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Naked Snake

My dream port / editor(s) for said port and programs with said port

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Let's start with the port :

Bots with GOOD AI
A DDF-like system except like better and with tons more features
An extended ACS system
Room over room
Add episodes with as many levels as you want
Have as many levels as you want
Real swimmable water
Movable / drivable stuff (like tanks or moving a crate)
A "manipulation" mode like Deus Ex
Extended deh and bex support
Good OpenGL and Direct3d support
Better sound
Decals on walls, ceilings and floors
A better HUB system
As many save games as you wish
Editable startup WAD selection list (like you'd get a menu that showed IWADS and ones you put in yourself like :

title:Hacx
iwad:doom2.wad
file:hacx.wad hacx.deh

This would make Hacx an option to start the port up with)
Full Strife support through mad guess-work, gross hacks and work-arounds
Good looking MD2 models for Doom(2), Heretic, Hexen, Strife and Hacx
Excellent OGGS for Doom(2) / Final Doom, Heretic, Hexen, Strife and Hacx
Colored sectors
Ability to set damage that sectors do
You can have as much crap as you want in your .wad
Translucency
Walk over / under crap
Multiple "paths" / endings
"Cameras" like in Duke 3d
End camera like in Quake
Better automap
Unlimited "slots" for guns (so, for all you gun mod nuts, you could have as many things as you want binded to any number key or letter)
Binding stuff to letters
Weapon modes (like a second set of primary and alt attacks)
Reloading for your weapons
Reloading for enemies
Random graphics / health / speed / attack for an enemy place (like, you could have a random type of zombie by doing this :

[ZOMBIEMAN:3004]
SPAWNHEALTH=20-50;
REACTION_TIME=0.23;
RADIUS=20;
HEIGHT=56;
SPEED=8-10;
MASS=100;
PAINCHANCE=78%;
SPECIAL=SKIN_RAND,COUNT_AS_KILL,SOLID,CLIMBABLE,SHOOTABLE,DISLOYAL,ATTACK_HURTS;
MINATTACK_CHANCE=22%;
CASTORDER=2;
BLOOD=BLOOD;
RESPAWN_EFFECT=RESPAWN_FLASH;
ACTIVE_SOUND=POSACT;
DEATH_SOUND="PODTH?";
PAIN_SOUND=POPAIN;
SIGHTING_SOUND="POSIT?";
OVERKILL_SOUND="SLOP";
DROPITEM=CLIP/PISTOL/UZI/BACKPACK;
RANGE_ATTACK=FORMER_HUMAN_PISTOL;

Support for inventory
Tons of special attacktypes for you and enemies, tons of powerup effects, enemy effects, and other cool stuff
Unlimited ammo-types
Changeable hud (like, you switch to a gun that uses another ammo-type, it'll show that ammo-type's count in place of another ammo-type, like, BULL 400/400 gets replaces with .357 50/50 if you switch to a .357)
Interactive menu support like Soldier of Fortune
Weapon upgrades
Silent attacks
"Mode Attacks" (attacks done by pressing "mode")
Accessory toggle (like, you get an Uzi with a silencer, but the silencer makes it fire slower, so you can toggle the silencer)
A money system
"Stealth" (like avoiding cameras and stuff)
Alternate enemy deaths (like, you can make it so that zombies, when killed by a flamethrower, run around on fire)
Item benefit randomization (like, you can make a medkit, when picked up say "You found a partially used medkit" and give you 15% health)
A special that, when berserk powered up, makes that attack stronger (so, if you have an attack like say, stab with bayonet, it'll be stronger if you're berserked up)
Custom screen colours and effects for pickup
Destroyable terrain
Interactivity (like, you see a book, hit "use" and start reading it)
Extras, when enabled, would do the following :

Some decorations can be destroyed
Hanging corpses can be shot
Burning barrels have smoke effects and can hurt you if you stand on them
Exploding barrels spew shrapnel like a mofo and start fires and decorations have "alt deaths", like, flamethrower a tree, watch it set on fire.
Enemies can "fake" their death, "plead" and heal themselves.
Removes all limits
Enemies can have inventory items
Friendlies have the same properties as enemies (in what can be done to them) and you.
A "talk" system with multiple responses, like :

