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Ralseiwithagun

Game that everyone hates but you like?

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There has been a lot of flak on YouTube recently about Tomb Raider: Anniversary not being a good game. I've only played through the first 2 chapters, and I have to say that it is a really good game. I like it a lot better than Legend, but I still cannot say that I like it better than Underworld though. Let's be honest, the original Core Design tomb raider games are almost unplayable by today's standards. Anniversary also has my favorite character model of Lora Croft from all the Crystal Dynamics' Legend trilogy. I love using custom outfit mods, especially the BloodRayne outfit, during gameplay sessions. I just don't know why there is so much hate for this game.

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1 hour ago, Halfblind said:

There has been a lot of flak on YouTube recently about Tomb Raider: Anniversary not being a good game. I've only played through the first 2 chapters, and I have to say that it is a really good game. I like it a lot better than Legend, but I still cannot say that I like it better than Underworld though. Let's be honest, the original Core Design tomb raider games are almost unplayable by today's standards. Anniversary also has my favorite character model of Lora Croft from all the Crystal Dynamics' Legend trilogy. I love using custom outfit mods, especially the BloodRayne outfit, during gameplay sessions. I just don't know why there is so much hate for this game.

As a TR fan myself, I'm more than surprised seeing that a lot of people here find the classic games nearly unplayable. I guess it's more of a personal preference, since they're indeed nowhere as fast paced as DOOM or other action-adventure games.

But yeah, the Crystal Dynamics Trilogy games are all good IMO (I've never played much of Underworld due to lack of sufficient hardware). I can tell that people who dislike them are usually the disgruntled Classic TR fans who feel like Lara's characterization in the Trilogy is not to their own liking. For those not in the know, in Classic TR she's this one stoic badass adventurer girl who only hunts treasures for fun. However, in the Trilogy she's given a deeper background about her parents mysteriously missing in an airplane accident involving her during childhood, making her a more sentimental human character (which, to the classic fans, just seems all the weaker in all aspects).

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4 minutes ago, taufan99 said:

I'm more than surprised seeing that a lot of people here find the classic games nearly unplayable.

 

in Classic TR she's this one stoic badass adventurer girl who only hunts treasures for fun.

There are two forms of unplayability these days. First is the fact that owning a physical copy of a retro game and to be played on a retro console are becoming more and more inaccessible. If they are accessible, they are becoming more and more expensive. Just look at how expensive Outrun2006 is on eBay. Second, I grew up playing games on the original Xbox and PC so playing older 3D games are really hard for me because some of them make me a little sick.

 

As for LC herself, you can be a beautiful badass with a deep emotional backstory. I just don't understand why you can't have it both ways. Take Rynn from Draken and Rayne from BloodRayne for an example.

 

By the way there is a couple of TR1 and TR2 fan made remakes using the UE4/5 engine in the works.

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Oh! I just got reminded of Star Wars: Force Commander!

 

One of the late LucasArts' earliest attempts at a RTS. It was janky and frustrating, it did not do well and I do not think I could even bring myself to play through it again, but goddamn did I love that game back in the days, even though I could not muster the strength to play the final level: the story was surprisingly engaging, the questionable game balance contributed to the feeling of being in charge of an unstoppable army of doom (as the Empire) or a rag-tag bunch of rebels (as the Rebel Alliance) and the remix soundtrack is still very cool!

 

 

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I never really see any people talk about games like Stonekeep. It's a fun game IMO.

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the people who hate d*rk s*uls II (not scholar) haven't played a from software game released before feburary 5 2009 and it shows

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15 minutes ago, heliumlamb said:

the people who hate d*rk s*uls II (not scholar) haven't played a from software game released before feburary 5 2009 and it shows


Tanimura is amazing and salvaged one hell of a trainwreck. I hope he had a great time with Elden Ring.

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There's a lot of them, but for starters I'll drop Super Pitfall on the NES. It's jank AF, but I learned it a couple years ago and managed to work my way all the way through it with the help of a guide. It was actually pretty fun learning its quirks and various ways around the traps throughout the cavern.

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On 10/6/2023 at 12:34 AM, Halfblind said:

There has been a lot of flak on YouTube recently about Tomb Raider: Anniversary not being a good game. I've only played through the first 2 chapters, and I have to say that it is a really good game. I like it a lot better than Legend, but I still cannot say that I like it better than Underworld though. Let's be honest, the original Core Design tomb raider games are almost unplayable by today's standards. Anniversary also has my favorite character model of Lora Croft from all the Crystal Dynamics' Legend trilogy. I love using custom outfit mods, especially the BloodRayne outfit, during gameplay sessions. I just don't know why there is so much hate for this game.

