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Endless

Is Doomworld secured for the future ?

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Posted (edited)

Well, the transfer itself is only possible if not only the code, but also all the data would be hosted by another service provider. problem is, indeed, legal authority, as said in that post.

However, what @Linguica may have not realized, is that while he can NOT control the doomworlds fate in it's current hosting service, he CAN back up and archive the web page and anything related to it. However, it is such a big job, HE WILL need help.

Thing about backup data is, once the original site is gone, he can use the backup to restore the site on another web hosting service. It is a legal grey area in Europe, not sure about America. 

He can not migrate the site as long as it is alive. But when and if the site get's shut down, he can create a copy/clone of the site and keep it running, provided there are no pirated content on the map. Since most of the content here is Open Source Licenced and covered by various public use licences, they can be reused and reuploaded on a restored site. Even if he site is in new host service, as long as the old site is no longer functional, the new site is considered a restored site,  and thus can be administrated by him. 

However, this is still not foolproof and his other concerns are still very valid. 

 

Edit: As for the stagnation, that one is up to the community. 

Edited by IcarusOfDaggers

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Posted (edited)

I certainly understand where you are coming from Endless. It would be nice to know there's a bit of security and also, redundancy. Who is actually paying the bills? Is there a plan in place with fallback options if they disappear to keep the lights on? That kind of thing. I would also happily contribute to a patreon or similar for running costs. But judging by what Ling said in 2018 these requests may essentially be impossible. It's not a nice predicament to be in.

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26 minutes ago, Chopkinsca said:

I don't know why I felt an urge to reply. I'm usually just a member roaming the outsides. Maybe I feel thoughtful this evening, or something.

It is welcomed comment.

 

7 minutes ago, IcarusOfDaggers said:

But when and if the site get's shut down, he can create a copy/clone of the site and keep it running, provided there are no pirated content on the map. Since most of the content here is Open Source Licenced and covered by various public use licences, they can be reused and reuploaded on a restored site.

That does relief the idea that there could be no way to save the data stored here. While the legal hassles are still here, at least there's something that can be done.

 

6 minutes ago, Murdoch said:

I certainly understand where you are coming from Endless. It would be nice to know there's a bit of security and also, redundancy. Who is actually paying the bills? Is there a plan in place with fallback options if they disappear to keep the lights on? That kind of thing. I would also happily contribute to a patreon or similar for running costs. But judging by what Ling said in 2018 that may essentially be impossible. It's not a nice predicament to be in.

From the comment, Ling pays the bills, but he, ironically, doesn't own the site so it's a big and weird mess.

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1 minute ago, Endless said:

From the comment, Ling pays the bills, but he, ironically, doesn't own the site so it's a big and weird mess.

 

Yeah. I hope at the least there's something in place so that if he stops paying one of the other admins can.

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1 minute ago, Murdoch said:

 

Yeah. I hope at the least there's something in place so that if he stops paying one of the other admins can.

Not wanting to being in charge of Doomworld after all these years is absolutely valid. The only issue is who could be left in charge? Which is why I raised the concerns about the inactive admins and no new ones. After all, a lot of trust would be needed for the new ''owner'' of DW. Heck, the reliability is probably more important than the money issue.

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Don't worry where the journey may end - enjoy the journey while you're on it 

 

🍗

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2 minutes ago, Endless said:

Not wanting to being in charge of Doomworld after all these years is absolutely valid. The only issue is who could be left in charge? Which is why I raised the concerns about the inactive admins and no new ones. After all, a lot of trust would be needed for the new ''owner'' of DW. Heck, the reliability is probably more important than the money issue.

 

Kind of the same thing really. The site will become really unreliable if the bill stops getting paid!

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3 minutes ago, Murdoch said:

Yeah. I hope at the least there's something in place so that if he stops paying one of the other admins can.

 

Considering the fact Ling previous left in 2003 and handed over lead admin duties to Bloodshedder until his eventual return in 2016, should he decide to leave active duty again, he'll likely hand it over to someone else who is willing. The most likely candidate being co-founder Mordeth whose still been active in his own admin duties this entire time. 

 

I'm sure the guys have some contingency plans in mind for different circumstances. @Linguica @Mordeth feel free to drop in here and fill in the blanks for us so we stop speculating. :^P

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Clippy said:

Don't worry where the journey may end - enjoy the journey while you're on it 

 

🍗

Your chicken drumstick is a reminder of cold reality: you can enjoy the drumstick while it lasts, but you'll want more when you're finished with it.

