id Software is re-organizing the Galactic Doompublic into the first ever Galactic Doompire

[Kyle07]

I recognized that The Ultimate DOOM was renamed to DOOM (1993). Okay. The old title is for newbies truly misleading. I was also confused what this game is.

To be honest, I liked the title "DOOM II: Hell on Earth". I always liked the full title. But I did not realise that they removed "Hell on Earth" until Eddie 2077 commented on that.

 

I have to mention that this merging offers now for the first time the Quake II mission packs for German steam users. Strangely, as Quake II was delisted in Germany from the list of "banned videogames" (original wording: Indiziertes Computerspiel), the main game was offered in Steam after some time. But the mission packs remained banned for German steam users until this day.

 

I bought Quake II on GOG instead, which has there all mission packs.

 

I'm interested how DOOM 3 and Final Doom and the Master Levels will behave on my steam account. Because I have there my play time and I see still all these games on my account with their seperate play times. I wonder if these seperations in play time will still be made. I have currently no access to my PC, I'm moving to a new appartment on 01. September 2022. So I will be able to check later.

[Hellblazer]

Wow, I just recently bought Resurrection of Evil and now they're giving it for free to all Doom 3 owners.

Edited August 12, 2022 by Hellblazer

[Kinsie]

1 hour ago, Kyle07 said:

I'm interested how DOOM 3 and Final Doom and the Master Levels will behave on my steam account. Because I have there my play time and I see still all these games on my account with their seperate play times. I wonder if these seperations in play time will still be made. I have currently no access to my PC, I'm moving to a new appartment on 01. September 2022. So I will be able to check later.

The Doom 3 consolidation just grants the games you don't have to your account.

The other consolidations pack the installs into the base game and treat them as launch options, but if you bought the games previously you can still install and play them through their old library entries.

[ludicrous_peridot]

I am confused with this, to be honest, and this calls to an obsessive collector type inside me, who has some questions - and probably DoomWorld-ians already know the answers?

 

1. Bethnet had specific versions of Ult Doom and Doom 2 (I think called classic) which looked like DOSBox-based ports of PSN versions of classic games. Seems these are gone now with move to Steam?

2. When Steam have updated classic games to Unity port, they kept providing separate DOSBox-based versions. Were these actually same versions of Ult Doom and Doom II they used to offer before the the move to Unity port and is this what has been renamed/repackaged now?

3. Steam, Unity (via bethnet) and GoG all used to offer different versions of Final Doom. Is the one bundled with repackaged Doom II the same version as was previously available on Steam?

4. I happened to own (through confusion) an "anniversary" version of Doom 3 from bethnet, which I discovered was BFG edition minus classic games content (or close). I also had Doom 3 proper from Steam and BFG-edition "proper" from GoG. Is the bethnet edition gone for good now, and is my GoG version redundant with the repackaging?

5. Is there a package/packages for Wolf3d/SoD similar to what has been produced for Ult Doom/Doom II on Steam with this latest change?

 

I surely don't keep those past mentioned version around anymore since deltas have been made available for them by serious catalogists on the net, but am still very curious still and wondering if this repackaging could be an opportunity to just stick with a single content platform for early ID stuff.

[Gez]

4 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

1. Bethnet had specific versions of Ult Doom and Doom 2 (I think called classic) which looked like DOSBox-based ports of PSN versions of classic games. Seems these are gone now with move to Steam?

AFAIK the PC versions on Beth.net was just regular ol' Doom 1.9 in DOS Box. It's the console versions that had differences with the classical versions.

6 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

2. When Steam have updated classic games to Unity port, they kept providing separate DOSBox-based versions. Were these actually same versions of Ult Doom and Doom II they used to offer before the the move to Unity port and is this what has been renamed/repackaged now?

Yes, no real changes on that front, it's still the same old .EXEs and .WADs from the 90s.

7 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

3. Steam, Unity (via bethnet) and GoG all used to offer different versions of Final Doom. Is the one bundled with repackaged Doom II the same version as was previously available on Steam?

