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Amaster

Programming Advice

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Ok, here's the deal.
I've been trying to teach myself C++ for some time now. I keep getting frustrated, quiting, then picking it back up again. And I'm just about to quit again. For some reason, this language just makes me really uncomfortable. So I'd like some suggestions on another language.

Im kind of an amatuer 3D (and 2D) artist, so my goal is to be able to make things like 3D screensavers, desktop toys, winamp plugins, etc. Im already very familiar with Javascript and actionscript (for what it's worth), so I would prefer something with a C based syntax.

So, sock it to me.

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Assmaster said:

Ok, here's the deal.
I've been trying to teach myself C++ for some time now. I keep getting frustrated, quiting, then picking it back up again. And I'm just about to quit again. For some reason, this language just makes me really uncomfortable. So I'd like some suggestions on another language.

Im kind of an amatuer 3D (and 2D) artist, so my goal is to be able to make things like 3D screensavers, desktop toys, winamp plugins, etc. Im already very familiar with Javascript and actionscript (for what it's worth), so I would prefer something with a C based syntax.

So, sock it to me.


/me Socks you in the face... happy now?

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Go to school. Then you won't be able to quit or it's your ass/money.

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Im already 15 thousand dollars in debt for my current college. I dont need more.

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Assmaster said:

Im already 15 thousand dollars in debt for my current college. I dont need more.


Jesus, you better learn some programming quick then or they'll come for your thumbs. I'm also teaching myself, have been for the past ..er 4 years or so. I still suck, But I'll be going to school too when I get a better job.

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Assmaster said:

Im kind of an amatuer 3D (and 2D) artist, so my goal is to be able to make things like 3D screensavers, desktop toys, winamp plugins, etc. Im already very familiar with Javascript and actionscript (for what it's worth), so I would prefer something with a C based syntax.

Bleh. Programming is not knowing the syntax of a language. If you know how to program, you should be able to pick up any language easilly enough. If you want a nice easy language, Visual Basic can use DirectX so give that a try. If you really are that worried about the syntax of the language, go learn C#.

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GooberMan said:

Bleh. Programming is not knowing the syntax of a language. If you know how to program, you should be able to pick up any language easilly enough. If you want a nice easy language, Visual Basic can use DirectX so give that a try. If you really are that worried about the syntax of the language, go learn C#.


or if you're not terribly worried about speed, learn java and use java2d/java3d to fill it out with good graphics.

/me cranks "burly brawl" and makes dumb comments on the forums some more

...oh yeah.
postcount--;

*

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Yeah, I've been looking into java as the answer. I still plan on continuing with C++ though. I think I just need to take it slower instead of trying to go from "Hello World" to Unreal Tournament in a week. :P

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Hi assmaster, delphi I found the easiest, it's in fact comparable with visual basic.
But while visbas does hide alot of code for you ( all it's prefab things, lists, windows, buttons, whatever...) delphi doesn't. Which is what I prefer. Well, don't use visbas anymore, so I'm talking about version 6. Both are easy to learn.
One of the tricks is to code programs who actually have a use and that's easy to obtain with visual basic/delphi. You can built your own mail client, browser and so with the built in objects. Of course If you like me prefer c++ for some reason, I can send you visual c++ (version 6) in 12 lessons. Got the c++ in 21 days too, btw.
You can also check http://www.libsdl.org/index.php
for game programming or
http://www.scorpioncity.com/djdirectxtut.html#int

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Dude. Learn C and OpenGL. Unlike Direct3D, it's easy to learn and doesn't require a 200 MB SDK download. Check out these sites for tutorials and you're all set :

http://www.gametutorials.com/ - This also has tutorials on C, Win32, Direct3D and tons of other things. Basically each tutorial is heavily commented source code. Very good resource.

http://nehe.gamedev.net/ - Basically the same as gametutorials, friendlier but oriented entirely towards OpenGL. Great place to start.

It really doesn't require much C knowledge to write a decent OpenGL program. And if you're stuck you can always contact me on AIM : my nick is DasFlatHead. I'm still a beginner though I think I could help you out if you need.

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fraggle said:

Learn Python.


learn befunge and/or brainfuck, along with unlambda.

then go take a nap and forget them again.

*

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SmellyOgre said:

Hmmmm..... Does anyone know which is more efficient and easier to learn, c++ or visual basic?

C++ = more efficient, harder to learn.
VB = quite a bit less efficient, easier to learn.

Learn C++ though if you're trying to decide between the two, you can do things in C/C++ quite easilly that you'd need to fuck around quite a bit in VB to get happening.

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Lord FlatHead said:

Dude. Learn C and OpenGL. Unlike Direct3D, it's easy to learn and doesn't require a 200 MB SDK download.

