Super Sonic DooM - Questions

[The Ultimate DooMer]

So, with the Super Sonic DooM demo getting mixed reviews on every front, here comes the questions:

1. What do you think could be improved for the final version?

2. Are there any features you'd like to see more/less of?

3. Is there anything new you think should be in there?

(I get the final say of course, but I will take your suggestions into consideration)

[Ichor]

Anyone who says it needs more impsex will be visciously and brutally ignored.

[zark]

Needs more ichorsex.

[Nanami]

Super Sonic Doom... this I gotta see. /newstuff I imagine?

[Tormentor667]

Well, as I heard the title at the very beginning of the developement, I thought of a real Sonic replacement and not just Doom which has some jumppads and sonic sounds/music in it. That's the reason why I was very disappointed from the demo. I'd like to get this "Sonic" feeling again if I play the wad but this demo didn't get me in the right mood.

My tipps for you and your success:
- Try to get your hands on Sonic sprites
- Use Sonicish textures and NO(!) doom textures, it really looks shitty
- Make the terrains also look more like Sonic's maps (clear edges and textures)

[NiGHTMARE]

Perhaps replace the health bonuses with various sizes of rings?

[Vile]

I was somewhat skeptical of this idea as well, and while first starting off I wasn't really sure how to play it. I was sorta blindly running around collecting weapons and randomly taking shots at imps. As the levels progressed though, it seemed more and more like doom (and a lot like the techbases from 007ltsd in map04, which I thought was an excellent episode btw), so maybe I'll stick to just slugging it out with whatever monsters I find. :)

One bug I noticed, there's a hole in the second level that you can get stuck in, near the base of a cliff that has the radsuit on it. You can sorta see the walls cave inward from there. Also, at the end of the first level, I killed the cacos but while running around like crazy I left most the imps alive. After the cacos died and the completion text came up... and I couldn't move, the imps let me feel the burn. :)

As for suggestions... speed shoes would rock. Being able to run really fast in those open levels would help the feel, if they aren't already there.

[Cyb]

yeah that's a bug you need to work on, you have to be extremly careful when and where you freeze the player as not everyone kills all monsters, so freezing the player when there is still stuff running around (or the possibility of it) is usually a bad thing. (this happened to me a couple times in LTSD as well) it's generally better to either freeze the player but surround him with totally impassible lines (to block incoming projectiles) and freeze or kill remaining monsters or let him move around as he wants but limit movement again with impassible lines. you could also switch on thing hate for all the monsters (type 6) so they totally ignore the player. if you make them hate a tid on that map that doesn't exist (I use 9999 usually) they just sit there like dummies.

I'll give you an example, when I played map01 the second time, I had just beaten the last cacodemon and I had maybe 15% health left and he fired a fireball and I killed him at the same time, so I got plugged with the fireball while I was frozen and couldn't exit :/

that aside tho it was pretty neat, and I think it has some potential. also, should you feel the need to speed up the player ;)

setactorproperty(0, APROP_Speed, getactorproperty(0, APROP_Speed) * 2); would double his speed hehe

[Vile]

Indeed, I could see more use for a speedup here than in the hexen series. I think I never used the shoes in hexen and only once in hexen 2 (during the fight with War, running from those axes!).

[Ralphis]

http://srb2.org

[Epyo]

Bonus levels (hubbed to normal levels), and uh, monster block lines.

[The Ultimate DooMer]

Cyb said:

setactorproperty(0, APROP_Speed, getactorproperty(0, APROP_Speed) * 2); would double his speed hehe

Sounds about right, except I can't speed the music up (nevermind). One problem though - I thought there was a bug in v47 that prevented APROP_Speed from working properly.

Ralphis said:

http://srb2.org

One reason why it's more DooM than Sonic.

Epyo said:

Bonus levels (hubbed to normal levels), and uh, monster block lines.

Bonus maps are planned, and they're pretty Sonic-like, too. And yes, I'll try and fix the monster control problems in the first 4 maps (the others will be not be hugely open like that).

[Cyb]

The Ultimate DooMer said:

Sounds about right, except I can't speed the music up (nevermind). One problem though - I thought there was a bug in v47 that prevented APROP_Speed from working properly.

well it works fine on the player, but if you try it on a monster or anything else then there's no change in their speed, at least for now, hopefully that'll be fixed

[The Ultimate DooMer]

So, from what I've heard so far, here's what I plan to add:

Jump sound (already done).

More Sonic sounds, particularly on S1/W1/G1/P1 doors.

A speed boot monitor, and some puzzles/secrets needing them.

More Sonic features (ie. springs, moving/collapsing/appearing then disappearing platforms) than I already have planned in the maps.

More puzzles/secrets based on aforementioned features.

Rings as health bonuses (if I can find the right screenies on the web).

More bonus stages (5 instead of 2, four of which will be Sonic-like).

And of course, bug fixes!

Are there any more suggestions?

(btw, is the speed value for APROP_Speed the same as the dehacked value?)