Most probably, yes. I haven't bothered to check but I don't think they switched to the Anthology version provided by GOG. The versions downloadable from the Unity-shelled version has some Unity-specific changes that wouldn't work in the classic DOSBoxed exe -- widescreen art, to start with.

10 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

4. I happened to own (through confusion) an "anniversary" version of Doom 3 from bethnet, which I discovered was BFG edition minus classic games content (or close). I also had Doom 3 proper from Steam and BFG-edition "proper" from GoG. Is the bethnet edition gone for good now, and is my GoG version redundant with the repackaging?

This version? I guess if you don't have it installed anymore, it is indeed gone for good as when the Beth.net store closed down, the games were transferred to Steam. So you must have gotten Doom 3 BFG edition on Steam at that point I guess. Point is moot now that Doom 3 on Steam is both the classic version and the BFG edition version. And yes, that makes the GOG version a bit redundant, but at least it allows you to archive an offline installer if you want.

15 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

5. Is there a package/packages for Wolf3d/SoD similar to what has been produced for Ult Doom/Doom II on Steam with this latest change?

Changes on that front were not mentioned. I noticed that "Spear of Destiny" is listed as "Wolfenstein 3D: Spear of Destiny" and can't remember if that's new or not. However, it's not like there's any need for changes on that front, since Wolf 3D was already the complete 6-episode version and SOD was already bundled with the FormGen mission packs.

[Alex S.]

14 hours ago, Kityn said:

 

 

https://github.com/ayuanx/ogg-winmm

 

This wrapper works with Quake 2 and it's released under GPLv2 like DOSBox (shipped with many commercial games). Playing the proper music files in the mission packs may be problematic as they are using the same executable as Q2, but it can be resolved, for instance, by startup batch scripts (renaming music folders).

This is one wrapper I have not yet tried. I'll give it a go. I've done plenty of scripting so if this wrapper works, it won't be any problem creating some batch files to handle folder swaps etc. Another thought, is there was a version of the Q2 soundtrack that includes all the tracks for the base game and mission packs in a single CD. GoG used that version for their original Quake 2 release that did have working OGG music.

[Kinsie]

13 minutes ago, Gez said:

This version? I guess if you don't have it installed anymore, it is indeed gone for good as when the Beth.net store closed down, the games were transferred to Steam. So you must have gotten Doom 3 BFG edition on Steam at that point I guess.

That version was transferred to Steam as its own entry, Doom 3: Bethesda.net Edition

[ludicrous_peridot]

 

Just now, Gez said:

Just now, ludicrous_peridot said:

1. Bethnet had specific versions of Ult Doom and Doom 2 (I think called classic) which looked like DOSBox-based ports of PSN versions of classic games. Seems these are gone now with move to Steam?

AFAIK the PC versions on Beth.net was just regular ol' Doom 1.9 in DOS Box. It's the console versions that had differences with the classical versions.

I clearly remember it was not the case for both games, but I have now checked  and the docs only mention this for Doom II; Ult Doom is mentioned as bundled with Doom Eternal, but not as a separate game. Again, with the deltas available not a big issue, but, you know, that obsessive collector type inside... 

Spoiler

The PSN Europe release has also been used for two

separate PC releases of the “vanilla” game: in the Bethesda Store as

“DOOM II (ORIGINAL)” and as part of Doom Eternal.

 

Just now, Gez said:

Most probably, yes. I haven't bothered to check but I don't think they switched to the Anthology version provided by GOG.

I have checked new Steam vs GOG just now and they are different, so I assume it's exactly as you've written.

 

Just now, Kinsie said:

That version was transferred to Steam as its own entry, Doom 3: Bethesda.net Edition

Indeed, thanks for pointing out, and seems like I still have it on the list. Then on the other hand - I still have Master Levels, even though my Doom II has them after the latest update, so who knows...

