The DWmegawad Club plays: Community Chest

[Gibbon]

29 minutes ago, Book Lord said:

It's the 28th today...

Just shoot me…

 

I guess it wasn’t as long a weekend as I thought.  Why did I think it was the 29th..

 

Edit: Fixed it my Lord!

 

 

Edited March 28, 2022 by Gibbon

[RHhe82]

17 minutes ago, Gibbon said:

Why did I think it was the 29th..

Based on your earlier post, I find it very much obvious as to why you thought one more day had already passed ;-)

[NiGHTS108]

MAP28: Necrophobia

By Gene Bird

Kills: 89%

Items: 95%

Secrets: 50%

Time: 11:28

 

A very neutral experience before the grand finale, Necrophobia is one last SSG-fest made even easier by excessive secrets thanks to the automap, there's really not much to say here at all, Necrophobia doesn't have an identity, it looks eh and plays eh, however this soulsphere room is probable Gene Bird's best visual moment, and for once I like the ridiculous placement of this map, it's an effective coffee break from the last map and what. Comes. Next.

 

Grade: C

Difficulty: D

 

 

1 day left.

[finnks13]

MAP28 - Necrophobia by Gene Bird:
Gene Bird's final contribution to Community Chest is his personal favourite of his "Blind Alley" series, if his comments on kmxexii's profile are anything to go by. And I've gotta say, while I think I prefer The Boardwalk for it's action, this is a pretty close second. There's significantly more variety in height and therefore, verticality to the fights than the norm for Gene Bird's maps and this makes it play pretty well. There's a reasonable number of traps, and ambushes and they're pretty solid overall.

 

The visual design is also much better than what I've come to expect from Gene Bird's work, he sticks to the hell fortress theme for the majority of the map, and I think it's his best looking map by quite a far margin. It's not going to blow any minds, but I appreciate the simple fun that this map offers, as well as the break between Afterlife and the next map.

 

Rankings:

Spoiler

Really Liked: MAP02, MAP07, MAP17, MAP21
Liked: MAP04, MAP09, MAP13, MAP14, MAP31, MAP16, MAP18, MAP23, MAP28
The Boring Zone: MAP03, MAP11, MAP15, MAP32, MAP19, MAP24, MAP26
Didn't Like: MAP01, MAP05, MAP08, MAP12, MAP20, MAP22, MAP27
Really Didn't Like: MAP06, MAP10, MAP25

 

Edited March 28, 2022 by finnks13 : i made a sentence actually make sense lol

[kalaeth]

monday, time to catch up.

 

MAP 26 - Breakout : 

Marbletech! A pair of pinkies say hi, then a imp 'ports in, the bars that were all around me at start disappear and shotguners and zombies show up. In the big room a pair of HKs in cages. Only one door I can open, a caco, pinkies and imps in a room with lava on the floor, and then steps up. More pinkies, 'porting in shotgunners and imps, outside 3 cacos dance, go up some more steps, a berseker guarded by imps and lost souls, a cage with a chaingun, opening it brings a couple revs and then, to the side a switch that brings me down to the cage with a button on the first room. And a trap! A HK and a chaingunner! The door is now open, as are the cages where the HKs were, so I go through and find the red key, out of reach. Up some steps, switch, it opens a door to a wooden stairway going down, to the outside where I shower the many enemis with rockets. I open a door into a corridor with arches and pinkies, shotguners on the first, chaingunners on the second and shotgunners again on the third. Approaching the door opens side walls and chaingunners come out to play. Kill them, switch, same thing on the other side. This second switch opens the door, inside a fake door and a lift, leading to a big room with a spider, up some steps a altar with the RL. I grab it and run so i can use it on the HKs and baron that show up, and then discover which of the HK closet has a secret. Then, more steps up, into a small room with 3 doors that release revs. Press button, go back up in the lift, and it's a brown bridge room, and out of distraction I end up falling in the sludge and finding a secret stash of suits. From there I go back outside, back inside, cross the bridge and there's a red switch and a normal one I press. Small corridor and a door, HK in there, wooden corridor with a trap baron at the exit! Up some marble steps, follow to a switch, press, a pair of revs, another switch. It opens a door, up steps, kill many, down steps, kill rev, press switch, and it's an AV! Also, the plasma gun. Open door and I'm outside the red key room, grab some rockets, go outside, cause mayhem, enter the cave, go to the end of it, teleport, clear room, teleport again, clear the room and die to a rev ball from far away.