[Use]

Is there anyway to make the player drop health potions (rings) when he's hit? Like have a set number spawn from the players point when you take damage? Sounds complex but that'd be really coool. So far i really like the demo.

Personally I like the Doom feel and textures present in the game. Like you said, it's DOOM with Sonic features, not SONIC with DOOM features.

[toxicfluff]

Use3d: Yeah, you could do it with scripting. That would be awesome in the mod.

[Epyo]

ToXiCFLUFF said:

Use3d: Yeah, you could do it with scripting.

Really?

[toxicfluff]

Yeah, The flame effects in my Doomsplat mod work in a pretty similar way - they are spawned randomly around the enemy which is currently burning to death with a little random xyz momentum. If you just added gravity, you could make them fly out and bounce, ready to be collected again.

The above was done in legacy with FS, but I reckon ACS could do it just as easily although I know very little about ACS scripting.

[DOOM Anomaly]

ToXiCFLUFF said:

Yeah, The flame effects in my Doomsplat mod work in a pretty similar way - they are spawned randomly around the enemy which is currently burning to death with a little random xyz momentum. If you just added gravity, you could make them fly out and bounce, ready to be collected again.

The above was done in legacy with FS, but I reckon ACS could do it just as easily although I know very little about ACS scripting.

Yeah, its done in Sonic Robo Blast 2.

As for suggestions, perhaps some Sonic Sprites for the player cause playing it in multiplayer or with chase cam doesn't make it seem like its Sonic. :P
And it would be neat if the weapon sprites had a white glove (like Sonic's) holding the guns (if it shows the hand at all in the original sprite), though its nothing drastic it would be kinda neato.

Just some thoughts that sprung up. :D





Oh, and speaking of sprites, does anyone know where I can get some Tails and perhaps Knuckles Skins? (Or just any Sonic Characters at all) (I already have a Sonic one, though links to some more would be loved). Just wondering. Thanks. :D

[Grimm]

Who plays with the Chase Cam? :P

[Cyb]

The Ultimate DooMer said:

(btw, is the speed value for APROP_Speed the same as the dehacked value?)

I believe so, but I'm not sure. If you need to know the player's current speed just do printbold(d:getactorproperty(0, APROP_Speed)); then go from there, but it's easier just to use that (without the printbold) to double, half, or whatever the player's speed by multiplying stuff to it (75% speed would mean * (3/4) etc etc)

[Rotting Corpse]

Tormentor667 said:

My tipps for you and your success:
- Try to get your hands on Sonic sprites
- Use Sonicish textures and NO(!) doom textures, it really looks shitty
- Make the terrains also look more like Sonic's maps (clear edges and textures)

Hay! I was going th say that.

[Little Faith]

Actually I disagree. If you wanted that kind of TC you should bug Ralphis to ressurrect Sonic Robo Blast.

I think the texturing really has it's merits. I especially loved that big forest level. Maybe you should retexture some of the buildings though. Those gray ones really remind me too much of LTSD.

My main gripe is that it plays rather un-Sonic'y at times. Sonic is about the exhilaration of speed. These ones plays rather slowly.


I do agree that the health and armor bonuses should be changed to rings.

[Sphagne]

Good wad, new ideas, fresh look and feel, good job man!

[Captain Red]

I have a question:

Sonic + Doom... Why?

It's not a criticism, I'm just interested to know why you decided that it would be a good combination?

[Epyo]

ToXiCFLUFF said:

Yeah, The flame effects in my Doomsplat mod work in a pretty similar way - they are spawned randomly around the enemy which is currently burning to death with a little random xyz momentum. If you just added gravity, you could make them fly out and bounce, ready to be collected again.

The above was done in legacy with FS, but I reckon ACS could do it just as easily although I know very little about ACS scripting.

But...I don't think it's possible to start a script like that whenever the player gets hit...

[Ichor]

No, but the blood splatter could be made into rings you can pick up.

[Epyo]

Wow sweet. Heh, that's cool.

[Cyb]

well you could have an enter script that constantly monitors the player's health, and whenever it drops spawn rings at the players's location, though I believe if you fire health bonuses from the player he'll collect them the second he gets shot and totally negate any damage... if there was a way to get the player's current position (map coords and whatnot) then you could spawn them around his general area, but I'm not sure if there's currently a way to get the player's current x/y/z coords

[The Ultimate DooMer]

Ct_red_pants said:

Sonic + Doom... Why?

Because I liked the idea of using the zone/act/boss format in DooM (that's all it was meant to be when I first thought it up). And once I thought of the Sonic stuff I could create with ZDoom, it became even better. It's also different, it's never been done in this way before (AFAIK) and it keeps up my trend of coming up with innovative ideas/concepts. And I decided it would be great to jump on springs, monitors, fight bosses, stay on moving platforms etc. in FPS mode. Plus the one problem with Sonic was it was too easy, so combining it's features with some rock hard DooM gameplay is a cool idea IMO. (and I've got a whole load of new monsters to make it rock hard)

PS: the new speed monitor rules!