[Kinsie]

16 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

Then on the other hand - I still have Master Levels, even though my Doom II has them after the latest update, so who knows...

They haven't removed any of the old library entries, they just removed them from sale and store search. If you have 'em, you can still run 'em the old way.

 

The consolidation for Final Doom basically amounts to copying the Final Doom game's install folders into the Doom 2 install folder.

[ludicrous_peridot]

Just now, Kinsie said:

They haven't removed any of the old library entries, they just removed them from sale and store search. If you have 'em, you can still run 'em the old way.

 

The consolidation for Final Doom basically amounts to copying the Final Doom game's install folders into the Doom 2 install folder.

That's good to know. Still some sort of small glitch here on Steam part, I guess, as I have never purchased Master Levels, nor any of Doom Complete packs. I was curious and it got me installed what seems to be exact copy of Master Levels you get with Doom II now. On a side note I like it how one gets the relevant IWADs now with just a single package install, e.g. after machine clear reinstall - even more convenient than getting Final Doom via Unity as add-on, or getting the games via separate packages.

[magicsofa]

Why is anyone happy about Bethesda leeching as much money as possible from IP they had nothing to do with in the first place?

[Gez]

2 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

Why is anyone happy about Bethesda leeching as much money as possible from IP they had nothing to do with in the first place?

The thread is about people potentially getting free games as a result of this store listing consolidation.

 

But if you want to move the topic to that front -- first: id Software 2022 has nearly nothing to do with id Software 1993 that created the IP in the first place, only Donna Jackson and Kevin Cloud remain from that bygone era. Second: it's Microsoft that's getting the money now.

[Mr Masker]

9 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

Why is anyone happy about Bethesda leeching as much money as possible from IP they had nothing to do with in the first place?

What does that have to do with changing bundles and the names of Steam games?

[PKr]

13 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

Why is anyone happy about Bethesda leeching as much money as possible from IP they had nothing to do with in the first place?

Well, calling people happy about Bethesda leeching money from Doom IP would be a stretch...

 

It's just that nobody rages about it as much, since those who didn't have some games in the series (ie Doom 3 owners who didn't have the BFG edition, or vice versa), now got it for free, and Bethesda haven't broken anything that is Doom related so far (be it from their Doom re-release, or this re-arrangement of the entries).

 

Even then not many people are that enthusiastic about these changes.

[OpenRift]

I'm just glad that they're bundling the Expansions for Quake 1-3 together with the base games, that way playing expansion content in multiplayer is more accessible.

[LexiMax]

35 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

Why is anyone happy about Bethesda leeching as much money as possible from IP they had nothing to do with in the first place?

 

Bethesda + modern id Software are doing the old games more justice than independent id Software ever did.

 

Not counting the actual release of course...but years down the line id left their old games to bitrot, unworthy of a decent glow-up like Unity Doom or Nightdive Quake, instead getting bare minimum, buggy ports with no extra features.

 

It is a crying shame that unless you had a PC and knew how to work source ports, up until the Unity port there was no good "official" way to play Doom.

Edited August 12, 2022 by AlexMax

[act]

58 minutes ago, AlexMax said:

 

Bethesda + modern id Software are doing the old games more justice than independent id Software ever did.

 

Not counting the actual release of course...but years down the line id left their old games to bitrot, unworthy of a decent glow-up like Unity Doom or Nightdive Quake, instead getting bare minimum, buggy ports with no extra features.

 

It is a crying shame that unless you had a PC and knew how to work source ports, up until the Unity port there was no good "official" way to play Doom.

I feel like you're being too reductive towards the source ports. I'd say that John Carmack is a grade-A computer scientist first, and a game developer/businessman/etc. second. Once he released the source code under the GNU GPL, he knew that he could just let the dove fly. Since then, we've had so many improvements to the Doom engine through sourceports - sourceports that still far surpass the proprietary and paid hobbled-together remakes.

