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LouigiVerona

Monsters are being blocked for a mysterious reason

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Folks,

 

I am attaching a map that was generated by Oblige. I have been using Oblige for years and have never encountered a situation like this. The map in question is MAP04. I am playing it with GZDoom.

 

In the map, the monsters are on a ledge and cannot enter the room - a completely normal situation. When the player triggers the switch, the floor turns into stairs. However, a surprising thing happens: while the player can move up and down the stairs normally, monsters get stuck at step 3 or so. They do see the player and shoot at him, but seemed to be blocked from walking further.

At the same time, Cacodemons can pass through the passage normally.

 

I have looked at this passage in the editor, and nothing looks suspicious. I even tried changing some things, like increasing the height of the passage, although it's fine as it is. Nothing resolved the situation.

 

I am curious what's happening in this map.

savage_encounter_MAP04.zip

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I can't find the problem stairs from description, but a lot of stairs I see are awfully narrow. If this isn't a problem, consider giving a sector number for problem place or something.

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It's probably sector 995, maybe 996. But anyway, it's these stairs.

 

Stairs being narrow doesn't explain the problem at hand. If they were too narrow, then monsters wouldn't be able to traverse them, yet, they do until they get blocked at almost the very end. And no such problem exists anywhere else on the map.

 

 

untitled2.png

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Ok, so I think the problem is that the sector tagged 3 is raised by 1 pixel. When triggered, it will raise by additional 8 creating height difference of 9 between it and the blue floor. Monsters won't step into position where they end up over floors with height difference greater than 24, so they can't make a step into the blue sector, as it + 3 steps will add to 25.

I'm actually surprised they can navigate steps this narrow at all, but it probably makes sense since they will walk in increment of 8.

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3 minutes ago, ViolentBeetle said:

Ok, so I think the problem is that the sector tagged 3 is raised by 1 pixel. When triggered, it will raise by additional 8 creating height difference of 9 between it and the blue floor. Monsters won't step into position where they end up over floors with height difference greater than 24, so they can't make a step into the blue sector, as it + 3 steps will add to 25.

I'm actually surprised they can navigate steps this narrow at all, but it probably makes sense since they will walk in increment of 8.

 

Well, each subsequent step sector is raised by 1 pixel as well. I am not sure it explains this. The player can move around the stairs with no problems. Why would it be a problem for the monster?

 

Also, they get blocked way before the blue floor.

 

I appreciate you spending time on this, but I think you should actually load up the level and see it in action. It's quite bizarre and they get stuck, to simplify, in the middle of the stairs. And I don't see there being any big jumps between individual steps. It all looks quite uniform.

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Just now, LouigiVerona said:

Well, each subsequent step sector is raised by 1 pixel as well. I am not sure it explains this. The player can move around the stairs with no problems. Why would it be a problem for the monster?

I removed the height difference and it worked, try it. Granted, I didn't change think of only changing the first one.

If I'm not mistaken, the rest of the sectors don't care where they start, they use the first sector for reference. So they'll go 8 units above previous destination, not 8*n above their current destination.

 

Why would it be a problem for the monster? Because it's a monster and Doom AI is very simple and can't judge if falling off the cliff would be a problem. It goes by simple height differential.

 

Basically, standing on blue floor and 3 steps for a monster is illegal and it gets pushed back. Standing on 4 steps is fine.

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1 minute ago, ViolentBeetle said:

I removed the height difference and it worked, try it. Granted, I didn't change think of only changing the first one.

If I'm not mistaken, the rest of the sectors don't care where they start, they use the first sector for reference. So they'll go 8 units above previous destination, not 8*n above their current destination.

 

Why would it be a problem for the monster? Because it's a monster and Doom AI is very simple and can't judge if falling off the cliff would be a problem. It goes by simple height differential.

 

Basically, standing on blue floor and 3 steps for a monster is illegal and it gets pushed back. Standing on 4 steps is fine.

 

Got ya! Thank you very much!

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