 Restart outside the cave, back to the YSK, and now.. Back to the room with the teleports and the pillars, a switch. Daamn, barons and HKs, a lot. Kill them all, and checking the map I can tell only one of the pillars has 2 switches, so that's the one I climb, press and then it's all the way back to the red key. Grab it, run back to the red button. Door opens, I'm outside and I can grab the YSK? No, I can not. But I can open the red door, kill the baron, and reach the library. Kill imps, shotgunners, revs and even a pain elemental. Save, switch, up some steps, nothing to do here, back down, teleport, kill a chaingunner, teleport, and I have the YSK. Bars lower and I can leave this place, go back, open the yellow door, kill skulls, teleport. I'm on a cage, kill all, press switch, teleport back. Then all the way back to the two switches and the yellow door, more skulls, and I reached the exit. There's 2 secrets and 2 enemies to go.. Secret 1 and two skulls, down. The remaining secret.. IDDT showed me where but not how. And I don't much feel like trying to figure it out so.. grab healths, exit.

Checking the other reviews, it appears I would have to backtrack from the exit? But I did do that, so I don't know? AH, I'll do it again. Ah! success.

 

K/I/S : 100% / 100% / 100%

time : 39:39 / 11:55:29

deaths : 1 / 33

 

MAP 27 - Afterlife :

I love this "starting inside a grave" thing! After exiting the small graveyard, first I take a tour of the city, and eventually reach the one door with green torches. from there I return to the graveyard to pick up the SSG, and returning back to the door I find that another building is now open. It offers a passage to the upper level of the city, eventually ending in some yellow bars on one side, a HK on the other. A secret backpack was there, and a path leads to the blue key while the other leads to the port. The water is damaging blood, and floating in the air above it a caco and a invincibility sphere.. Weird. A red door and a yellow door mark the other exits from the port, and at the end of the pier there's a switch. Pressing it lowers some invisible thing and I can now enter the boat, where a chaingunner and a rev guard the yellow key. I pick it up and then enter the door to the cargo bay, where a rev guards the plasma gun. I pick it up, press a switch that I am not sure what it did, I go down, pick the invincibility, open the yellow door, and there's a bridge across blood, and on a small pedestal behind the building the RSK. After that I enter the building, where pressing the eye raises a bridge and another switch that doesn't switch. But, hidden there's another button, not sure if it was it that raised the stairs r not, but it works. Up there I reach a red door, cross to the other side, press a switch, a 'port with a RL. And from there, another teleport and I decide to go back, red door at the port, cross it all, reach the blood pool, invincibility, use it to cross the blood, back to the port, back to the city and back to that first building I entered, since on the first go I missed the sides. So this time I explore them, and reach the secrets, which were actually really easy to find.Now, full of life I go back to the port, cross it, reach the end and go back because I found the switch I need and the way to reach it, red door, and to the side, switch, opening a path and reaching at another door with one more bluesphere and bluearmor, to the sides. Open door, spider, sniper imps, and a switch. Pressing it reveals a lift and in it a baron. Also HKs and the path to the exit. However! I'm 2 secrets and 3 enemies short. This time the bluesphere and bluearmor don't count as secrets, so I go back. One caco in the teleport room, and from there both secrets! In one go, weird, but I'll accept it. Now, I'm two enemies short.. found them. A pair of chaingunners. Done, exit.

 

K/I/S : 100% / 100% / 100%

time : 41:11 / 12:36:40

deaths : 0 / 33

 

MAP 28 - Necrophobia :

Oh look, more brown! Also, both shotguns. Nice effect in the ceiling. I open the door and there's another SSG there, door, door, wooden corridor with auto-closets, and eventually a door. Steps up, steps down and a secret wall, and a teleport to the secret seen from the start. Jump back, keep on going. Another door and marble! Large marble room, the automap in a not-secret secret-like lift, grab the map, 'port, and I'm in a round marble room, with a door that won't open... Oh, look at that : another switch. Open door, kill imp, open door, kill pinkie, imp, shotgunner, and instead of grabbing the sphere I teleported through bloodflow. Back to the big marble room to press a switch, it opens up a wall and another door. Big symmetric courtyard, doors won't open but there's a switch I use, then inside a door another and now I have a teleport. A caged HK and some imps, a switch to open another switch, to open the cage to press another switch and then 'port back. Another door is open, with a switch inside, opening a door to a corridor, switch at the end, another door there. And guess what is in there? You are right! A switch. And another door is open. Some marble steps leading to a brown yard where a caco flies but not for long : I castrate his wings with my SSG. Lift, lift, red key, red switch, back, and the final door is open! Kill a imp, open door, open door, de-imp the place, don't discover how to reach the megasphere yet so.. door. Switch, outside, door, switch, outside, door, switch, grab key, teleport, that as expected leads to the mega, down , outside, yellow door, imp, teleport, kill stuff, enter the last secret, switch, back down, door, feed some rockets to the hitscanners, end level. But not before pressing yet another switch.

 

K/I/S : 100% / 95% / 100%

time : 16:35 / 12:53:16

deaths : 0 / 33

 

A nice little breather of a switch hunt before tomorrow's dreaded map.  

[LadyMistDragon]

Map 28: Necrophobia by Gene Bird

Music: "Dead Plumber's Song" by ClumsyDoomer from Plutonia Midi Pack

Played continuously with Whitemare class from Final Doomer

 

After the depressing adventure of the last map, I knew I wasn't about to use the replacement from MIDtwId. Thankfully, the slightly atmospheric, yet action-filled track from Plutonia works very well.

