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Brad_tilf

Wanted - a few testers!

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Map 3 of Descent Into Hell is almost complete and I need level testers. Different platforms, different ports - all are welcome. I am trying to make this compatible with as much as possible.
I am working on some minor display issues with Jdoom (pretty much taken care of I think) and I've heard of HOM's (minor) in Legacy but I think I fixed that as well. Mostly I need feedback on the difficulty at UV. Any takers?
If so - email me here: interleave1@earthlink.net
What can you expect?
Lots of movement and a map that doesn't play the same way twice in a row. I've worked hard to create a map that plays differently every time you play it depending on about a thousand things.
Here are some screenies:
Click here

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What method did you use to get the 3D bridge in jDooM? I ask because I recently completed a map that uses DooM2.exe compatible tricks to create a 3D bridge. It works just as designed in DooM2.exe, ZDooM, and Legacy. But in GL Legacy it completely craps up, with the player falling into and being trapped in the bridge sector. In jDooM the player can cross above and below without problems, but a HOM effect is created after the bridge is "raised".

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Well, the bridge appears fine (the way I intended) in every port but the gl ports of course. If you were to look below the bridge you would see that in Jdoom it does look like complete crap so I made the floor very far down. Interestingly though - I used invisible lines to create a "walkable" surface in Jdoom. In all regular ports the bridge is see-through - meaning that you can look through it to the area below. In Jdoom - the gl engine created a texture based on what was on either side of the bridge so that it can not be seen through but instead looks solid. It is a rather intersting and striking effect actually.
More impressive is the stairs, which not only are three dimensional in appearance but don't get any HOM's, etc.. underneath them. The GL Ports rendered these fine when I used BSP23X for DOS but were trashed using Zennode. Alternately, I and a friend tried the same map with Zennode and while the stairs were trashed, the bridge appeared as I had originally designed it and intended it to appear and as it does in all the non-gl ports. So, really, the issue lies with the bsp program and how it builds the nodes as compared to how the 3d port renders the map. Unfortuanately, I was unable to duplicate the stairs in that map and not have them look like shit. I don't know why the nodes builder built either of those structures in such a way that that one worked and looked properly and the other came out different than the intent. I also don't know why the other nodes builder did the exact opposite.
I also attempte to create a grate in a floor in another part of the map which the gl port completely trashed.
Answer? No f'n clue. I keep hoping that someone who knows something about nodes building and can do the coding can come up with the solution and create a nodes builder that will allow the 3d ports to render these special sectors correctly all the time the way they are intended to look.
If you like - send me an email - I'll send you the map and you can dissect it and try it with different nodes builders. Perhaps the answer lies in the command line options of the nodes builders and the correct settings will solve the problems and explain why some stuff works and some doesn't.
Also - No other nodes builders that I tried made the map even playable in either of those areas and the best results I've gotten were with bsp23x for DOS. i don't know why.
Even the most up to date BSP for Windows didn't do it correctly.

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Brad_tilf said:

If you were to look below the bridge you would see that in Jdoom it does look like complete crap ... In Jdoom - the gl engine created a texture based on what was on either side of the bridge so that it can not be seen through but instead looks solid. It is a rather intersting and striking effect actually.

[/b]I know exactly what you're talking about, because the same thing happened to me. jDooM creates a flat, based on the textures of adjacent sidedefs. Unfortunately, the sides of the bridge get the HOM effect.

The GL Ports rendered these fine when I used BSP23X for DOS but were trashed using Zennode .... So, really, the issue lies with the bsp program and how it builds the nodes as compared to how the 3d port renders the map.

I used WadAuthor's internal node builder, which I believe is one of the versions of BSP. I also tried ZenNode, which screwed up the bridge in every port I used, including ZDooM and Legacy, which had rendered the bridge fine. It did the same thing to my window-over-window sectors, while WA's internal node builder caused no problems to these sectors in non-GL ports. I suspect the GL ports conflict with the non-traditional sector references associated with DooM/2 compatible 3D bridges and windows-over-windows.

Perhaps the answer lies in the command line options of the nodes builders and the correct settings will solve the problems and explain why some stuff works and some doesn't.

Again, I think it's the non-compatibility of GL ports with unorthodox sector referencing, rather than the node builders themselves.

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Well, yes - thats part of it. But, as I found out, certain "3d" aspects were able to be rendered depending on the bsp program so it does have an effect.
Its the reason why i couldn't release Bloodworks. The GL engines simply could not deal with everything I required from them in that map.

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