"I want you to kill this guy

Yes < ok, do this and this > | ok / no way < "yes" ok, now blah... > < "no way" then die!>
No < then die! >" (and using the extended ACS, you could do things like a certain choice can affect the outcome)
Slopes
Mirrors
Reflective surfaces (OpenGL / D3D ONLY)
Freelook (dur)
180-turn (like in Duke 3d)
Killing things / destroying things can make the player say a one-liner (either text or voice)
Shotcoun for weapon attacks (and alt attacks)
Ammo per shot for weapon attacks (and alt attacks)

Now onto DM crap

32 players (LAN ONLY), 16 through the internet
Tons of DM flags and stuff
Mic support
Unlimited macros
An "RTS" type file like from Duke 3d
DM demo recording from all player's POV
Spectator mode
Co-op spy improved (shows your health, armor and if you're getting hit while in spy mode)
Team stats (like, you can cycle through their health, armor, ammo and see their location as to where you are)

Programs :

Bot-maker

Select skin from a .wad (ZDoom and Legacy)
Set responses (random, death, fragged you, suicide, won match, lost match, replies to what you say, replies to what other bots say)
Other animations
Sounds
Aim % (1 meaning they'll never hit anything to 100 which means they always hit what they aim for with bullet weapons)
Speed (1 meaning they won't move, 255 meaning ungodly fast)
Power (1 meaning that, even with 200% armor, they'll die in one hit, 100 meaning that it takes a fuckload of hits to wear them down)
Smarts (1 meaning they're too stupid to use doors and switches or avoid painful stuff, 100 being they use doors and switches and will avoid painful stuff at all costs and will set "traps" too)
Fighting Style : careful (they'll dodge pretty well but sacrifice aim), camper (they'll camp powerful stuff and generally be a pain), sniper (they will shoot from a safe hiding spot when they can and they hardly move), insane (they'll run into a room firing like crazy and will often times suicide) and 1337 (they have great aim, great at dodging, smart, they camp sometimes and snipe sometimes)

Server Creator

Set DM flags
Set master password
Set game options
Set player limit
Set client limit

MENU CRAP
(menu that shows list of players, their pings, scores and time playing)
Highlight a name to use following options : Kick (reason), Kick (no reason), Ban (reason), Ban (no reason), Talk (if no nicks are selected, it will say to all)
Log : on / off (logs everything from who joined, their average ping, what they said, server messages, filters out pickup messages)
See ban list : remove, modify, set timer (timer format ## m(inutes), h(ours), d(ays), w(eeks),
Set MOTD (MOTD format : (no need for closers, just use the same opener, like <bold>text<bold> does bold.
<bold>
<blink=#> (# = 1-5, 1 being slow, 5 being fast)
<color=*color*> (red, white, blue, green, yellow, purple, brown, ect)
<underline>
<strike>
<scrollside=#> (# = 1-5, 1 being slow, 5 being fast)
<scrollupdown=#> (# = 1-5, 1 being slow, 5 being fast)
<italic>
<size=#> (# = 1-6, 1 being tiny, 3 being normal, 6 being huge)
<line> (like breakline)
MOTD is limited to 10 lines and 50 characters per line (MOTD formating doesn't count)
Server name
Set wad(s) (browse)
WAD(s) URL : URL(s)
Your e-mail
Your nick
Set fraglimit
Set timelimit

DM Launcher

List servers
List server's average ping
List players on server
List their frags, ping, time
See frag/time limit
See max player / client limit
See mode (co-op, DM, CTF, domination, one flag CTF, bombing run, ect)
Set your nick / skin
Select RTS file
Set up macros

Editor

Support for Doom, Heretic, Hexen, Strife and Hacx
Can place stuff from other games into other games (as long as you provide graphcis / sounds / everything else)
Scripting
Real-time viewing (like Build)
Room over room
Set thing properties (like, set what a zombieman drops, his health, other scripting crap)
Set decals (tons of decals pre-done, can import decals)
Texture alignment
BSP-ize the WAD
Set auto-save timer
Auto-save on quit
Auto-create backup file
Set HUD stuff
Set level name / level number
Read your custom defenition files
Tons of other crap you'd probably all want...