 

Anyways, first impressions aren't exactly so strong here. Opening hallway looks copypasted from Monster Mansion and you spend the opening shotgunning Imps, but things quickly improve and you're blessed with a greater diversity of combat than almost any Gene Bird map up to this point, frequently encountering Hell Knights, Mancubi and Revenants among others, many coming out of closets that open on your way. As other people have said, there's also greater height variance than in many other Gene maps. The linear central courtyard where Revenants and Chaingunners are located on both sides is an especially strong example of this, despite somehow not seeming too threatening to players always on the move.

 

I also greatly appreciate some of the extra visual touches. The room with the portal that Mt.Pain mentioned in his video was definitely the best visual setpiece but I also liked the blood pool room with its hint at the potential for cinematic setpieces, as well as the staired room near the end with the Cacodemon and Chaingunner at the bottom. Granted, the secret here where you leap off the ledge is kind of silly, but secrets here actually feel workable unlike again, Gene's other maps.

 

I sort of wish I took better notes here, but there's really not much to this map. One thing's certain however, and it's a considerably better map than Monster Mansion, despite containing lesser amounts of foes and not having the same amount of encouragement for rocketing enemies.

[Jaccident]

Map 28: Necrophobia

I actually really enjoyed this one, its probably the best Gene Bird map. Its progression is good, most of the fights are fun, it’s just a decent level. It’s a shame it starts out in typical Gene Bird fashion, with you using a shotgun to kill some imps in a rectangular room, but from there the quality increases. The general progression is actually quite enjoyable, with you visiting different doors from a main area to open the next door, although the texturing still isn’t that great. Generally, this map felt like a last hurrah, with there being a general sense of foreboding thanks to the next map in the set.

[Silhouette 03]

Map27: Afterlife-Sphange

Sphange's curtain call.

 

It seems we've come to Sphange's final offering in Community chest. It's one of those maps I don't feel strongly about. First off, the layout is way too uninteresting to look at. I wasn't exacting a grand scale layout like something from a modern day wad, but as it stands it is way too simplistic. I had to skip several encounters as the map suffers from the exact same problem that Sphange's other two maps suffered from. If you've been reading my posts( thanks for reading, by the way) then you know exactly what problem I'm talking about. I'm really sick of repeating said problem. I do like the ship on the blood lake. I don't really understand why enemies were floating in the sky and were lowered and why the platforms they were on were untextured.

 

I hope Sphange's maps at least found an audience in the community. It would be sad if they didn't.

 

Kills: 93%

Secrets: 100%

 

Map28: Necrophobia-Gene Bird

Another final map by Gene Bird

 

I don't have all that such to say about Bird's final contribution. Between map 19, 32 and this, I choose this map. I've also noticed that for some strange reason, The architecture tends to become more complex as the map goes on. The first few rooms of the map are very basic and uninteresting and then suddenly the next few areas look really good. Maybe it's just me. I also found a missing texture in the one secret with the two rockets. I'm not sure how that wasn't seen through playtesting.

 

You all are making me really anxious about map 29. What awaits us? I await with bated breath.

 

Kills: 99%

Secrets: 75%   

[RHhe82]

MAP28: Necrophobia. DSDA v0.24, HMP-Cont. 185/185 kills, 4/4 secrets. Completion time 19:37.

 

Our favourite Dean has troubled relationship with Gene Bird. I might as well have if I had played CC2, I suppose, but for now I consider Gene a godsend. Necrophobia doesn't look bad at all (aside from a couple of less-than-stellar choices here and there), and my god it's fun after misery that was MAP27. In any case it's easily the best Gene Bird map in CC1, it even has varied combat, not just SSG fest we have previously seen from GB, although SSG will suffice here just fine.

 

Nothing special, but sometimes you need a breather level. I guess, to be honest, Necrophobia benefits from coming after Afterlife. Gene's level doesn't stretch beyond infinity, it's a level that's not being a dick or anything. Thank you, Gene. You're alright in my books.

[FrancisT218]

[Did fresh voting further down on this page]

Edited March 29, 2022 by FrancisT218

[Andromeda]

On 3/25/2022 at 7:21 PM, FistMarine said:

MAP20: Technodrome

 

That last part with the timed bomb at end was annoying as you have two minutes to escape (and various monsters teleport in), you can't get 100% everything (at least not all kills), maximum I remember getting 440-444 monsters killed (out of 464 total) with save-scumming.

 

You can actually get all kills by skipping the switch that triggers the bomb, as demonstrated in this demo.

 

On 3/25/2022 at 7:21 PM, FistMarine said:

MAP21: Avenger

 

A long and annoying map, some annoying traps, few unreachable secrets (at least in PrBoom+, there would be two unreachable secrets) and some parts almost killed me.