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4 minutes ago, Biodegradable said:

Considering the fact Ling previous left in 2003 and handed over lead admin duties to Bloodshedder until his eventual return in 2016, should he decide to leave active duty again, he'll likely hand it over to someone else who is willing. The most likely candidate being co-founder Mordeth whose still been active in his own admin duties this entire time. 

 

That's assuming he leaves voluntarily. God forbid but what if he dies suddenly?

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What legal issues exactly am I reading about here? The user-created content?

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46 minutes ago, Alex S. said:

If Doomworld were ever that much in jeopardy, I'd host the site and database for us. Not kidding. No bullshit. We're legion, we're strong, we're family. Our community will never die. Doom will never die. Only the players die.

We are the anonymous. We are legion. Expect us.


All memery aside, the slogan you made would be a great slogan for the whole doom community. 

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13 minutes ago, maxmanium said:

What legal issues exactly am I reading about here? The user-created content?

 

As far as the site itself goes, the primary issue is whose name and contact info is the registrar contact on the domain. They are the legal owner of it and as of 2018 at least according to Ling it's not him nor anyone else currently on the site.

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4 minutes ago, Murdoch said:

 

As far as the site itself goes, the primary issue is whose name and contact info is the registrar contact on the domain. They are the legal owner of it and as of 2018 at least according to Ling it's not him nor anyone else currently on the site.

None of us can tell by the whois records. It's privately registered, so all lookup data on this domain has been redacted for privacy. I can say the authoritative nameservers are at linode but that means nothing useful.

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2 hours ago, Endless said:

The absence of the majority of the staff members or no new staff is also a bit depressing

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "no new staff" - I know at the very least Bridgeburner and Liberation became new mods in the last year or so.  Some of the other mods might be new too.  It's not a stagnant pool of individuals.

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17 minutes ago, Alex S. said:

None of us can tell by the whois records. It's privately registered, so all lookup data on this domain has been redacted for privacy. I can say the authoritative nameservers are at linode but that means nothing useful.

 

I did not look but figured it likely was.

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17 minutes ago, Bauul said:

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "no new staff" - I know at the very least Bridgeburner and Liberation became new mods in the last year or so.  Some of the other mods might be new too.  It's not a stagnant pool of individuals.

Referring to the admins section.

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1 hour ago, Alex S. said:

Only the players die.

Unless you use iddqd ;)

 

Anywho, I'd suggest not think about the death of the forum too deeply as it tends to woresen your fears. I'd only be fearful if one of the moderators or admins come out and tell us something of concern, but as that hasn't happened yet, it's safe to assume we're safe.

 

Just know that Doomworld and everyone will still be here for the time to come.

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don't worry man. if the last 30 years have taught us anything, it's that no matter what, Doom will survive. no matter what form it's in, the playerbase, it doesn't matter.

Doomworld is eternal.

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It seems so far the Doom communities have fared better than the Quake ones; the Doom admins seem on average to last longer. But that can always change quickly

So many online places for Quake have collapsed or are barely limping along. This is because the people who own it are no longer interested in Quake and are unwilling to pass it on to someone who has the passion to put the work in. The community is lucky that Spirit keeps Quaddicted alive and well, and then there's also Dumptruck who built the Quake Mapping Discord and passed it on when he felt the time was right. But it is left without an active forum that is well organized and easily searchable.

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Immorpher said:

It seems so far the Doom communities have fared better than the Quake ones; the Doom admins seem on average to last longer. But that can always change quickly

So many online places for Quake have collapsed or are barely limping along. This is because the people who own it are no longer interested in Quake and are unwilling to pass it on to someone who has the passion to put the work in. The community is lucky that Spirit keeps Quaddicted alive and well, and then there's also Dumptruck who built the Quake Mapping Discord and passed it on when he felt the time was right. But it is left without an active forum that is well organized and easily searchable.

Ironic that Quake has a proper modern downloads repository, but lacks the forums, while Doom has the forums but lacks a functioning modern download page.

 

And yeah, Doom is among the most active and one the few retro communities that have managed to stay relevant after decades, which is why I worry about an unexpected loss, considering the circumstances.

Edited by Endless

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16 minutes ago, Immorpher said:

So many online places for Quake have collapsed or are barely limping along.

 

Funnily enough, the mention of Telefragged.com in Ling's post made me think "huh, they still exist?" I googled it and found a site hosted on quake2.com with a redirect to a sub domain site that no longer exists on Telefragged.com. The main Quake2.com has a news update declaring the site maintainer is going away for a weekend roadtrip... nearly 24 years ago. That's one HELL of a weekend roadtrip. So someone has been paying for a domain and hosting for the site that as far as I can tell has not been updated in nearly a quarter century.

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