And no, using sourceports are not that hard. It's the same as using the original Doom executable in DOS, bare minimum. Launch the executable through the CMD, use -iwad to denote the IWAD, use -file to denote any extra files, etc. Sourceports being "hard to use" is simply a case of people forgetting how to do things that were considered necessary basic skills because they've been phased out by newer technology that's vaguely easier.

[magicsofa]

1 hour ago, Gez said:

The thread is about people potentially getting free games as a result of this store listing consolidation.

Oh... totally missed that.

I was just knee-jerking to the "hope they don't delist anything" side of the conversation. The idea that a digital product could ever be "delisted" in any meaningful way is evidence of the Industry working shadow magic to inflate that margin. Doom 1, 2, and 3 should all be freeware at this point - as you said the money is going to Microsoft, which is objectively amoral in my opinion.

[D4NUK1]

31 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

Oh... totally missed that.

I was just knee-jerking to the "hope they don't delist anything" side of the conversation. The idea that a digital product could ever be "delisted" in any meaningful way is evidence of the Industry working shadow magic to inflate that margin. Doom 1, 2, and 3 should all be freeware at this point - as you said the money is going to Microsoft, which is objectively amoral in my opinion.

 

That's why it's great to read complete first before arguments :3

[Kinsie]

I think Magicsofa should give me seven dollars for a soda, any other action is objectively amoral.

[magicsofa]

39 minutes ago, D4NUK1 said:

That's why it's great to read complete first before arguments :3

 

Not arguing, just shouting at cloud

 

32 minutes ago, Kinsie said:

I think Magicsofa should give me seven dollars for a soda, any other action is objectively amoral.

 

Someday Microsoft will shove a paperclip up your ass and charge you seven dollars for it, then you won't be feeling so cheeky

[Kinsie]

8 minutes ago, magicsofa said:

Someday Microsoft will shove a paperclip up your ass and charge you seven dollars for it, then you won't be feeling so cheeky

Know a few people who'd consider that Quite The Bargain and Well Below The Regular Market Rate, so, uh, don't threaten them with a good time I guess.

[LexiMax]

2 hours ago, act said:

I feel like you're being too reductive towards the source ports

 

Not at all.  I've written code for several of them, and I'm proud of the work I did.

 

However, there is the simple matter that source ports are hamstrung where they can't possibly have the reach or convenience of official releases.  Doom's license precludes its distribution on many platforms outright, and the fact that the original Doom game assets are still proprietary means there will always be some setup involved for the platforms that allow it.

 

Before the modern Unity port, the official ways of playing Doom all stank, so realistically source ports were all you had.  The Unity port is the first time I can ever recall a re-release of Doom being anything other than a quick cash grab.  Not only that, the Unity port is on all of those platforms that source ports can't touch or is a pain to set up on.  A first time player playing Doom can just click on any of the following links, buy the release, hit "Play", and have a grand old time:

 

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2300/DOOM_II/

https://www.nintendo.com/store/products/doom-ii-classic-switch/

https://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/store/doom-ii-classic/9plt62lrf9v7

https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP1003-CUSA15595_00-DOOMTWO199400000

https://apps.apple.com/us/app/doom-ii/id1470090748

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.bethsoft.DOOMII&hl=en_US&gl=US

 

Source ports aren't bad, but you shouldn't have to use a source port to have a good time with Doom.

Edited August 12, 2022 by AlexMax

[act]

6 minutes ago, AlexMax said:

Source ports aren't bad, but you shouldn't have to use a source port to have a good time with Doom.

I think that's where our philosophies on the matter diverge to a point of non-consolidation. I'd say that using a source port (I'll stick to having "source port" be two words from now on) is the more official way of playing Doom than the actual official ways to play Doom. "Official" is not a simple seal that's given to something that's paid for.