 

One of the unreachable secrets can actually be reached, see the description of secret #6 here.

 

37 minutes ago, Silent Wolf said:

Map27: Afterlife-Sphange

 

I hope Sphange's maps at least found an audience in the community. It would be sad if they didn't.

 

Well, I'm glad they exist. I mentioned a few days ago in another thread that Community Chest was feeling rather underwhelming, but the strong last episode and especially Sphagne's levels changed that. Challenging, resource-starved, with decent looks and interesting layouts - just how I like them!

[PeceMan]

Level 28, Necrophobia

 

    That was pretty easy.

 

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it was a bad level. It was just a lot easier than what I was expecting.

 

    A lot of imps and a lot of shotgunners. A bunch of pinkies, revenants, chaingunners. And a couple Cacodemons and HKs when the level felt

    like ramping up the challenge. There was always plenty of space to maneuver around the enemies, so the main way the player would take

    damage was due to the sniping hitscanners.

 

    There was also a lot of health pickups and a lot of ammunition. There's a Rocket Launcher and a Plamsa Gun, but I only used those a couple of

    times, and the main reason why I used them was because of a feeling of obbligation.

    "The level designer gave me these tools, it would be disrespectful of me not to use them; even if I don't really need them."

 

    As said, almost all enemies present die to either one or two hits from the SSG.

 

 

 

    It's a decent level. The aeesthetics were solid, the gameplay was entertaining, the layout was interesting...

 

    I would've probably appreciated the level a lot more if it hadn't been placed in the 28th slot.

    For the 28th level, I was just expecting something with a little more bite.

 

 

 

Ratings:

Spoiler

Five Stars:        
            02 Nullth Precinct; 18 Sudden Death

 

Four Stars:            
            04 Outer Base; 05 The Forgotten Prison; 07 The Boardwalk; 08 Battery; 10 Termination Center; 11 Mandrel; 14 Substation; 

            20 Technodrome; 22 Future Grave; 26 Breakout; 27 Afterlife; 28 Necrophobia

 

Three Stars:        
            01 Pistol Panic; 03 Ground Floor; 09 Flow; 13 Another Dead Hero; 15 Infernal Reaches; 16 Methods of Fear; 17 Inflictions of Hate;

            32 The Citadel; 21 Avenger; 23 Blood Runners

 

Two Stars:        
            12 No Tomorrow; 31 Mt. Chaos; 24 Bring Evil Upon Thee; 25 Blood Demesne

 

One Star:    
            06 Goin' Down; 19 Monster Mansion

 

 

Only two levels left, and one of them is the fabled 29

[Yumheart]

Map28 "Necrophobia" by Gene Bird

I can only agree with most other voices here in that this is one of, if not the best Gene Bird map in this set.
The first few rooms don't make much of an impression, admittedly, but after enduring a bit of corridor shooting, Necrophobia develops into a fun little switch hunt with relaxed, but not unengaging combat, thanks to the much higher usage of verticality, snipers, monsters attacking from different directions and the occasional trap to keep you on your toes. (I also noticed the teleport ambushes working far better than back in Map32, they are a lot snappier now!)
It's still a bit basic, but one can see a decisive increase in sophistication in this map, coming from The Citadel or even Monster Mansion.

Not much more to say, this is a fun, brisk and appreciated breather before a certain Map29. Nice work, @Searcher ^ v^

[Poncho1]

Map29: Citadel at the Edge of Eternity

Author: Kevin Reay (Magikal)

 