 

If one looks at reviews online, they are more positive than not by a considerable margin. Tomb Raider classic fans can be a very... shall we say, inflexible bunch. The original games are like the sacred texts, and any deviation from them is tantamount to heresy. To me, TRA is one of the best game remakes ever. It keeps what was good about the original, and melds it to the visual superior Legend engine perfectly, benefiting from it's far, far superior controls.

 

On 10/6/2023 at 2:52 AM, taufan99 said:

As a TR fan myself, I'm more than surprised seeing that a lot of people here find the classic games nearly unplayable. I guess it's more of a personal preference, since they're indeed nowhere as fast paced as DOOM or other action-adventure games.

 

Any game where critical controls take several seconds to react just isn't good enough. I really, really tried to get into the original games (cause I love archaeology and history), but just couldn't. I am sure that anyone who persisted and got used to their quirks sees no issue with them, but it is a huge barrier to entry.

 

On 10/6/2023 at 2:52 AM, taufan99 said:

However, in the Trilogy she's given a deeper background about her parents mysteriously missing in an airplane accident involving her during childhood, making her a more sentimental human character (which, to the classic fans, just seems all the weaker in all aspects).

 

There is a lot of that feeling it seems yes. It is completely silly. Do they think she just came out a complete badass from age 0? It all starts somewhere, and to think was always that way is completely absurd. And I will laugh in the face of anyone who says Legends trilogy Lara isn't as much of a badass as OG Lara.

 

"From now on, your every breath is a gift from me."
"Try begging for your life like the last time we met."

Yeah, not badass at all!

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@Murdoch The only thing I've seen that is objectively worse is that Anniversary tones down the very creepy looking final level of the original, which is an odd design translation, but other than that I've seen far worse when it comes to remakes.

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1 hour ago, Murdoch said:

Do they think she just came out a complete badass from age 0?

 

Burst out of the womb on a motorcycle and cut the umbilical cord with a burst of fire from her dual-wielded pistols, donchaknow.

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7 hours ago, Lila Feuer said:

The only thing I've seen that is objectively worse is that Anniversary tones down the very creepy looking final level of the original, which is an odd design translation, but other than that I've seen far worse when it comes to remakes.

I have not played the original Tomb Raider, but I hear it does not have Lara randomly feeling bad about killing some mook.

 

That part was... odd. I do not mind developers giving Lara a more complex personality, but that scene felt completely unearned.

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1 hour ago, TheNoiseClassicDooMfan said:

While I haven’t played it and only seen the trailer, ROTT 2013, the trailers keep my adhd brain stimulated

The Andrew Hulshult soundtrack is quite good.

 

Although I am really not a fan of RoTT's gameplay, I envy it for officially getting the IDKFA treatment.

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Honestly I really enjoyed the SNES version of Wolf3D, AFAIK this is where the new weapon art first debuted before being ported into the Mac and 3DO versions, where the new weapons first showed up (rocket launcher and flamethrower) and the ammo expanding backpack, the redone treasure system where you collect 50 pieces to gain an extra life (treasure heals you over 100 in Jaguar funnily enough), a couple of bosses from Spear of Destiny added, and what is effectively the "dumbed down" sister set of 30 maps that likewise compliment its older brother Jaguar Doom that have been in every other version of Wolf3D besides the DOS original, GBA and the X360/PS3 port, also known as the Second Encounter in Mac. The SNES version runs well too unlike Doom. It's really just the censorship.

(Technically the 3DO version does supply the 60 DOS levels, but it's inheriting new limitations based on I think the Mac version where guard count is reduced from 149 to 127 or some shit like that so a bunch of enemies are missing on the highest difficulty.)

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I don’t know if this one can count, but DMC: Devil May Cry!! I remembered people shitting on the game from the moment the trailer first came out. Hell I remembered a lot of the video reactions from fans of the original. Now at the time I wasn’t really a fan of Devil May Cry so I just looked at it as a weird take on the series when I watched the trailer. I know the developer of the game also said some things to piss off fans something about how because of how original Dante looked with his white hair he’d be laughed at nowadays (game even poked fun at this idea), but look who’s laughing now I guess?

 

The game came out and I actually found it to be tons of fun!! Though the idea to turn Devil May Cry into some They Live video game and make it political was a strange choice. In a way I would have liked to see where they would have gone with this universe if it had continued.

