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ITaannl09

Should I replay ALL cacoawards

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Funny to stumble onto this. I have actually been doing this exact thing for a bit now as I thought it would be a fun time waster. Said time waster has taken several years and I'm only at 2014. I personally find it fun but it is 100% not a "all new players should do it" situation. And it is legally a crime to make anyone experience daedalus or the non highlights of eternal doom. 

 

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24 minutes ago, Ravendesk said:

I know you are being ironic, but there was a whole thing for that:

https://www.doomworld.com/25years/top-25-missed-cacowards/index/

 

I think it's very interesting to see the things that were missed and I hope to see the "missed cacowards" again some time in the future.

True, and that's a really great resource. I do think the cacoward team are getting better in general since that article was published, since they've added the twenty something for 202X section. There's quite a few wads in there that I personally like more than some of the stuff that won, but no matter where you think a wad should be placed it ultimately doesn't matter and it's awesome all of this stuff is shown off and we get essentially 40+ amazing wads showcased each year now.

 

 Which is also another reason playing all the cacoward winners is a somewhat mammoth undertaking. The team themselves say you shouldn't look much into the difference between a gold and silver cacoward winner, and some of the stuff that win may be less to your liking than what won. Hell, some of my favourite wads from last year only made the 22 more for 2022 because there was just so much good stuff released.

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7 hours ago, Bloo said:

It all started with lilith.pk3. that's all I will say.

i know this argument has been resolved already, but the cacowards honestly used to be a lot worse with highlighting wads that had great visuals but shit gameplay, long before lilith.pk3 was a thing.

 

hedrox, whispers of satan, legacy of suffering, knee deep in zdoom, and hell revealed 2 (which people apparently did somehow find visually appealing back in the day) all come to mind in regards to that. most of the stuff it has on there nowadays is at the bare minimum decent to play

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I would say play whatever is most appealing to you. It's your choice. I also hope you enjoy whatever you choose to play/replay. Just let an insult slide off.

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Are we really conflating 'great visuals' with lilith.pk3 of all things? Y'know, a WAD that is purposely broken and glitched (no judgement, IMO it's great for it)?

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13 minutes ago, Jayextee said:

Are we really conflating 'great visuals' with lilith.pk3 of all things? Y'know, a WAD that is purposely broken and glitched (no judgement, IMO it's great for it)?

nah, at least i'm not. it seemed like they were mostly complaining about wads that had bad gameplay but nice visuals, considering that they said that some of them looked pretty

 

though i do think lilith.pk3 looks great in a weird way

Edited by roadworx

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Well, on December 10th you'll have a whole bunch of new recommendations, OP. Play some prior winners that people talk about a lot in the meantime. 

 

I agree with others saying to go based off of preference and what looks good, I know I don't really agree with all the picks but that's the beauty of it is it not, everyone has different tastes. I like the combat oriented classical/modern stuff, not so much the artsy stuff and not so much slaughter but that's just a skill issue(tm)

 

But it is a good resource. No other singleplayer FPS has this big of a modding community other than maybe Quake and even Quake doesn't have a cacowards equivalent so you're in good hands in terms of finding what to play.

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7 hours ago, Monocled said:

I don't entirely agree with you cause that was the main idea of ULTRAKILL and that game is one of the best ever imo, But yeah some aren't that fun but have amazing story's and atmosphere like Bioshock and Bioshock is amazing even if the gameplay isn't great

My point was more that "being fun" is just one ethos that an author can follow, not that they shouldn't follow it if they want to. I recently played Pentiment and while there is some design in that game that I would call "fun" initially, the further I got into the game, the more I could feel my mental state degrading from casual enjoyment into passive anxiety and a sense of melancholy or loss. But I kept going because video games don't need to be strictly fun to keep my interest, it had a lot of things that were striking (painful) chords inside my heart, which made it worth it. As for other mediums, I'd hardly call Mysterious Skin a fun movie in any capacity, and I'd call House of Leaves an incredibly anxiety-inducing, borderline hypnotic work before I called it fun, but I love them both for different reasons.

 

Art mediums can be used to explore all kinds of emotional states, and shoehorning video games into the "they should be fun more than anything else" hole is doing them a real disservice.

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3 minutes ago, Maribo said:

My point was more that "being fun" is just one ethos that an author can follow, not that they shouldn't follow it if they want to. I recently played Pentiment and while there is some design in that game that I would call "fun" initially, the further I got into the game, the more I could feel my mental state degrading from casual enjoyment into passive anxiety and a sense of melancholy or loss. But I kept going because video games don't need to be strictly fun to keep my interest, it had a lot of things that were striking (painful) chords inside my heart, which made it worth it. As for other mediums, I'd hardly call Mysterious Skin a fun movie in any capacity, and I'd call House of Leaves an incredibly anxiety-inducing, borderline hypnotic work before I called it fun, but I love them both for different reasons.

 

Art mediums can be used to explore all kinds of emotional states, and shoehorning video games into the "they should be fun first" hole is doing them a real disservice.

never thought it about that way. I still have my opinions on the matter, but I do tend find a lot of wads just hard to play, not from being difficult, but because I just didn't find them fun or whatever doesn't mean they're bad necessarily. 

However funnily enough some of my favorite wads tend to be some of the most bland. I must have bad taste cuz one of my favorite slaughter maps is "Revenant Battleground." It's got a simple premise and it can be a bit tricky to get right.