This is it: THE map from Community Chest that we all remember. And what a level to build up to. In a way, it's somewhat fitting that this was indeed Magikal's final map before his tragic death. What a legacy he left. Citadel at the Edge of Eternity is a behemoth of a level, epic in its grandeur and its disgust towards the player. The author makes use of everything to test the player's abilities: forced wallrunning, repetitive scenarios, fake bridges, tight combat, stingey ammo and health distribution, and numerous puzzles that'll disorient the uninitiated. Rather obviously, I saved throughout this level. 10 mid-level saves later, I beat the map just under the 2-hour mark, in-game time. The whole east wing should be a taster of things to come: multiple identical-looking rooms filled to the brim with enemies - many of them stronger ones like Mancubi, cunning ones like Revenants, or evil ones like Arch-viles - and, if you're Pistol-starting, only a Super Shotgun and a Rocket Launcher at hand. Even with carried over resources, the east wing's a bitch to beat, not just because of the high-monster density and the fact that enemies from across the level can hurl their projectiles your way if you neglected to kill them, but due to the aforementioned repetitive nature of it: room after room of the same-ish combat, but you're forced to deal with them in order to progress. In between are little puzzles that unleash Revenants, Pain Elementals, Imps and Arch-viles in very close encounters. All of this for a switch (behind a fake wall, naturally) to the next area and for a Rocket Launcher. The level gets more interesting hereafter: a zombie massacre in the northeast section and, with the Red Key in hand, a second zombie massacre in the hills. Onwards is... oh goodness, the lift area. Nonsensical slow-moving lifts, borderline-necessary secrets and cheap enemy placement will make anyone's blood boil. Completing that brings the player to one of the map's more fascinating areas: the opening-block traps, or as I like to call it, the Serious Sam room. To reveal all the monsters, the player has to criss-cross randomly until everything opens. Very "going-for-100%-kills-in-Serious-Sam"-y, that. The Icon of Sin room has the second-most bullshit Cyberdemon in the map. By this point, the Yellow Key should be in your possession, so return to the lava lake at the beginning (sidenote, if you fall into the moat without the YK, you're as good as dead). Scale the lake's central structure, revealing the enemies until you get the BFG, and kill the Cyberdemon. Then onto the worst part... not just of the map, but possibly the entire megawad: the Cyberdemon guarding the switch that reveals the Blue Key. All you have is a thin fake bridge as wiggle-room, and damaging lava beneath. Seriously, *fuck* that Cyberdemon. Hit the switch, unleash the four remaining Cybers, destroy them, get the Blue Key, kill the remaining resistance around the citadel, and finally breach the building of the title. It's one of the more straightforward areas, and thank God. Simply keep each side of enemies at bay, whether it be the ground floor, or on the upper ramparts (which you need to wallrun to catch the lift). The middle of the citadel is a large outdoor area with three respawning Spider Masterminds and the last few Barons and Revenants. Once they're toast, you are finally free to exit.

 

... Well. That was quite the ordeal.

 

I have a real love-hate relationship with this map. On the one hand, it's extremely cruel; this is one of the hardest, if not *the* hardest, map I've ever completed in my 7 or 8 years playing this game. It is exhausting, tedious, sometimes infuriating, and I'd wager only a few people would genuinely happily return to play it over and over. However, its epic scale and unique design choices - flawed as some of them are - cannot be ignored. I even enjoyed some of the individual sections (the Serious Sam room, the two zombie massacres, and the siege of the citadel itself are pretty fun). It carries the rest of the megawad, and in some ways, for good reason. However, I feel that this was a map that was made only to please its author. Magikal made one of the most iconic fanmade Doom maps in history, and while he justly deserves recognition and some level of praise for his magnum opus, in the end, it feels much too personal a level to be fully enjoyed, at least by me. It's certainly a one-of-a-kind experience, illiciting a multitude of emotions from yours truly, and completing it felt incredibly rewarding. Then again, this is probably the Doom equivalent to some of Jean-Luc Godard's more pretentious works: overly personal and impenetrable to many.

[PeceMan]

I started playing level 29

 

What the hell is this

[DavitW]

MAP27: Afterlife

Another 300+ monster slog with little health, ammo, or hope. Honestly, there's really only so many ways a doom map can be bad. Poor balance, obtuse and unclear progression, ugly texturing, bland architecture... it's impressive how so many maps in this set manage to check so many boxes. If I played this before hand going into the month we could have made a drinking game out of it. To be fair this map didn't completely offend me, I read somewhere that this map was originally made in 1995. If that's the case then it's actually pretty damn good. There was certainly far worse you could have played instead.

 

MAP28: Necrophobia

It's clear right from the first 2 rooms that we're in Gene Bird's neighborhood now. This is a further step up from monster mash, the rooms are still mostly square but there's a bit of interesting architecture throughout and the fights become more varied and challenging as the map goes on. It's still fairly easy, some might say it's too easy, but I say after all we've went through this month we deserve an easy map like this.

cc27.zip

cc28.zip

[Book Lord]

MAP 29 – Citadel at the Edge of Eternity by Kevin Reay (Magikal)

PrBoom+ 2.5.1.4, UV, Continuous, blind run w/saves & eventually cheating

 

Here I stand, in front of the awe-inspiring, overwhelming, and disconcerting magnus opus of a multi-talented man, equally capable of amazing feats and vile trickery. The unwieldy, unpolished, unmanageable, self-referential Citadel at the Edge of Eternity was Magikal’s swansong, a testament to his potential as a Doom author, an experiment that transcended all boundaries of conventional mapping in the early 2000s, a mother lode of extreme and badly executed ideas. Even though the effort failed miserably, crushed under its own mammoth size, and led astray by its erratic puzzles, it inspired a new generation of mappers to create impressive epilogues for their megaWADs.

Spoiler

Improving this map from the gameplay standpoint would have been an impossible mission, as there was nothing to save. Nothing really worked in Kevin Reay’s creation: the combat was either tedious or totally annoying and unfair; the resources were concentrated in random stockpiles with little or no supplies in between; the enemy placement and their numbers were ill-conceived; the traps ranged from absurd to exasperating; the progression was cryptic and illogical. It relied on everything that is now considered taboo: doors that looked like walls, invisible switches, randomly passable mid-textures, indiscriminate linedef triggers, inescapable pits; in summary, it presented on a much bigger scale the same shortcomings of Goin’ Down, but with an increased degree of self-indulgent craziness.