 

 

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@Spooner5020 I enjoyed it, the gameplay is if anything a watered down DMC 3 and the Limbo visuals are great, also like the soundtrack, but the story is...pretty stupid, as was the characterization of everybody. Kat was useless, in a series known for femme fatales. Vergil's Downfall was a cool DLC and I liked the tonal shirt, especially with music from Jason Graves, but alas there was no future for this reimagining that if anything I understand why it pissed so many fans off as it inevitably just ended up stalling DMC 5. Plus Capcom was going through a dark age with trying to appeal to western audiences.

 

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I'm going to list of a few games that I like that a lot of people have some very adverse reactions to me liking them.

 

Mighty No. 9 

 

Yes, I was around during the inception of the Kickstarter campaign, all of the really stupid things that went down with Keiji Inafune's poor decisions that handicapped the project, the delays, and the insulting marketing campaign by Deep Silver, the last of which made me expect the worst out of the game, but that was until I saw the Japanese RAY DLC campaign by comcept themselves that gave me some hope for it. I pre-ordered the Wii U version, and while I was dreading the alleged rumors of the game bricking the console, I sat down and played it, and despite the subpar performance, long load times, and rare crashes I ran into, I thought it was a decent game and continued to play through devoting myself to 100% the game's Achievement. I later bought the game again on Steam during a sale and playing a better version of the game that can run at a better frame-rate and more stability (mainly if you play the game with its 64-bit executable; for some dumb reason Steam calls the 32-bit executable despite being made for 64-bit systems), my opinion of the game elevated and I found more things I liked about the game the more I played it. As rough as the visuals are, I really like the art style of the game, it shows a lot of inspirations of the character designs of the classic Mega Man series and yet does so with a strikingly colorful look that feels like a more modern take on the original Astro Boy, one of the main inspirations for Mega Man. Not to mention the soundtrack was pretty good in my opinion and thought it complemented the game nicely. Despite the lacking quality of the cutscenes and stilted appearance of the characters, I loved the familial bound the Mighty Numbers (after he healed them) have with Beck and the humbling themes of overcoming self-doubt issues, which is something more than what I can say from anything I got out of with the Azure Striker Gunvolt series with its bland characters and animu as all hell writing (especially with the first game and then third game throwing everything that was established in the previous games out the window).

 

Playing RAY's story added another layer of enjoyment for me; her gameplay is like a cross between Zero in a Classic-styled Mega Man game with the encroaching health system of the PS2 Shinobi game that really complemented the game's fast-paced gameplay while remixing some of the enemy placements to change up the levels and how to approach them. While so many people where going out of their way to make Mighty No. 9 look worse than it actually is by abusing the game's overpowered weapons (especially the Remote Cannon for Beck) and exploiting glitches, I challenge myself with the game and try to analyze levels and how to approach them to beat them in stylish ways (as badly as I am with this game recently) while mixing up the weapons and find use for them (such as Pyro's Fire Explosion ability, which many write off as "useless" while I found some practical application for it where I can treat it as an offensive shield-type weapon), which to me shows the games strengths more with each playthrough. Calling this a "speedrun" game to me is kind of misleading; while there is an emphasis of using a dash to defeat enemies, the way the enemies are laid in the levels kind of presents a challenge of how you use the AcXelerate mechanics of the game to take down enemies quickly and efficiently as possible.

 

As much as I like the game, I'm not blind to its flaws and missed potential had Inafune handled himself better with the Kickstarter project. The level design is definitely rough in a lot places (and the penalty for dying in Countershade's level is just unfair for all the wrong reasons), the in-engine cutscene are more lifeless than Sonic '06, the fire effects look really amateur, the English localization is spotty (although I think thanks to Matt Papa, we got a nice Doom meme reference that, in my opinion, worked out and made me happy that someone understands how awesome Doom is) and the game can be glitchy (although from my experience, I didn't ran into the bugs nearly as often as others claimed, especially on PC running the 64-bit version). Even though I ran into the game completely crashing my Wii U with that version a few times, but it was not the console bricking nightmare that many claim just to add more mud to sling at the game, and my console is still fully operational even after said crashes. But similarly to how I feel about the Splaterhouse (2010) reboot, the issues I have with the game and the controversies surrounding it, it did not affect my overall enjoyment of the game, and there's so much potential that's begging to be refined -- and no, I do not consider Mighty Gunvolt Burst as "what Mighty No. 9 should have been" since it takes away so much what makes it stand out as its own thing from Mega Man -- yet so many haters want to bash this game into oblivion to the point of becoming pathetic and played out, especially coming from those who want Mighty No. 9 to fail. And yet despite trying to impartial with those who feel burned by this game and say that it's not as bad people are making it out to be, they go out of their way to berate me for sticking up for this game (and Inafune) just because I like this game when they want to be toxic about it and the Azure Striker Gunvolt fanboys obsessively love gloating how that series is "objectively" better in every way and claim that it is "the true successor to Mega Man" while it has next to nothing compared to Mega Man if you ask me. It gets even worse when fanboys of Mega Man 11 and other crowd-funded projects like Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night give those games the same circlejerk treatment, using that game just to throw Mighty No. 9 under the bus to make those game look better than they actually are while ignoring or de-legitimizing criticism of those games. As someone who grew up with the classic Mega Man series, to me Mighty No. 9 is a game that carries on its spirit and reminds me of why I love the series so much despite a lot of its problems, both inside the game and out, but to me, it absolutely does not deserve the amount of toxicity it gets still to this day just because it didn't live up to people's expectations.