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On 10/1/2023 at 12:08 AM, ITaannl09 said:

Hey I'm new to doom

and I'm wondering if I should replay ALL cacoawards
Just to get the best of the best
Is it worth it?

First of all, keep in mind that the Cacowards are a subjective list written by a small team of writers, they are not voted for by the Doom  community and as a result do not represent any kind of  "objective" consensus of what is considered great or mandatory reading. There have been plenty of controversial picks and oversights. But having said that, the Cacowards still generally contain most of what was great any given year.

 

Now, while attempting to play ALL Cacoward winners and runners-up (and honorable mentions) is unnecessary and guaranteed to break your spirit, you could set out to play all the number one picks. On the whole the Cacoward winners aren't ranked but the first pick is usually still singled out as the stand-out release of the year. This is also often the least controversial winner, like the one everybody in the community will happily agree on is very much deserving of a Cacoward. So this year for instance you can expect myhouse.wad to get that spot. There have been, however, exceptions to this "rule". The obvious one being lilith.pk3 in 2017 that ruffled a lot of feathers, and I'd say last year's pick, The Magenta Spire, was also somewhat controversial.

 

But that would give you wads like Heartland for 2021, Eviternity for 2019, Ancient Aliens for 2016, Sunlust for 2015, Going Down for 2014, and Back to Saturn X for 2013. In fact, that's a pretty good list to get you started. Throw in Alien Vendetta, Scythe 2, and Valiant, and you're good to go in terms of what is considered mandatory reading.

 

But having said all that, the best way to go about is to read through the Cacoward articles and play whatever piques your interest. They're all worth your attention. :)

Edited by Gregor

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1 hour ago, Gregor said:

you could set out to play all the number one picks. On the whole the Cacoward winners aren't ranked but the first pick is usually still singled out as the stand-out release of the year. This is also often the least controversial winner, like the one everybody in the community will happily agree on is very much deserving of a Cacoward. So this year for instance you can expect myhouse.wad to get that spot. There have been, however, exceptions to this "rule".

FYI, when doing the Cacowards lists, they are chosen completely randomly. There never was a "number one pick" at any point, so I'm sorry to say this is inaccurate.

 

We do not want to have a strict ranking system for the Cacowards because ultimately we believe in covering what we feel passionate writing about, not in determining what is objectively, or even subjectively, the best release of the year. This means that even runners-up and honorable mentions are definitely worth a look, provided the screenshots and/or descriptions catch your fancy, something that applies for the main winners as well, of course.

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3 hours ago, Dynamo said:

FYI, when doing the Cacowards lists, they are chosen completely randomly. There never was a "number one pick" at any point, so I'm sorry to say this is inaccurate.

Really? That's interesting. Than it's a rather curious coincidence that classics like BTSX E1, Ancient Aliens, Going Down, Sunlust, Eviternity, and Heartland all topped the lists of their respective years. That could explain Magenta Spire's positioning from last year. Though the fact that lilith.pk3 was not only named a winner but given top billing also seemed rather deliberate back then.

Then again, human beings are notoriously bad at gauging randomness. So I'll take your word for it.

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5 minutes ago, Gregor said:

Then again, human beings are notoriously bad at gauging randomness. So I'll take your word for it.

Last year all we did was use some site that just randomly shuffled words around and that's how we got the lineup as I recall, so in such cases, it was just a machine deciding in our stead. :P

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Ever since Sigil missed it out in 2019, and it only got a pityful also-ran accolade with a salty "we're better than you, Romero" review, I can't take this award seriously. Full of nepotism here, usually friends of friends have advantages. Re-checked the final top 10 that year, and other than Eviternity, nothing truly deserves a higher place than Sigil.

 

If you want to play the best wads, go for the official Bethesda add-ons. They have some misses too, but those mapsets are much more relevant IMHO.

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1 hour ago, Gregor said:

Really? That's interesting. Than it's a rather curious coincidence that classics like BTSX E1, Ancient Aliens, Going Down, Sunlust, Eviternity, and Heartland all topped the lists of their respective years. That could explain Magenta Spire's positioning from last year. Though the fact that lilith.pk3 was not only named a winner but given top billing also seemed rather deliberate back then.

Then again, human beings are notoriously bad at gauging randomness. So I'll take your word for it.

 

Some were moved around for other reasons. The literal reason discussed for Heartland coming first was "Hey the reader might be more likely to download the Eternity port while they're still fresh maybe." It was also not uncommon for wads to be shuffled around for page lengths to match sidebars. Some years they might have intentionally picked a more discussed wad to lead off but that's for reading purposes. Like, in 2015, Valiant had around the same critical respect and popularity as Sunlust, so it wouldn't make sense that Valiant was '#6'.

 

Basically the whole concept of a "#1 pick" doesn't exist and would have very different answers. 

 

19 minutes ago, Captain Viridian said:

Ever since Sigil missed it out in 2019, and it only got a pityful also-ran review with some salty comments, I can't take this award seriously. Full of nepotism here, usually friends of friends have advantages.

 

l m a o 

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24 minutes ago, Captain Viridian said:

Ever since Sigil missed it out in 2019, and it only got a pityful also-ran accolade with a salty "we're better than you, Romero" review, I can't take this award seriously. Full of nepotism here, usually friends of friends have advantages. Re-checked the final top 10 that year, and other than Eviternity, nothing truly deserves a higher place than Sigil.

 

If you want to play the best wads, go for the official Bethesda add-ons. They have some misses too, but those mapsets are much more relevant IMHO.

 

What a quality first post, congrats.

 

Anyway, enough of this.

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