Spoiler

I tried to play it properly for 30 minutes. I entered the western perimeter, traversed its outer trenches and inner rooms, then tried to figure out the inscrutable progression puzzle, underlying a hostile and chaotic environment. My patience ended when I encountered a series of 64-unit doors with Lost Souls in between, suddenly presenting a point-blank Revenant and a switch. The chainsaw at the end instead of the beginning told a lot about the consideration given to pistol starters and gameplay in general, but also my continuous play suffered from the total absence of cells for plasma weapons. The lights went out and I had to face a mob of Imps, Revenants, and an Arch-Vile at point-blank, with no escape, in the total darkness, and with only shells and bullets. It was such a troll move, so idiotic that I had enough and resorted to IDDQD for the rest of the map.

Spoiler

It took me 1 hour and 43 minutes to reach the end, consulting the Doom Wiki walkthrough whenever I was stuck, which happened quite frequently. The French saying “tour de force” does not give the slightest idea of how many obscure riddles, overdone slaughters, and unjust harassments must be endured to play this map legitimately on UV. HMP looks like a more feasible difficulty with lower monster count (still above 1000, but fewer Barons!), though the weird puzzles are still there. Knowing in advance how the map works, including its countless glitches and ill-defined advancement steps, may improve the experience. In all honesty, the best choice would be to give Citadel at the Edge of Eternity a wide berth and try Sunder instead, if you feel like playing large and brutal maps for a challenge.

Spoiler

It was a shame that Magikal wanted to get over the top with everything, because he created magnificent constructions and vistas. The cyclopean marble fortress was a breath-taking sight, as well as the pillar topped by a red star, the gigantic pool with the three skull keys, the “hillside ramparts” area to the east, the Icon of Sin chamber, and the heart of the citadel with its immense metallic pentacles, hosting a triple Spiderdemon battle before a well-deserved exit. The visuals had a rough and uneven quality to them, though I was more fascinated than displeased by what I saw. The author insisted with those glitchy 3D bridges to the point of buffoonery, but they lent the place a mystical and surreal atmosphere.

Spoiler

This map behemoth should be considered for what it is: a product of an era when mappers worked in secrecy. Release candidates were not a thing in 2003, but Citadel at the Edge of Eternity would have benefited greatly from community feedback. If the author had taken heed and amended some of his intolerable design choices, it might have turned into an all-time masterpiece. The disconcerting death of Kevin Reay, happened prior to the megaWAD release, did not allow for any discussion to take place, so we are left with an unfinished work holding serious gameplay oversights. There is no point in listing them, they are just too many.

Spoiler

I do not think this flawed creation is worth playing nowadays, there are better WADs around to find plenty of satisfaction. I am surprised that people even bothered to attempt UV-max runs of it, since the monster placement clearly indicated that the author did not care for speedrunning. However, this monumental effort rightfully passes into the annals of Doom history, although it will be remembered more as a collection of editing faults, to be avoided at all costs, than for its grandeur and ambitious concept. 

Edited March 29, 2022 by Book Lord

[Cammy]

I played Community Chest last month, not this one - but as the clock ticks over to the 29th, I feel the need to share the screenshot I took of this intermission screen in particular, which should speak to the monstrous map that Mr. Reay created.

 

 

At once the most grueling, satisfying, despairing, fulfilling, dreadful and wonderful map I've ever grit my teeth and fought through to its bitter end. Not for the faint of heart, not a map every person will love - likely not even a map most people will love - but it is a magnum opus in the most true sense. Never was there a mightier final challenge, nor was there ever so truly Hellish a Doom-sculpted Hell. It's a one-man war to be remembered for the ages. Rest in peace, Magikal.

[PeceMan]

What the fuck is this

Spoiler

 

That's straight up offensive

[RHhe82]

Oh boy.

 

MAP29: Citadel at the Edge of Eternity. DSDA v0.24, HMP-Cont. 1159 / 1168 kills, 8/11 secrets. Completion time: I SUCK, YOU SUCK, EVERYTHING SUCKS, 138:14

 

First session (Fri 25th evening -> 0:00 - 14:29, 168/1168 kills): Oh, over 1100 monsters, allegedly 1337 on UV. This starting area doesn't look so bad. Wait, are those 3D floors? Sigh... Moving on, the area looks big. There's a lot of ground to cover. Symmetricity doesn't look so inspired, but some of the architectural choices do look good.

 

Second session (Sat 26th early morning -> 14:29 - 40:53, 353/1168 kills): Lots of similar rooms, obnoxious doors closing in front of your nose, sniping revenants... Demon and hell knight slaughter for... a rad suit? Where do I use it? Did I have to save *after* picking it up? What do I do? No keys, no nothing.

