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Doughnut1321

Can't access console in Syringe Addon

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I am playing Doom 2 Unity with the Syringe addon and can't access the console.  I need to increase turbo since my character always runs too slow for some tasks.  Also, I would like to know if there is a way to keep the turbo setting constant as you go from mod to mod, or permanently change the default value of 100 (same result, I guess).  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

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Just wondering why you use Unity on PC, I know it works and all and it's handy for more casual gamers who just want to play Doom but I always think of it as the console version. On PC you'd be better served by other source ports.

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Options you have in unity are cheats, always run, crosshairs as far as I remember.

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3 hours ago, Faceman2000 said:

Pretty sure there is no console on the Unity port, that’s a ZDoom feature.

 

Correct. Well, many ports have consoles. Unity port does not.

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9 hours ago, Doughnut1321 said:

I am playing Doom 2 Unity with the Syringe addon and can't access the console.  I need to increase turbo since my character always runs too slow for some tasks.  Also, I would like to know if there is a way to keep the turbo setting constant as you go from mod to mod, or permanently change the default value of 100 (same result, I guess).  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

There is no console; That's a Quake thing, not a Doom thing.

"Player moves too slow for some tasks" sounds like you don't have auto run on and you aren't used to using the run action manually, you can enable auto run in Options->Gameplay. There's otherwise no modification to the players speed from vanilla Doom so all maps are just as completable as they were before, turbo is not needed for anything.

 

The more you know: The -turbo command line parameter was added to Doom by John Carmack as a prank to allow Shawn Green to beat John Romero in a deathmatch.

Edited by Edward850

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7 hours ago, Edward850 said:

There is no console; That's a Quake thing, not a Doom thing.

"Player moves too slow for some tasks" sounds like you don't have auto run on and you aren't used to using the run action manually, you can enable auto run in Options->Gameplay. There's otherwise no modification to the players speed from vanilla Doom so all maps are just as completable as they were before, turbo is not needed for anything.

 

The more you know: The -turbo command line parameter was added to Doom by John Carmack as a prank to allow Shawn Green to beat John Romero in a deathmatch.

Actually, I have always run checked in settings.  The under needed speed quality is a strange quirk that I only discovered after watching several walkthroughs, and I realized my character was not moving fast enough.  My systems specs are more than sufficient.  In GZDoom, I correct it with the turbo setting.  I have Doom 2 classic which refers to Unity when mentioning the addons.  Is there a possibility that certain events that involve a challenge for an award run relatively faster than intended due to different parameters for the run speed of the game?  Thanks for the response and information.

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11 hours ago, Wyrmwood said:

Just wondering why you use Unity on PC, I know it works and all and it's handy for more casual gamers who just want to play Doom but I always think of it as the console version. On PC you'd be better served by other source ports.

That's the version sold by Microsoft, and I purchased it with a gift card acquired through Bing points.

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18 minutes ago, Doughnut1321 said:

Actually, I have always run checked in settings.  The under needed speed quality is a strange quirk that I only discovered after watching several walkthroughs, and I realized my character was not moving fast enough.  My systems specs are more than sufficient.  In GZDoom, I correct it with the turbo setting.  I have Doom 2 classic which refers to Unity when mentioning the addons.  Is there a possibility that certain events that involve a challenge for an award run relatively faster than intended due to different parameters for the run speed of the game?  Thanks for the response and information.

Are you aware of straferunning? tl;dr in Doom you run faster diagonally than straight forward.

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1 hour ago, Doughnut1321 said:

That's the version sold by Microsoft, and I purchased it with a gift card acquired through Bing points.

 

Yeah, everyone that buys Doom nowadays gets that one and everyone who bought the dos version (which you also would of got) on Steam got it added. Doesn't mean you need to use it, all you need from it is the IWAD file, download GZDoom or another source port, launch it and direct it to the IWAD.

 

Full clear instructions here :

 

 

Edit : just read one of your other posts, you already have GZDoom! Not sure then, I use the Unity port on Switch and have no problem running, Strafe run is not required for any of the WADS included with the Unity port, it's impossible with a controller (which is all you can use on consoles). System Specs seem unlikely too if you can run GZDoom, it's much more demanding than Unity. If you have a workaround for GZDoom though I guess just play Syringe on that.

 

Edited by Wyrmwood

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1 hour ago, Doughnut1321 said:

Is there a possibility that certain events that involve a challenge for an award run relatively faster than intended due to different parameters for the run speed of the game?  Thanks for the response and information.