Supar Rippar

Can rip open pretty all game files
Auto-loads the pallate
Can view / hear selected entry
Can save entries to file as any type you'd like, default is no file-type
Can open editing program of your choice
Can read deh / bex files
Can read script files
Can create a new file (like .wad, .grp, whatever)

So, yeah, there's my long-ass rant. Feel free to add features, heh. BTW, I'm not making a port like this, I'm just spilling out everything I'd like to see in a port.

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A port that I really wish somebody would make would be something around this:


Features: Should work flawlessly on Windows (other versions should exist for other major OS'es).

High screen resolutions (like every modern port has).

Support of modern soundcards (like every other portswith the exception of MBF has).

Loading of custom sprites/textures/flats (like every other respectable port has).

Loading of Deh's

And that's about sums it up. The rest should be entirely like original Doom(2) with all the old features, limitations and quirks.

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Wow! That's a pretty damn long list you got there. :p Well, all I want is a port that is as stable as Zdoom (not the betas. They crash my comp :[...), has the awesome editing capabilites like EDGE DDF except there's some more cool features (i think most of it has been said by BBG), the ability to do cool dives, flips and somersaults like in the HalfLife mod, The Opera, and a console command to activate Bullet Time :p!!! Oh and stable internet multiplayer support and bots too.

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Here's what I want-
DOS, Alternate OS supports.
Latest Zdoom + Full True Inventory support.
Anti-Lag (better performance rates)
Ability for Random attacks for enemies.
More projectile code pointers for player weapons. (deh-bex)
Editor that can handle the above parts.

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BBG said:

Some decorations can be destroyed
Hanging corpses can be shot

I started a dehacked patch and sprites for destructable items over 6 years ago. I couldn't get the new sprites to work in-game and eventually gave up on it, but I finished "death" sprites for Doom2's Big & Tiny Lamps, Burning Barrels, Green Red & Blue Small Torches, Large Brown Tree and Small Brown Stump. Some were really good, some could use improvement. I'll post them if I can find them.

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Little Faith said:

A port that I really wish somebody would make would be something around this:


Features: Should work flawlessly on Windows (other versions should exist for other major OS'es).

High screen resolutions (like every modern port has).

Support of modern soundcards (like every other portswith the exception of MBF has).

Loading of custom sprites/textures/flats (like every other respectable port has).

Loading of Deh's

And that's about sums it up. The rest should be entirely like original Doom(2) with all the old features, limitations and quirks.


If anyone were to make such a port, it should probably not even have the stated additions (hi res, DEH, sprite and flat auto adding, etc.) and it would be just to preserve the possiblity of "experiencing" the original EXE for people who don't have a DOS-based OS, even just for "a look around" or for editing (but even doom.exe without sound is good for this.) Otherwise, using prboom with all compatibilities you get pretty much what you are asking for, except the most the most lethal or useless bugs, such as VPOs, HOMs and disappearing sprites. And unless I have been misinformed or "heard" incorrectly, even zdoom has a lot of comapatibilities in the latest versions...

The truth is that, if anyone really likes the old EXEs, he or she can have a copy of Windows 98 or DOS for just that reason (set up on double boot or on a separate, older, computer.) Intermediate ports like the one you mention would be pointless. Prboom itself, with the boom additions and stuff, isn't too popular, and the one you mention would be even less so...

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Little Faith said:

A port that I really wish somebody would make would be something around this:


Features: Should work flawlessly on Windows (other versions should exist for other major OS'es).

High screen resolutions (like every modern port has).

Support of modern soundcards (like every other portswith the exception of MBF has).

Loading of custom sprites/textures/flats (like every other respectable port has).

Loading of Deh's

And that's about sums it up. The rest should be entirely like original Doom(2) with all the old features, limitations and quirks.

This sounds precisely like the current zdoom 2.0 beta 37 to me. I think all of the old features etc. are setable in the compatibility options menu now.

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myk said:

The truth is that, if anyone really likes the old EXEs, he or she can have a copy of Windows 98 or DOS for just that reason (set up on double boot or on a separate, older, computer.) Intermediate ports like the one you mention would be pointless. Prboom itself, with the boom additions and stuff, isn't too popular, and the one you mention would be even less so...


I actually run Win98. It's mainly the soundcard that keeps me from using old Doom2.exe (and MBF).

Too bad. I always felt the first Memento Mori soundtrack was meant for Doom2.exe's inbuilt crappy synth. At least "Triangle of Fear" (D_RUNNI2) sounded really cool with it (and really lame with more conventional MIDI).