 

Third session (Sat 26th afternoon -> 40:53 - 69:24, 582/1168 kills): Rad suit is wasted, but in the west area I found a semi-hidden shootable switch and platforms, that are slightly higher than what Doomguy can step on. Still, progress. Then, after some time I find out that one the switches blocked by SUPPORT2 pillars have been released, and it leads me to a small areas with niches, whose opening mechanism still escapes me. There are some hidden switches there, as well, and when I finally get out, I can do a really tedious run-jump course that spans the whole west border of the level. Good thing I'm not insisting on saveless. Can't be mad, though, because I'm finally making progress, and after some further exploration, I finally arrive at a Cyberdemon arena that holds all the keys. Keys are unreachable, but I backtrack a little to find an opened door that leads me to a place with revenants and a cacocloud, which is kind of fun encounter, even. I suppose the point of this detour is to lower the red skull key, which I obtain and end the session.

 

Fourth session (Sat 26th evening -> 69:24 - 138:14, 1159/1168 kills): First some negatives: Jesus wept when the mapper has been preparing elevator puzzles and rooms with seemingly endless blocks that reveal enemies. You really got to work for your YSK. Then positives: It's still hard to believe this is created by the same guy responsible for MAP06, which is still the low point of CC1 for me. Although I can see the similarities between these two, it's just that Magikal got immensely better and ambitious with the aesthetics. I really hate fake bridges, but the starting area crater and IoS-rooms' bridge designs look, well, kind of majestic. If the player is going through pain, so must have the mapper gone through pain to create something like this. That I got to respect.

 

I'm finally at the blue door at 121 minute mark. Did Dean of Doom say we're "one third" done here? But I've already got well over 900 monsters dead? I'm dreading what I'll find beyond the door...

 

... I remembered wrong, thank goodness. Almost all the final enemies swarm up on the cramped corridors. Am I imagining, or does the map require you exploit a glitch to make it in time for the lift? It's not impossibly hard, but I'm not sure if I like such requirements.

 

The final area is a breeze, I figured there'd be at least one spider mastermind, since we've had pretty much everything else, including a glimpse of Romero's head, no SS troops though (I'm glad Magikal had good enough taste to leave them out of this). The final battle is nothing special, but really: the arena looks really great, the pentagrams above.

And just how long did it take? Holy hell, almost 140 minutes! That's not counting reloads, ie. actual playtime. I didn't even get max stats, but who cares, this wasn't UV anyway. I don't think any one part of the level was miserable (well, maybe the elevator puzzle crosses the line, the platforming marathon... oh, and I didn't exactly appreciate the Cyberdemon tucked in a small cage behind yellow doors, the only way there being a fake bridge), it's just an entire megawad worth of mediocre-at-best set pieces leaves little room for positivity.

 

I promise you this was a once in a lifetime map for me. I've experienced it, I've savescummed my way through it, I'm done with it. I'm ready to order a T-shirt with the text: "I've completed Citadel at the Edge of Eternity" and wear it proudly*.

 

*) Tangent not related to Doom: 

Spoiler

There's a Finnish novel written in 1930s called Alastalon Salissa ("In the Alastalo parlor", translates Wikipedia), which is some 1000 page long brick written in a stream-of-consciousness style. The plot of the book is that it recites a 6 hour long afternoon when local patrons gather to discuss investing in a barque ship. The book has a reputation of being a very difficult read; a book most people quit by the time one character chooses a smoking pipe for 70+ pages. It's actually a fun and enjoyable book once you get used to it, but the fact remains it's too much for casual readers. One foundation actually sells T-shirts with the "I've read Alastalon Salissa" for those who claim to have done the deed. I, for one, own one such shirt, and at the moment of writing this capsule review, I'm ready to order a similar custom T-shirt for this level and Community Chest 1 on general)

 

After completing the level I rewatched Dean of Doom's assessment. If I sound positive, it's because the fake bridges didn't glitch on me. I dealth with the caged cyberdemon from above, not from the fake bridge.

[PeceMan]

19 minutes ago, RHhe82 said:

MAP29: Citadel at the Edge of Eternity. DSDA v0.24, HMP-Cont. 1159 / 1168 kills, 8/11 secrets. Completion time: I SUCK, YOU SUCK, EVERYTHING SUCKS, 138:14

 

I just finished, and got an eerily similar time. 137:02, but I missed more enemies than you. I missed 42 kills. I also got 8/11 secrets.

[RHhe82]

5 minutes ago, PeceMan said:

 

I just finished, and got an eerily similar time. 137:02, but I missed more enemies than you. I missed 42 kills. I also got 8/11 secrets.

 

Maybe the edge of eternity somewhere around 140 minute mark :-D Now, to commit oneself to PTSD hospital, intense care unit...

[Dynamo]

I finished MAP29 last month, and honestly, I thought it wasn't too painful after the marble rooms section. Before that though, the room with the baron faces that you have to open in a certain order absolutely drove me insane...

[PeceMan]

Level 29, Citadel at the Edge of Eternity

    Aight. I played it. And the only thing I can say for certain is... that I played it.