TL;DR version: To me it is game that wears classic Mega Man's spirit on its sleeve while doing of its own things like mixing in elements from Mega Man X that makes it a nice mirage of those two series. Despite the rough presentation, level design, and localization, I thought it was an inoffensive Mega Man-inspired game that is far from an "unredeemable failure" that the internet wants to make this game out to be. Underneath the unpolished and underdeveloped exterior, there's a game with a nuanced, fast-paced take on the classic Mega Man formula with nice art direction, a catchy soundtrack, and humbling themes of familial bonds and overcoming self-doubt that you don't see often in video games.

DmC: Devil May Cry

Since @Spooner5020 described what I was going to say, I will say that as a long-time Devil May Cry fan, I was expecting this to be awful going from the trailer although I was kind of out of the loop because I just ignored everything after the initial trailer of the game. I saw the game going on a deal on Humble Bundle for dirt cheap in a bundle of games, and out of morbid curiosity I played it on Steam... and I was pleasantly surprised. The one big issue I have with the game with the game I have is the color alignment system, which to me stifled the combo potential since certain enemies are restricted to either Angel or Devil weapons, but even before using the mod to fix that issue I had a lot of fun with the free-flowing combat despite the lack of manual lock-ons. The story was pretty dumb, but I was able to enjoy it in a "so bad, it's good" kind of why and I don't think that this interpretation of Dante is nearly the callous douche as he's made out to be. Kat though is pretty meaningless in the story. It's a damn shame that we don't have Definitive Edition on PC; I have it on Xbox One (although my older brother is the one who owns the console) and it fixes a lot of the issues I have with the game while adding new stuff to make it more engaging. Like seriously Capcom, why can't PC players enjoy this version already.

 

Bullet Witch

This was something that I was curious about since it was a game that I seen on the Xbox marketplace that featured a beautiful witch who uses guns and magic to fight monsters, but slept on it for a long time since there were other games I wanted to get on my Xbox 360 at time. I eventually picked up the game on PC thanks to XSEED making an official port of Bullet Witch, and despite the jankiness of the game, this was a kinda neat and arcade-y third-person shooter with some awesome spells to use. The biggest complain I heard was the gigantic levels being a slog, which I can agree with, the levels are too big for their own good, but thanks to XSEED Games restoring an unused dash function in the game, it makes the levels much more tolerable. Another issue people had was how Atari, in their infinite wisdom, decided to nerf the guns just to make players use magic more, while making the extra missions that were free in the Japanese version as paid DLCs for the Western versions. Once again XSEED Games saves the day and rebalances the game to be in-line to the Japanese version and making each guns viable to certain situations and all the extra missions are unlockable and built into the game, and these missions offer some unique challenges that mixes up the game with new rules and objectives or lets you run less with destructive magical powers. One hit kills from the snipers (although that can be easily countered by summoning a wall in their line of sight) or a thrown object by the Wallnut Heads is pretty bullshit though. This isn't a bad game in my opinion though definitely ambitious without the development talent to back it up coming from Cavia, the same company behind NieR and the PS2 Ghost in the Shell game, yet so many critics and Bayonetta fanboys are quick to bash this game into the ground, the latter of which go out of the way to call Bullet Witch a "Bayonetta rip-off" when Bayonetta wasn't even a thing in 2006. And for those who are put off by the game's English dub, there's an undub mod that someone graciously made it a better experience if you ask me.

