and at least one of them will unless you want to pirate games.

 

Also most indie games suck, Sex with hitler is uniquely bad but there are so many awful indie games that flooded steam greenlight back in the day that I don't need to list them here because you already have a list of them in your head now.  When people hear "Indie game" they think of the games people like.  I've had quite a few more push back for being critical of Hollow Knight (It's an ok game) than when I am critical of any AAA game with a huge audience.  

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4 hours ago, Koko Ricky said:

- The mind's eye will act as a potential source for content. Dreams, visions, and conscious thoughts will be penetrable, interactive spaces, represented as massive data sets of animated, dynamic voxels. 

 

I've actually wondered if we'd ever be able to basically activate dreams within people's minds to essentially use the mind as a CPU. Meaning, you design dreams that are like games, like virtual worlds, by triggering the mind to respond to a specific design that has been created for it to experience. Kind of like a waking dream, but one that's been created for you to experience.

 

Right now this is pure fantasy/sci-fi speculation, but I think it's technically something that could be achieved as we learn more about how the brain functions and processes information and stimulation. Essentially The Matrix, but without... you know, the robot war.

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1 hour ago, Captain Keen said:

 

I've actually wondered if we'd ever be able to basically activate dreams within people's minds to essentially use the mind as a CPU. Meaning, you design dreams that are like games, like virtual worlds, by triggering the mind to respond to a specific design that has been created for it to experience. Kind of like a waking dream, but one that's been created for you to experience.

 

Right now this is pure fantasy/sci-fi speculation, but I think it's technically something that could be achieved as we learn more about how the brain functions and processes information and stimulation. Essentially The Matrix, but without... you know, the robot war.

I think it's technically feasible, but you wouldn't want to necessarily use your own brain as the CPU/GPU. As humans we have a finite amount of energy available, and zapping it to power a simulation sounds a bit dangerous. I think that hacking is probably a better (albeit scarier) alternative, as it would use less of your body's energy. I think you'd still want a box running the majority of the computations, no?

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@Astronomical I don't know about saving gaming, I don't really know what that means.

 

But the emergence of indie games does introduce new ips, mechanics, ideas etc that once in a while shakes the market for the better (for the most part). It is a positive force.

 

For example, Minecraft really was a contrast to the triple A market in many key ways. Such as graphics, player freedom, affordability, accessibility, unique mechanics etc. It was the opposite of everything the big players were doing and yet it performed so damn well at such a cheap production cost. It inspired other games (good and bad) and demonstrated how just being unique and interesting without all of the fancy graphics, hollywood voice actors and millions on marketing spend can be successful.

 

Ok yes there is a shit load of bad indie games, but people don't want to play nor pay for shit games, naturally. If you don't like how they get exposure then you should be pointing your finger at steam platform and click bait youtubers trying to squeeze maximum results with minimal effort.

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8 hours ago, Graf Zahl said:

 

That won't happen. Quite the opposite. I expect another price hike for making AAA games, because there will be less competitors but ones with very deep pockets, so to outcompete each other they will have to invest ever more money to be in the lead.

 

If this really becomes a subscription platform war between Sony and Microsoft it'd also eliminate most of the risk of having a dud, because the platform fees will lower the financial risk considerably. They'd know how much money they can safely burn in a year, which makes planning a lot easier.

 

 

The gaming industry reputation is worsening more and more. But people continue to buy from the big players because they produce games people really want or just unaware / don't care of the ethics behind it. They can hike the price all they like but it won't mean it's sustainable or won't hurt themselves.

 

The more triple A companies want to charge the market with little added benefits the more they open themselves for cheaper, more ethical and unique competitors to cut their own piece of the pie.

 

Indie games have more prominence than ever before. Far from perfect but far better than the 90s and 2000s with mostly big titles available im retail stores and steam front page. Honestly I think it's gaming retailers, licensed titles and huge marketing budgets is what keeps the big games profitable. But in 20 years time anything can change.

 

Engines like Unity (I'm aware of all the crap that gets produced) is a sign that it's possible to produce games at a lower cost. I think the growth of double A titles may increase (which I classify games like Terminator Resistance and mount & Blade games as). They just don't have much opportunity to stand out in this current environment.

