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Sonikkumania

Things about Doom you still don't understand

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Demons are a twisted mockery of humanity. They have everything Earth has, but designed for injury and confusion instead of comfort and convenience.

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5 hours ago, TheSlipgateStudios said:

Why is there wood in hell? We may never know.

For the chainsaw, of course.

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1 hour ago, TheSlipgateStudios said:

I mean wooden walls and architecture.

 

Hell is ruled by an essentially immortal being. Assuming their taste in architecture does not change, it is reasonable to assume that architecture in Hell will remain the same. Since this being is old, it is also fair to assume they grew up in an environment without modern materials (concrete, glass, etc.)

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5 hours ago, TheSlipgateStudios said:

Why is there wood in hell? We may never know.

Same as everyone else. When evil trees die, they go to Hell.

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8 hours ago, Captain Keen said:


This is a genuine question: I thought they did fix that?

 

I pulled various versions of both Doom 1 and Doom II to check them out and if I recall v1.9 fixes stuck enemies such as the arachnotron in Map 11 on UV. I believe that was an official patch? Please correct me someone if I’m wrong. Before downloading that version I had been using the initial build from the Sep 1994 release.

 

There are still some significant errors present in 1.9 that have never been addressed by official patches. The Arachnotron in MAP11 was one that 1.9 specifically addressed.

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3 hours ago, bofu said:

There are still some significant errors present in 1.9 that have never been addressed by official patches. The Arachnotron in MAP11 was one that 1.9 specifically addressed.

 
Thanks for the clarification.

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On 9/18/2022 at 12:05 AM, SMG_Man said:

For me, following this tutorial was pretty easy to understand and worked perfectly. If you've already looked at this one and still don't get it, let me know and I can try either making a more step by step post or commentated video about it. It's a very neat effect to have in your maps. (Note: from my testing, using this method to make transparent doors works like a charm in Chocolate and Crispy Doom. In GZDoom, the effect works in Hardware-accelerated mode, but breaks when using either the Doom or True-color Software Render.)

Thanks dude! I've tried it and worked like a charm, with some minor jank due to a HOM effect that displays the flat on the door during mid rising and lowering, but that's just a minor issue that will eventually be fixed.

 

8LnwS9t.png

5pI9fYY.png

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Solmyr said:

with some minor jank due to a HOM effect that displays the flat on the door during mid rising and lowering, but that's just a minor issue that will eventually be fixed.

 

Ah, so that's the thing; if you follow that guide to the letter, there shouldn't even be a flat bleed or HOM effect when your door is opening. Check out here, I used the BSP method from that tutorial in my recreation of TNT MAP21:

 

 

 

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I see, i tried again on a new map and made sure to follow the guide to the point, and this time it worked as intended.

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1 hour ago, pcorf said:

Slimetrails.

 

Nothing is perfect.

As far as I know it's a node builder issue and Lee Killough, who is an absolute wizard, came up with a decent fix for it but it still isn't perfect. Just one of those things I guess. 

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What tripped me up about those doors is that a ceiling lowered to floor creates a hom, but if the door's floor is one pixel above the surrounding floors, it's all good. So weird.

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I just learned how to make a new weapon in a new slot, not just replacing them in Doom2. I'm still trying to adapt the CATvisor to this new weapon to have the ammo counter work properly...

BlasterPpickup.png

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I was going to complain about how nonsensical is the lowering-and-changing-texture behavior, and how it will readily change to the texture of a flat not at the level it's lowering to which is silly, but...well, I guess I just did, but I do understand it's because most of the linedef actions were chugged out as needed and so didn't have to make sense in a broader context.

 

What I will ask, instead, is does anybody know why Odyssey of Noises has that long, featureless block of empty buildings and nothing else occupying its entire west side?  That was always a design choice that baffled me, and I always assumed it's because Milo intended eventually to put something inside them, but in that case it's weird that it's been kept there.  It makes the map feel unfinished even though it most definitely isn't.