Edited by AmethystViper

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On 10/4/2023 at 8:08 PM, Lippeth said:

I don't think "everyone" is meant to be taken so literally, otherwise there wouldn't be much room for discussion. "Everyone" in this context could be your circle of friends, an online community or Youtubers/streamers and their hordes of commenters, a particularly loud minority, critic scores vs user scores or just generally what an individual "feels" is everyone. It might sound like a cop out to take so many liberties but that's how I've been reading into it and the discussion has been relatively entertaining to me so far, for such a brief op.

 

There are of course some games listed here that I consider generally well liked, and I've listed a few that others have had a different surrounding experience with, but I like hearing everyone's stories and different points of view all the same (including yours, @TheMagicMushroomMan).

 

That said, "everyone" could very well be meant explicitly, I'm sure@TheNoiseClassicDooMfan can clarify.

The replier can decide on what everybody means

It can be everyone you know, a poorly rated game, or whatever

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On 10/7/2023 at 12:16 PM, Rudolph said:

The Andrew Hulshult soundtrack is quite good.

 

Although I am really not a fan of RoTT's gameplay, I envy it for officially getting the IDKFA treatment.

I mentioned it because people report the game having frame rate issues and other glitches, like it’s literally lagging in the trailers, but said trailers are still stimulating to my adhd brain

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25 minutes ago, Lila Feuer said:

@AmethystViper I'm pretty sure all the things the definitive edition added were already mods for the PC version, they just rolled them into the console version.

I've used those mods before, although I don't think there's a mod that adds manual lock-ons, the (optional) gameplay changes that Hardcore Mode has, and the Turbo Mode mod also sadly speeds up other places of the game like the cutscenes. I still need to get the Vergil Downfall DLC too.

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On 10/3/2023 at 2:21 PM, Drywtler said:

I do know about it, haven't played it yet. The only way I had to play X6 until recently was through Megaman X Collection on my PS2. My laptop could emulate it, but I tried to emulate other PS1 games before and the performance wasn't great. I hope POPStarter runs it without problems!

Which emulators have you tried? I think DuckStation or PCSX Re-ARMed should be able to run better on your laptop.

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Sweats nervously at my hundreds of dollars of shameful Overwatch skin purchases...  

 

Umm...


Zelda 2: Adventure of Link (NES) was a decent game, despite it being notoriously grindy and bullcrap.  I distinctly remember having to cheese the final boss and look a couple of things up.  Overall the fight system was just fun and dynamic enough to keep me busy, and it had some exploration and minor RPG/level-up elements to compliment it.  It had just enough things going on to keep it from being boring.


Glover (N64) was one I rented from Blockbuster a few times when I was young, and I remember enjoying it just like any of the other colorful 3D platformers.  I dunno if it aged well as, or even held up in the first place to, Banjo and Mario 64.


Zelda: Skyward Sword (Wii) - was actually pretty good.  Mechanics were good once you see past the jank:  I bet most people tried swinging the sword like it's 1-to-1 sword-play simulator (and how it was marketed), but it's just 8 directional digital swipe inputs disguised as motion controls.  You're better off keeping the remote center, and then flicking in the sword-swipe direction you want; it counterintuitively punishes you if wind it back like a normal sword swing (and the wind-up itself causes your character to swing in the opposite direction you intend, ironically).  Once you figure that out, the fight mechanics are actually very engaging.  For example, deku monsters have hard heads but rotate them in various orientations before opening their mouths to bite, so you have to have to slice along the opened crease of their mouth gape to kill them, etc.  On the down-side, the game was hyper linear and had egregious backtracking/retracing fetch quests to stretch the game out.  Before release it seemed like it could've been "Windwaker in the sky" but it didn't deliver.  Still a decent game.

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1 hour ago, AmethystViper said:

Which emulators have you tried?

Some PCSXE, dunno which version because that's what it came bundled with a huge rar file I torrented years ago.

As for my specs, well...

Quote

Asus Zenbook X541N-GO013T

OS: Windows 10 Single Language 64-bit
CPU: Intel Pentium N4200 1.10GHz (turbo 2.50GHz)
RAM: 4GB 1600MHz
Motherboard: Asus ?
Graphics: Intel HD Graphics 505
HDD: TOSHIBA MQ01ABF050 (500GB, 5400rpm)

 

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4 minutes ago, Drywtler said:

Some PCSXE, dunno which version because that's what it came bundled with a huge rar file I torrented years ago.

As for my specs, well...

 

Yeah I think that sounds like PCSX, which is ancient. The "current" version of that is PCSX-ReARMed although it was dropped since DuckStation is basically that but better, however, I just discovered there is apparently PCSX-Redux, which aims to bring back PCSX-ReARMed and bring it up to more modern standards.

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