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5 hours ago, Koko Ricky said:

I think it's technically feasible, but you wouldn't want to necessarily use your own brain as the CPU/GPU. As humans we have a finite amount of energy available, and zapping it to power a simulation sounds a bit dangerous. I think that hacking is probably a better (albeit scarier) alternative, as it would use less of your body's energy. I think you'd still want a box running the majority of the computations, no?

 

All good points. Though I have a feeling "upgrades" to our brains will be happening sooner rather than later, meaning people will essentially hack their own bodies and minds to make them "better". All of this sounds like something from a sci-fi dystopian novel, but I feel like the technological seeds are already out there and in a few decades or a century, who knows...

 

For the record, I personally believe we need to proceed with caution with ALL of this stuff, including AI, and this could quickly spiral out of control and turn into something from a bad 80s/90s sci-fi movie.

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I’m sorry for derailing with a low effort post, but being a dork who likes playing games, Doom/wads saved me from ever getting too deep into this industry. The last time I actually spent money on a new game was 3 years ago, and it was probably another 3 years between that and the last purchase.

 

It used to be that 85% of my game-related time spent was Doom, but it’s even higher by now if anything. I’m so disconnected from the modern gaming zeitgeist.. They could stop making video games tomorrow and I don’t think it would even “click” with me that it had happened until like a year later, and even then it would just be me noticing it’s been a bit too long since I heard people whining about the last “big letdown” in gaming, heh

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2 hours ago, Doomkid said:

I’m so disconnected from the modern gaming zeitgeist.. They could stop making video games tomorrow and I don’t think it would even “click” with me that it had happened until like a year later, and even then it would just be me noticing it’s been a bit too long since I heard people whining about the last “big letdown” in gaming, heh

 

My general interest in gaming and watching the mainstream industry's stupidity consistently blow up in its face as a cheap source of entertainment are the only reasons I'm up to date with what's happening. But much like you, my friend, I stopped playing mainstream games a long time ago. Before I nestled in here with you lot in the Doom community, I had played nothing but indie games for the last 6 years. Everything happening in the big budget AAA space is just a sideshow attraction to me. The shit they've been doing for the past decade is a house of cards held together with duct tape and clown jizz. We're finally starting to see the cracks in the foundations with everything that's happened recently with Activision/Blizzard. We could be witnessing a huge shift for the industry. I'm curious to see which way the pendulum swings, knocks over the foundations and what emerges from the rubble. Mind you, that curiosity is almost purely morbid at this point given they're already flirting with Loot Box NFTs and that god-awful Metaverse thing Facebook is planning on inflicting upon the world.

 

Just grab yourself some popcorn and chuck another petrol can onto the dumpster fire, mate. Let's watch the motherfucker burn. 

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cyberpunk was the very last triple A game I bothered with... after that I have lost all interest in AAA gaming titles moving forward

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In 20 years Ebin Gaymes' Fortnite Battle Royale will become so powerful new games would release as alternative Fortnite modes rather than as their own original titles, lacking a representative as a Fortnite skin will become a globally accepted sign of irrelevancy and V-bux will become an actual alternative to currency IRL.

The future is bleak an default dancing.

Spoiler

I guess about nothing interesting will happen besides, probably, VR gaming development and\or ocassional shitshow (e.g. Google Stadia).

 

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I don't particularly involve myself with most mainstream stuff outside of some little exceptions like Monster Hunter or Total War as examples, I struggle to get excited for anything big as it is the norm to just shit thine bed in a spectacular fashion.

 

I mostly play Indie Throwback games. We've had the sprite based 2D platformers/shmups. We're at the point where 90's FPS are having a resurgence (with entries like Dread Templar, excellent game can't wait for the final) and I reckon we're going to see PS1/N64 styled indie games (hell we already are starting to see em). Then I think we'll be getting a few 3D platformers and PS2/Early Xbox styled games (think TimeSplitters, Black, Project Gotham ect) in the indie scene.

 

I reckon the indie scene, ironically, will be absolutely thriving, working for companies is miserable but with new tools and ease of access we are starting to see great quality products from independents. The scene is currently booming with no sight of slowing down, so I'd say things look very good for enjoyers of niche little throwbacks like me.

 

When we get a fanmade Ratchet and Clank spiritual successor then we'll be living the dream.

 

So yeah, optimistic for the smaller stuff to be honest.

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12 hours ago, Doomkid said:

I’m sorry for derailing with a low effort post, but being a dork who likes playing games, Doom/wads saved me from ever getting too deep into this industry. The last time I actually spent money on a new game was 3 years ago, and it was probably another 3 years between that and the last purchase. 