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The "lower to lowest and change texture/effect" linedef action in vanilla. "Linedef type 37" is still a red link on doomwiki's Engine bug page, presumably because no one likes to even think about it any longer than necessary. I guess in vanilla, it copies from the lowest numbered neighboring sector... even when it's not actually the lowest height-wise? And of course, everyone's favorite crash that happens when... the lowest-numbered linedef is one-sided? Maybe? Seems like it to me, I may be wrong, but everything about this linedef action's existence is wrong, so whatever.

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The biggest thing I currently don't understand about Doom is why Boom allows monsters to fall off (and get stuck on) ledges. What problem is this trying to solve? It causes monsters to end up in unintended and occasionally inaccessible areas.

Edited by Krenium

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i do not understand why monsters don't open blazing doors? are they afraid it's too dangerous?
like a baron walks up to the door and goes "nope" bc they get a flashback of their hell knight cousin getting their hoof taken off after getting caught in the upward motion? "this happened to my buddy [redacted] one time".
understandable, if that's the case.

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On 9/24/2022 at 11:32 PM, Krenium said:

The biggest thing I currently don't understand about Doom is why Boom allows monsters to fall off (and get stuck on) ledges. What problem is this trying to solve? It causes monsters to end up in unintended and occasionally inaccessible areas.

I imagine it's a consequence of letting monsters scroll off ledges by means of conveyor belts, but that's just a guess. It would have been solvable though, like in MBF21 where you have an option to keep enemies from falling off ledges except when they're on scrolling sectors.

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2 hours ago, heliumlamb said:

i do not understand why monsters don't open blazing doors?

They were only added with Doom2, and seemingly they forgot to add the door type to the monster trigger list.

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So is Doom 2 guy NOT Doom 1 guy? I know the "story" isn't all that important, but it seems like you're simultaneously the exact same marine but also maybe a different one.

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3 hours ago, Koko Ricky said:

So is Doom 2 guy NOT Doom 1 guy? I know the "story" isn't all that important, but it seems like you're simultaneously the exact same marine but also maybe a different one.

What makes you think they are different?

 

For all we know there's continuity between Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 as episode 4; Thy Flesh Consumed, takes place on Earth as it has a similar sky to the one from Inferno's end screen and it's stated on the wiki that It's also a prequel to Doom 2, so the marines from both games could be the same guy, unless you're reffering to the Doomguy from Sigil as that episode seems to be like an alterante universe take on TFC.

 

How about the guy from Plutonia and TNT are they the same guy as the marines from Doom 1 and 2? 

Edited by Solmyr

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3 hours ago, Solmyr said:

What makes you think they are different?

He’s probably referencing the fact that the Doom II manual describes you as a Marine who fought the Demonic outbreak on Mars, not a Marine who fought the Demonic outbreak on Phobos and then Deimos and then went to Hell and then got spat back out of Hell onto Earth.

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I don't understand how the music on Unity Doom works...

I know that for the iwads uses streamed music but for the addons? It sound like a GUS patches but I cant find anything in the files related midi playback.

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Episode 4 is part of Doom 1 but it came out after Doom 2, so it's a retcon. The story is a lot simpler if you go from E3 directly to Doom 2. I can see how there might be some doubt it's the same dude but Doom 2's manual states you're the only survivor and you defeated the threat to the Mars base (which was where E3 took place).

 

The description of events when you get back is a bit different between games but nothing clearly suggests it's a different dude. For example there's one source saying you take a teleporter to Earth but Doom 2's manual says you land in a small ship. It's possible to theorize about but kind of missing the whole point of Doom which is to not overthink the story.

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47 minutes ago, Herr Dethnout said:

I don't understand how the music on Unity Doom works...

I know that for the iwads uses streamed music but for the addons? It sound like a GUS patches but I cant find anything in the files related midi playback.

Addons use midi playback using a patchset stored in the Unity asset packages.

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Just now, Edward850 said:

Addons use midi playback using a patchset stored in the Unity asset packages.


So is unmodifiable? damn the instruments sounds so weak and I wanted to change it.

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9 hours ago, Edward850 said:

They were only added with Doom2, and seemingly they forgot to add the door type to the monster trigger list.

related: how does a caco open any door they can without any arms?

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