I found Direct3D pretty easy... some things are easier in Direct3D than OpenGL (like setting up the device for example).

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GooberMan said:

some things are easier in Direct3D than OpenGL (like setting up the device for example).

Well you only have to do that once.

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KDarigal said:

learn befunge and/or brainfuck, along with unlambda.

then go take a nap and forget them again.

*


have you even heard of python before? it's a fantastic language for beginners.

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mewse said:

have you even heard of python before? it's a fantastic language for beginners.


yes, i've heard of python. i find it irritating.

anyway, have you even heard of sarcasm before? it's a fantastic tool for the forums. (in other words, i know the languages i mentioned aren't something you would use under any circumstances. durrrr...)

*

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KDarigal said:

yes, i've heard of python. i find it irritating.

anyway, have you even heard of sarcasm before? it's a fantastic tool for the forums. (in other words, i know the languages i mentioned aren't something you would use under any circumstances. durrrr...)

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your sarcasm wasn't exactly subtle with your "then take a nap and forget them". i didn't miss it. python isn't a joke language like the others you mentioned. it's sad you find it irritating.

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I dunno about d3d, but directx is supposed to be a fair bit of a whore to use at times, and d3d is within dx so...

not to mention the whole portability thing, but that's hardly an issue

while you're at it, I'd also recommend learning a logic programming language such as lisp or scheme. while they aren't very practicle for regular use, they seriously help you broaden your horizons and you actually become better at functional languages because of them. I learned scheme last semester at uni and while it pissed me off a great deal (the syntax is awful), it was fairly straightforward (everything is a list...) and actually fun to use at times, and I think I'm that much better at C and C++ which I prfer to program in

also while we're on the subject of C++, it's a positivly HUGE language, like, there is so much to it (objects, classes, templates, virtual stuff, operator overloading, a million kinds of scope, inherited whoswhatsits etc etc) that I doubt you could learn it all unless you gave yourself years and years to learn it and even then I'm sure there's some weird hidden thing that nobody uses, so in other words I wouldn't get too frustraded right off, just try and learn the basics and take it from there, I quite like C++ actually because it allows you the lower level control C has (without being too low level) but you can also do a lot of high-level stuff, though another issue of course is that while many non-C hlls will not let you screw with stuff that could potentially be harmful, C/++ doesn't care what you do as long as it's syntacticaly correct, so feel free to deref null if you want (actually I dunno if other hll's even let you deal with pointers as directly as C does), but don't expect any good to come from it :)

and now I've rambled on about crap, well that's just great, someone smack me

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Cyb said:

while you're at it, I'd also recommend learning a logic programming language such as lisp or scheme.

Those arent logic programming languages.

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Lord FlatHead said:

http://nehe.gamedev.net/ - Basically the same as gametutorials, friendlier but oriented entirely towards OpenGL. Great place to start.

I second that. It's a very good site with lots of tutorials for beginners and experts.

Creating devices and all that stuff is pretty hard in OpenGL. However, an easy way around it is to just download a tutorial from that site and expand from there. Adding more OpenGL commands to the code is relatively easy.

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A basic D3D render loop looks something like:

* Begin scene
* Set view and projection matrix
* Set lighting
* For each object you want to render
- Set local to world matrix
- Set a texture and all associated flags
- Set vertex (and optionally index) buffers
- Render buffer
* End scene

From my experimentation with OpenGL, the render loop looks approximately the same but there is more work involved in getting the scene up and running - the side effect of having more direct control over your data.

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mewse said:

your sarcasm wasn't exactly subtle with your "then take a nap and forget them". i didn't miss it. python isn't a joke language like the others you mentioned. it's sad you find it irritating.


i never said that he should forget python, just the joke languages.

though personally i'm surprised that, with the suggestion of python, nobody followed it by suggesting ruby (which i'm also not a big fan of - but i'm one of those people who doesn't particularly like interpreted languages in general. if there's a python compiler out there, i'll consider learning it, but right now i'll stick to basic and logo being the two interpreted languages i know.)

so excuse me for not being extremely specific in what i'm referring to.

yeesh.

*

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fraggle said:

Those arent logic programming languages.


er, sorry I meant uh expression oriented or whatever the proper name for those sorts of languages is... but my point still stands etc

aye and ruby is quite nice, I really ought to take some time a learn it rather than just reading over docs and features from time to time

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well, if you want something easier go for Pascal, C, Qbasic just to get you started then you can move on, i am only good at web programming which i see better, if you want that then use ASP, PHP, Java, Javascript, ASP.NET, but surely you know HTML,

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Want a tip? Strengthen your programming notions with functional languages. Haskell, for instance, is weird at first but you get the hang of it. After learning Haskell, I understood several aspects of general programming that I wasn't even aware of. And it's reasonably powerful in its non-academicish variants.

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