No. Nobody makes maps with turbo required, especially because of it's cheat behavior (it's forcibly overriden in competitive multiplayer, and I'm not sure it's allowed in any Speedrun category) and actual slightly buggy behavior (it can cause player movement to overflow and move backwards).

 

I suspect that you may be misunderstanding something about player speed and have jumped to the wrong conclusion, so a good suggestion to get to the bottom of it is just play the game normally and once you encounter a specific discrepancy or problem, ask about that instead with what you getting vs expecting.

 

Keep in mind, there is strafe running, and that can come up in some custom maps (though not that I know of for any of the add-ons, especially because controllers make that fickle), though that just needs you to run while strafing as the name implies. No special settings required. Wall running is also a thing, but rarely does that become necessary even for secrets.

Edited by Edward850

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11 minutes ago, Edward850 said:

No. Nobody makes maps with turbo required, especially because of it's cheat behavior (it's forcibly overriden in competitive multiplayer, and I'm not sure it's allowed in any Speedrun category) and actual slightly buggy behavior (it can cause player movement to overflow and move backwards).

 

I suspect that you may be misunderstanding something about player speed and have jumped to the wrong conclusion, so a good suggestion to get to the bottom of it is just play the game normally and once you encounter a specific discrepancy or problem, ask about that instead with what you getting vs expecting.

 

Keep in mind, there is strafe running, and that can come up in some custom maps (though not that I know of for any of the add-ons, especially because controllers make that fickle), though that just needs you to run while strafing as the name implies. No special settings required. Wall running is also a thing, but rarely does that become necessary even for secrets.

I've tried strafe jumping and running.  As far as a specific example, the small gap between platforms to traverse to get the blue sphere in I think map 5 of Syringe, I cannot do no matter what method I use (and I did try strafe running).

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Maybe @Xaser can provide a faster answer as I'm not familiar with that specific map, but are you able to demonstrate what you are trying to do and compare it to someone else's footage, to be sure that are are actually supposed to grab the soulsphere that way?

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If you're talking about this soulsphere, it does need strafe running but it should be an easy strafe run across. Since you mentioned "strafe jumping," I should also mention that jumping is not required for anything in Syringe either (can you even jump in the Unity port?).

Edited by Shepardus

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1 hour ago, Shepardus said:

If you're talking about this soulsphere, it does need strafe running but it should be an easy strafe run across. Since you mentioned "strafe jumping," I should also mention that jumping is not required for anything in Syringe either (can you even jump in the Unity port?).

I didn't mean jumping.  I meant traversing a gap.  Sorry, I should have deleted that, since I know jumping is considered a function.

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1 hour ago, Edward850 said:

Maybe @Xaser can provide a faster answer as I'm not familiar with that specific map, but are you able to demonstrate what you are trying to do and compare it to someone else's footage, to be sure that are are actually supposed to grab the soulsphere that way?

That was the first thing I thought and checked for, but that is a good suggestion.

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Doesn’t the Unity port do automatic SR50? The wiki doesn’t back up me on that but I could have sworn I saw that mentioned somewhere. 

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9 hours ago, mikeday said:

Doesn’t the Unity port do automatic SR50? The wiki doesn’t back up me on that but I could have sworn I saw that mentioned somewhere. 

I think it gives you SR50 speeds when straferunning normally (SR40).

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18 hours ago, Doughnut1321 said:

Actually, I have always run checked in settings.  The under needed speed quality is a strange quirk that I only discovered after watching several walkthroughs, and I realized my character was not moving fast enough.

Could just be the fov of the other players. A high fov can result in the player speed looking and feeling faster than usual. Still you shouldn't need turbo to finish the game or any add-ons.

14 hours ago, mikeday said:

Doesn’t the Unity port do automatic SR50? The wiki doesn’t back up me on that but I could have sworn I saw that mentioned somewhere.  

Maybe here?

Spoiler

 

 

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17 hours ago, Shepardus said:

If you're talking about this soulsphere, it does need strafe running but it should be an easy strafe run across.

It seems there's legitimately a problem with this jump. Trying it on the Switch I actually can't reach it, and I suspect that Xaser has made it too tight (or the version that's in the add-ons might just be straight up broken?). The problem with the movement here is strafe running is non-viable given the circular input, so while it may be possible with enough trying, it's way too complicated to do here, especially with the limited setup space.