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Rotating, scaling and inverting textures for editing
Flat alignment like you would textures
Textures that can be used as flats, and vise-versa
Heat warping
Moving lights (I mean lights from an actual moving source, not the Hexen phased lighting effect)
Anti-gravity (Can walk on ceilings like in the game Metal Storm)
Mirrored floors and maybe walls.
Snow, rain, and other weather effects (maybe even hail large enough to cause a little damage for each hailstone that hits you or the enemy)
Sectors and floors that affect enemies like they do the player (lava hurts monsters, ice makes them slide around)

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Little Faith said:

Too bad. I always felt the first Memento Mori soundtrack was meant for Doom2.exe's inbuilt crappy synth. At least "Triangle of Fear" (D_RUNNI2) sounded really cool with it (and really lame with more conventional MIDI).

ZDoom now uses a built-in synth that gives oldschool sound :)

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Ok... I think I need some documentation of the latest Zdoom's features and how to enable/disable them.

Where to look?

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Little Faith said:

A port that I really wish somebody would make would be something around this:


Features: Should work flawlessly on Windows (other versions should exist for other major OS'es).

High screen resolutions (like every modern port has).

Support of modern soundcards (like every other portswith the exception of MBF has).

Loading of custom sprites/textures/flats (like every other respectable port has).

Loading of Deh's

And that's about sums it up. The rest should be entirely like original Doom(2) with all the old features, limitations and quirks.

Doom '95 has all of that except sprite, flat and DEH loading.

BTW, doom(2).exe has no problems with loading custom textures, it's just sprites and flats that give it trouble. Although there is one port that has problems loading custom textures, namely Skulltag :)

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Little Faith said:

I actually run Win98. It's mainly the soundcard that keeps me from using old Doom2.exe (and MBF).

Too bad. I always felt the first Memento Mori soundtrack was meant for Doom2.exe's inbuilt crappy synth. At least "Triangle of Fear" (D_RUNNI2) sounded really cool with it (and really lame with more conventional MIDI).

Ever heard of windoom?

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Basicaly, it would be like the Build engine, except without the stupid stuff like getting killed when clipping out of the map. Most source ports these days seem to be mostly there. The only things that I haven't seen are true room-over-room stuff, some various lighting effects (such as the room lighting up when a door opens), and moving sectors (used for subways and such in DN).

Also, a decent launcher that actualy works would be nice. The ZDoom Launcher is how it should be, except working. :P

An all-in-one editor for it would be good, including map making, texture editing, and a DeHackEd style program.

Oh yeah, one other thing thats in Duke Nukem which I don't think is in any Doom ports is the ability to make water sectors next to normal sectors. Like you could make a water sector then a normal sector right next to each other in Build, then have the linedef between the two be impassible and put the glass pane sprite between the two and you'd have an aquarium.

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the_Danarchist said:

true room-over-room stuff

EDGE, Legacy and Vavoom all have this. Oh, and let's not forget RoRDoom of course :)

some various lighting effects (such as the room lighting up when a door opens)

This has been possible in ZDoom for well over three years ;) In fact, one of the first ever ZDoom example wads has this effect in it (right at the start as it so happens):

http://zdoom.notgod.com/ftp/demo.zip

Like you could make a water sector then a normal sector right next to each other in Build, then have the linedef between the two be impassible and put the glass pane sprite between the two and you'd have an aquarium.

This has also been possible in ZDoom for quite some time.

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exactly like doom2.exe but with full windows support and hom/vpo/disappearing sprites removed.

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Erik said:

exactly like doom2.exe but with full windows support and hom/vpo/disappearing sprites removed.

Um, PrBoom is already here. :P

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A fast and stable GL port that has everything BBG has mentioned, plus some of the stuff mentioned by other people.

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Anyone seen Tenebrae Quake in action? It'll be great to have a doom port that is like Tenebrae quake. Chances are though that we'll just have to wait for doom3.

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I want ZDoom with a built in editor like build which runs like DCK.

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This has been possible in ZDoom for well over three years ;)


This effect actually dates back to MBF, maybe as far back as Boom. If memory serves, Jim Flynn created it but Lee perfected it.

And yeah, a Doom version of Tenebrae would kick ass.