[Lippeth]

Did something happen to the 2019 version of Doom 3? It was the one game I bought from the Bethesda.net launcher and then it had me link my Steam account to migrate the game, but all that appeared in my Steam library is the 2012 BFG Edition, which I don't even think is related to linking accounts. I'm not complaining necessarily and only bought it to compare and contrast with my GoG version of the BFG Edition, and is no big loss if it's gone, but I am curious as to what may have happened to it, as the Steam artwork for the BFG Edition now uses the 2019 art.

 

I'm also a little confused with the wording in the delisted titles section of the news post, particularly with the highlighted words:

"DOOM 3: BFG Edition (This will install with DOOM 3. Players that own DOOM 3: BFG will be upgraded to DOOM 3.)"

I'm gathering that it just means they've both been lumped together as Doom 3 on the store page and both show up in the Steam library after purchase along with RoE. And if you already own one then the rest will show up? It's just worded a little strange. Also this is neither here nor there but the original Doom 3 suddenly prompted me to agree to an EULA which after owning it for over a decade and already putting in over a hundred hours just with the Steam launcher is a little weird but I suppose it's normal.

[ludicrous_peridot]

@Lippeth check the screenie I posted in response to @Kinsie above.

Bethnet version is showing for me still, as well as BFG Edition. I've migrated the former and I've never purchased the latter on Steam (all I had was the Doom 3/ROE/Doom 64 bundle).

If in your case it's different you may want to ask Steam support for help I guess?

[PKr]

3 hours ago, AlexMax said:

up until the Unity port there was no good "official" way to play Doom.

 

19 minutes ago, AlexMax said:

Before the modern Unity port, the official ways of playing Doom all stank

Are you saying this because Unity port is "official" or because you actually like it?

 

I don't really want to call anyone's work on Doom source ports a waste, but damn Unity port is bad... I'd actually go as far as calling it a much worse "official" way to play Doom than running the game in a Dosbox (not that running Doom in a Dosbox is bad by any means, but you get the idea). And I am not talking about the lacking features of the Unity port like the inability to switch statusbar, or some quirks with controls and stuff. Doom unity is simply broken - it has some extreme interpolation issues, which make the game choppy. I can't even understand how anyone can play it in a such state.

[Lippeth]

14 minutes ago, ludicrous_peridot said:

@Lippeth check the screenie I posted in response to @Kinsie above.

Bethnet version is showing for me still, as well as BFG Edition. I've migrated the former and I've never purchased the latter on Steam (all I had was the Doom 3/ROE/Doom 64 bundle). 

If in your case it's different you may want to ask Steam support for help I guess?

Ah there it is, so then it just hasn't shown up in my case then. A small part of me had hoped it would disappear altogether but that's cool they didn't exclude it.

 

Edit:

I had to transfer it myself, but it's in my Steam library now, thanks!

Edited August 12, 2022 by Lippeth

[LexiMax]

27 minutes ago, act said:

"Official" is not a simple seal that's given to something that's paid for.

 

....I think you're trying to equivocate "Official" with "Good" which, I suppose I'm not sure where your getting that definition equivocation from.  Regardless, taking your equivocation on its face, I actually agree with you.  I think the source ports can be an altogether better experience than any official port could ever hope to be.  I just also think that people who just buy the game off Stream or the console stores should also have the ability to have fun with Doom without having to install a source port.

[ludicrous_peridot]

Just now, magicsofa said:

Why is anyone happy about Bethesda leeching as much money as possible from IP they had nothing to do with in the first place?

 

Two things come to mind:

 

1. Is selling classic games really profitable for Beth? I could imagine Doom 64 marketed as lost classic or LPR reissues could be... but Unity port or Quake remake... I doubt. What exactly would be grounds for "money leeching" here?

 

2. I imagine one could find the reaction (like mine) of "oh well, at least they are not taking away anything" worth of being criticized. Yet if I think of what such reaction (e.g. mine) could be rooted in, one thing comes to mind - I may have read too many threads in the past where posters cry foul over anything Beth (and such) do with their catalog, resulting in my feeling anxious every time I see relevant news on the net.