 

Though I'm getting the implication that @Doughnut1321 is playing on PC? It should be 100% doable on that with a mouse/keyboard.

Edited by Edward850

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So, reading up on this (and asking some questions in Discord since frankly this thread is super-confusing), there's nothing wrong with the map per se. That soulsphere requires a straferun, but the problem is apparently that the max straferun speed seems to be capped some controllers (e.g. Switch joycons) 'cause of how the input works. If that's the case, a) why hasn't this ever come up before? and b) this causes much more problems than just making a single secret inaccessible (e.g. it makes speedrunning non-viable). This is the first I'm hearing of anything like this.

 

I don't have a controller handy to test this out right now, but this is super-duper-strange.

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53 minutes ago, Xaser said:

So, reading up on this (and asking some questions in Discord since frankly this thread is super-confusing), there's nothing wrong with the map per se. That soulsphere requires a straferun, but the problem is apparently that the max straferun speed seems to be capped some controllers (e.g. Switch joycons) 'cause of how the input works. If that's the case, a) why hasn't this ever come up before? and b) this causes much more problems than just making a single secret inaccessible (e.g. it makes speedrunning non-viable). This is the first I'm hearing of anything like this.

 

I don't have a controller handy to test this out right now, but this is super-duper-strange.

Just a guess, but maybe it could be related to a deadzone setting or something similar (in this case, one that can't be changed by the user). I use a controller, with GzDoom. A long time ago I was having a similar issue - running speed felt fine, but I noticed that I could not run between some gaps that required SR40, even after replicating the "jump" by watching videos of the maps in question. Eventually, I figured out the problem - I had changed the left-stick deadzone (can't remember if it was both the outer and inner deadzone) by about 5% due to my old controller having old sticks and forgot about it. After changing the setting back to default, the problem was obviously solved. Drove me nuts for a while though, because I knew the problem was a result of something I had done.

Edited by TheMagicMushroomMan

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On 11/24/2022 at 11:27 PM, Edward850 said:

It seems there's legitimately a problem with this jump. Trying it on the Switch I actually can't reach it, and I suspect that Xaser has made it too tight (or the version that's in the add-ons might just be straight up broken?). The problem with the movement here is strafe running is non-viable given the circular input, so while it may be possible with enough trying, it's way too complicated to do here, especially with the limited setup space.

 

Though I'm getting the implication that @Doughnut1321 is playing on PC? It should be 100% doable on that with a mouse/keyboard.

I am using a controller.  Thank you very much for the analysis of the problem and offering an explanation.

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On 11/25/2022 at 1:01 AM, TheMagicMushroomMan said:

Just a guess, but maybe it could be related to a deadzone setting or something similar (in this case, one that can't be changed by the user). I use a controller, with GzDoom. A long time ago I was having a similar issue - running speed felt fine, but I noticed that I could not run between some gaps that required SR40, even after replicating the "jump" by watching videos of the maps in question. Eventually, I figured out the problem - I had changed the left-stick deadzone (can't remember if it was both the outer and inner deadzone) by about 5% due to my old controller having old sticks and forgot about it. After changing the setting back to default, the problem was obviously solved. Drove me nuts for a while though, because I knew the problem was a result of something I had done.

Thank you.  I'll try lowering the deadzone setting.

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Worth noting that I tried it later on Xbox and I did eventually manage to make it, it took a lot of tries and it mostly felt like a fluke. I wouldn't think deadzone is the issue because usually that's supposed to rescale the input, not trim it completely (though I say supposed to, I'm not surprised to hear GZDoom supposedly does).

 

So yeah, I think the circle nature of the input is cutting off the outer edge of the movement (because Doom's movement on a keyboard is shaped like a square). I wonder if auto adjusting the edges of the input to expand into a square is viable, if a patch could ever be done to the port.

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41 minutes ago, Doughnut1321 said:

Thank you.  I'll try lowering the deadzone setting.

It won't help unless you've already changed it. My problem happened because I changed the deadzone and forgot about it - you shouldn't have trouble with the default setting on GzDoom. If you do, you might want to consider the fact that your left stick has issues.

 

@Edward850 Worth noting that this was a while back, on GzDoom 4.1 or something - it might be "fixed" now. I'm fairly certain the deadzone does simply get trimmed (changing the outer deadzone makes movement slower as the deadzone increases). 99% certain changing from circle->square would fix the problem.

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