 

It used to be that 85% of my game-related time spent was Doom, but it’s even higher by now if anything. I’m so disconnected from the modern gaming zeitgeist.. They could stop making video games tomorrow and I don’t think it would even “click” with me that it had happened until like a year later, and even then it would just be me noticing it’s been a bit too long since I heard people whining about the last “big letdown” in gaming, heh 

 

I hear you on that, as Doom takes up more and more of my gaming life. However, there are still some good new titles imo. Just in the past few years, some games I've really enjoyed, including some major AAA stuff: Metro Exodus, Ori and the Will of the Wisps, Ghost of Tsushima, Disco Elysium, Control, No Man's Sky (after the last big update, Origins I think it was called), and of course Doom Eternal + TAG 1&2. Oh, and there was also the Quake 1 remaster and Black Mesa. The only big disappointment for me was Cyberpunk 2077, and even that very unfinished game wasn't nearly as bad as some people made it out to be, and had some pretty good writing and missions. I am pretty strict with what I play, though, and try not to waste time on bloated or bad games.

 

I'm currently looking forward to Horizon Forbidden West. And you go back a little further, and 2018 had both God of War and Red Dead Redemption 2, both which were fantastic, along with a pretty decent remake of Shadow of the Colossus.

 

EDIT: Oh, right, and the 2021 Mass Effect Legendary Edition was a really nice package of those three games, with a much needed overhaul for the first game. Even with its flaws, the OG Mass Effect trilogy is a top 5 game for me, right next to OG Doom, Deus Ex and BioShock.

Edited by Captain Keen

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Another thing I would love to see is for all games to become free to play. And I do not mean designed around microtransactions or any of that predatory crap, but really 100% free, like mods. Now, how the developers would be compensated for their work is a conversation in itself (maybe a guaranteed income so that all of them could live comfortable lives without having to worry about the necessities of life and making a profit?), but personally, I have zero problem paying for the games I have enjoyed. In fact, most of the games that I pirated as a teen, I ended up buying them legally when I finally became financially independent and/or when the games became available for sale again. Also, there are some games out there (e.g. Serious Sam: Bogus Detour) that I do not think I would have bothered with had I not been able to play them for free.

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On 2/2/2022 at 4:21 PM, Doomkid said:

I’m sorry for derailing with a low effort post, but being a dork who likes playing games, Doom/wads saved me from ever getting too deep into this industry. The last time I actually spent money on a new game was 3 years ago, and it was probably another 3 years between that and the last purchase.

 

It used to be that 85% of my game-related time spent was Doom, but it’s even higher by now if anything. I’m so disconnected from the modern gaming zeitgeist.. They could stop making video games tomorrow and I don’t think it would even “click” with me that it had happened until like a year later, and even then it would just be me noticing it’s been a bit too long since I heard people whining about the last “big letdown” in gaming, heh

I don't think this is a low effort post at all - it gets to the heart of a tangilbe malaise over the industry now, and therefore a fear that such a malaise will continue to drag something we love to the grave.

 

Everyone here enjoys Doom, and/or enjoys creating for it, and/or exploring the things that other people create for it, primarily because it allows everyone to participate however the hell they want. Like speedrunning and exploiting every design aspect of a near-thirty-year-old engine? Doom's for you. Like mowing down literally thousands of enemies amidst architecture on a scale so large your brain can't take it all in? Doom's for you. Like exploring insanely detailed architecture without the threat of any enemies? Doom's for you. Like platforming in the first-person perspective? You ain't gonna get your hit elsewhere, sister.

 

Compare that to "the industry": a twenty-four hour cycle of interminable grind because we've found a way to scientifically measure how much dopamine a given quest will dole out; of exploitative labour; of developers - people who wanted to create things - being told they should kill themselves; of crafting systems and open worlds being stuffed into everything because, well, it made someone else a bunch of money last month; of iterative sequels that are just there to pad our quarterlies; of selling everything piecemeal to extract every last dollar out of the filthy marks.

 

It's fucking exhausting.

 

Honey, is it any wonder we'd all rather be sat here, trying to help each other create instead?

 

Spoiler

I can't actually answer the OP, either :p

 

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Hopefully not the way Ubishit is trying to push gaming into. Loot boxes, p2w weapons/armor, xp boosts and flavor of the month updates in SINGLE PLAYER games.

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