 

    Was that a bad level?
        I wouldn't like to say that, no.

 

    Was that a good level?
        Hell no. Hell fucking no.

 

    Did it have good moments?
        Yes. It had a couple of moments that were fun, interesting, and memorable.

 

    Did it have terrible moments?
        Yes. It had a bunch of moments that were tedious and frustrating, and made me feel miserable.

 

    Was it grand and majestic?
        Yes.

 

    Have I played other grand and majestic levels, which I actually enjoyed?
        Yes. Most grand and majestic levels I've played were pretty good. Can't say the same about this one.

 

    Am I happy that I played this level?
        Yes. It's a staple of CChest, and of the community as a whole. It got ranked 54th most memorable map in Doom history.

 

    Would I play it again?
        Hell no.

 

 

    

    Magnum Opuses naturally require a lot of extra effort. Therefore, Magum Opuses are always a tier above normal levels by default. This one

    definitely shows a lot of effort. But it still isn't good.

 

    I don't think the problem was the limited tools from the times, I think the problem was simply taste, or  lack-there-off. The mapper doesn't

    appear to understand the differences between good levels and bad levels. 

 

    And I just can't help but notice that they're the same person who worked on map 06, Goin' Down, which was one of the worst levels I've ever played. 

 

    Level 6 also showed effort (not nearly as much as this one, but still a good ammount), and it also  showed a fundamental lack of knowledge

    about how to make good levels.

 

 

 

    Just like with most Magnum Opuses, this one has way too much content for me to go over every good section and every bad section. And

    honestly, I don't think it would be worth it. CChest was released 19 years ago. Anything that could be learned from it has most likely already

    been learned.

 

 

 

Ratings:

Spoiler

Five Stars:        
            02 Nullth Precinct; 18 Sudden Death

 

Four Stars:            
            04 Outer Base; 05 The Forgotten Prison; 07 The Boardwalk; 08 Battery; 10 Termination Center; 11 Mandrel; 14 Substation; 

            20 Technodrome; 22 Future Grave; 26 Breakout; 27 Afterlife; 28 Necrophobia

 

Three Stars:        
            01 Pistol Panic; 03 Ground Floor; 09 Flow; 13 Another Dead Hero; 15 Infernal Reaches; 16 Methods of Fear;

            17 Inflictions of Hate; 32 The Citadel; 21 Avenger; 23 Blood Runners

 

Two Stars:        
            12 No Tomorrow; 31 Mt. Chaos; 24 Bring Evil Upon Thee; 25 Blood Demesne; 29 Citadel at the Edge of Eternity

 

One Star:    
            06 Goin' Down; 19 Monster Mansion

 

 

 

    I was thinking to myself "Boy, after such a map 29, I can only imagine what map 30 will be like", so I played
map 30 and it was... something. But we'll talk about that one on the 30th.

[NiGHTS108]

MAP29: Citadel At The Edge Of Eternity

By Magikal

Kills: 87%

Items: 61%

Secrets: 54%

Time: 1:20:54

 

:(

 

Grade: F

Difficulty: X

 

 

Edited March 29, 2022 by NiGHTS108

[FrancisT218]

I'm going to scratch prior vote post and revote with the following:

 

+++TNT: Devilution

+++Haste & MSCP

Edited March 30, 2022 by FrancisT218

[Gibbon]

From Doom With Love, Skill 1, blind w/no saves.

 

Citadel at the Edge of Eternity - MAP29

 

So first, I actually made sure it was the 29th this time..

 

Then I played

Spoiler

 

 

By the looks of it, I didn't even manage to do 10% of the map :) such a giant unwieldy beast.  There are a few issues when building maps this big and that is organisation.  There are double linedefs that open and close doors somewhere even when moving a few pixels.  There are linedefs going through monsters, lifts that do not raise properly unless you're doing it in the exact way intended, doors that don't open because you forgot to walk on that one invisible floor tile that opens it..  etc..

 

And that walkway at the side of the western side of the map..  wtf is that?  Blacked out windows but apparently all the monsters are triggered by you.  No idea what that is about.

 

I never went much further as I died.  But I went around using IDDQD and IDCLIP to take a look.  I'll probably never beat it in my lifetime.

 

[Jaccident]

Map 29: Citadel at the Edge of Eternity

I know the reputation this map has. I know it is going to take me an incredibly long time to beat it. I know it is going to drive me up the wall. Which is why I have already played and written up my review of Map30 so I can focus on this one. My plan for my review for this level is to write my thoughts at the end of each play session, alongside the in-game time that has passed for each one. This is a long level, so this is probably going to be a long review. However I don’t have a large amount of free time, so the full review will probably take a while, and will probably appear at some point in April. Wish me luck!

[sincity2100]

+++TNT: Devilution

[RHhe82]

I don’t wanna change my votes for the second time, but I wouldn’t be unhappy about Devilution, either.