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Editable startup WAD selection list (like you'd get a menu that showed
IWADS and ones you put in yourself like :

title:Hacx
iwad:doom2.wad
file:hacx.wad hacx.deh


KDX can do that, it's a feature called VWAD's (Virtual WAD Files]
For Hacx it would look like this.

Contents of file: hacx_v.wad

VWAD

$iwad=doom2.wad
$pwad=c:\doom2\hacx.wad
$deh=c:\doom2\hacx.deh

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ravage said:

Um, PrBoom is already here. :P

Yes, but no way is it 'exactly' like doom2.exe unfortunately.

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JoelMurdoch said:

This effect actually dates back to MBF, maybe as far back as Boom. If memory serves, Jim Flynn created it but Lee perfected it.


True enough, it is used in the boomedit example WAD.

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ZarcyB said:

I want ZDoom with a built in editor like build which runs like DCK.

Coders LOOK HERE! :)

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BBG:
A lot of this is already available in ZDoom. Much of it has already been demonstrated, but for that which hasn't, ask Enjay, Deep, Biff, LittleWhiteMouse, GooberMan, Tarin, so on...

* Room-over-room: Almost fully simulatable in ZDoom using Transfer_Heights and bridge-objects.
* As many levels as you want: Done in ZDoom.
* Real swimmable water: Done in ZDoom, aside from having a transparent surface like in Legacy. There's a way to fake it, though.
* Good GL: Wait to see how ZGL turns out.
* Decals: Done for walls in ZDoom, Randy mentioned implementing them for ceilings/floors once by uisng Build's flat-sprite method.
* Better sound: Done in ZDoom with FMOD.
* Better HUB system? Did you mean HUD? Either way, ZDoom's hub system is probably the best, and some additional HUD stuff can be faked with ACS, custom fonts, and HudMsg.
* Editable IWAD selection: I asked Randy for that once. Dunno if he considered it.
* Colored sectors: Done in ZDoom, can have completely colored sectors or "foggy" sectors.
* As much crap as you want in your wad... uh... yeah?
* Translucency: Done in ZDoom, works for sprites and textures.
* Multiple "paths" / endings: Scriptable in ZDoom.
* Cameras like in Duke3d: Done in ZDoom. With some additional scripting, the behavior can be *exactly* like in Duke3d.
* End camera like in Quake: Can easily be done in ZDoom. Make a switch that poses as the exit, but instead sets the player to be still and notarget, then switches out to a camera that has been placed somewhere in the level to show some big dramatic scene, then end the level after a few seconds.
* Better automap: Done in ZDOOM! (IMO)
* Unlimited "slots" for guns: Sorta done in ZDoom. If you have supplied the sprites for all the heretic and hexen weapons, you can set keys to switch to those weapons, even while playing Doom.
* Binding stuff to letters: Done in ZDoom...
* Weapon modes: Wait for DoomScript, maybe?
* Reloading: DoomScript.
* Randomizable enemy behavior: DoomScript.
* Support for inventory: Done in ZDoom, if you have inventory items. I imagine you can probably use the heretic/hexen inventory in Doom, too.
* Ammo types: DoomScript.
* Silent attacks: DoomScript.
* Money system: Doable in ZDoom with some scripting. Gotta set a few... universal(?) variables and use a hub system instead of standard level endings. LittleWhiteMouse has already done it.
* Interactivity: ZDoom. Scripting. Mostly doable.
* Hanging corpses can be shot: DeHackable.
* Burning barrels hurt: I think there was some ZDoom bit that could set things to be like... spikes... or something.
* Chat system: GooberMan has done it in ZDoom.
* Slopes: Done in ZDoom
* Mirrors: Done in ZDoom
* Reflective surfaces: Was in old ZGL
* 180 degree turn: I keep my mouse speed high enough that it isn't a problem. :P
* Killing things causes player to say one-liner: Scriptable in ZDoom.
Ammo per shot customizable: Done in ZDoom.

* 32 players? With a money system? You're looking to make some kind of MMORPG, aren't you?
* Mic support: Roger Wilco, Battlecom, etc. There was an article on the Coop Certification Laboratory about some various programs.
* Unlimited macros: With unlimited keybinding, you can just bind chat messages instead of using the standard macros.

* OGGs and MD2s... do it yourself. :P

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