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Opulent

LOH2 released. Damn right, that's cool. [-complevel 9]

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That was a *very* solid set of maps! Very fun to play.. you get tons of ammo, so you never run out.. plus the maps are quite easy on UV so guys like myself stand a chance. ;-)

Excellent tip! Thanks, Op!

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I just played through it. Pretty darn good, with enough enemies to kill. The last level was a little gimmicky and got boring pretty quick though. Other than that great stuff :P

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I'm slowly looking at the maps. I've got so many demo-sets running right now, it's absurd.
getting off my ass and actually recording something would be a good start.
You can count on demos from this... _when_ is a the question.

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Volte! that was darn good! played back fine with boom2.02, btw.
I did Map02, couldn't seem to drive under :57. (had a early :55 with an unlucky 98%kills, that kept my playing)
http://www.doomworld.com/sda/dwdemo/l22_057.zip
boom2.02 as well.
oh, note that the first 7 maps were released as loh.wad; I don't know if they have been modified since.

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Opulent said:

oh, note that the first 7 maps were released as loh.wad; I don't know if they have been modified since.

From the text-file:

The original maps all received a facelift with new areas, increased detail and lighting, more monsters, etc.

I noticed some changes; there are now keys in map07, for instance, though this doesn't make any real difference. The cyber crusher in map06 is triggered differently too. Nothing turned upside down though, as far as I could tell.

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yeah, I'm a moron, map01 is obviously different.
I wanted to make sure Volteface knew that the maps weren't completely new.
Grazza, you should try one... that is, if you have time. :)

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Yeah, it would make sense to watch the old demos before recording on the new versions, as a lot of the ideas should be transferable.

I don't really have time, but if a few minutes present themselves I might give map06 a bash. :)

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OK, I found (literally) a few minutes. A bit sucky, but here it is:
LOH2 Map06 (Painkiller) UV Max in 2:23

Only plays back with Eternity (tested with 3.31 beta 5). This is probably due to some bug in Eternity - it desyncs the same way in Doom2.exe and Prboom. In Eternity a barrel fails to explode when it really should have done.

Oh, and contrary to what I say in the text-file, you don't need loh2.bex (makes no difference either way).

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Yeah, I knew that many of the levels were similar (though I haven't played all 7 maps of LOH1, so I will have to before proceeding) though MAP01 at least is vastly different (more secrets and architecture). Thanks for the comment Opulent. :)

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A contribution from me, two optimal(?) runs:

Map 1 UV speed/pacifist in 0:05
Map 1 NM speed in 0:05

WARNING! Don't try this at home, kids! ;-)
(Takes a lot of work to get 0:05, especially on NM)

Recorded using (what else?) ZDooM 1.22.

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I got :57, but for some reason one of the secrets didn't count, and I didn't get 100% on the tally screen. I know I did get them all though. :-\ That's the only one I got under 1:00 though. All the others are 1:04, 1:05.

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You will find that there are almost no major architectural changes as far as moving doors around, deleting rooms, etc. There were a few shortcuts in the original maps where you could bypass certain traps or hallways, especially by jumping. I "fixed" those which should make speedrunning a little bit slower.

MAP01: I added a few extra areas, but nothing that adds extra time (well, except for 100% runs). You might have to strafe around a tree or two in the outdoor area.

MAP02: More monsters. Pure speedruns should be just as fast but 100% runs will be a bit slower.

MAP03: More hoops to jump through to get the blue key.

MAP04: All new level.

MAP05: Purely cosmetic changes.

MAP06: Mainly cosmetic changes, except the crusher is a little different. For 100% runs this may be easier due to the ledge blocking all monsters (such as the pesky lost souls).

MAP07: Cosmetic changes. You can still jump to get the last key.

The rest are all new.

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John Gaughan said:

MAP06: Mainly cosmetic changes, except the crusher is a little different. For 100% runs this may be easier due to the ledge blocking all monsters (such as the pesky lost souls).

I'm sure it is easier (or at least quicker) for Max than the first version, given that my quick knockabout run was just a second slower than Vroomer's demo. I thought the barrels and the nice infighting possibilities were major factors in that.

Edit: I had another go, trying to get it under 2 minutes, but only managed that in runs where I missed a monster. Here is my best Max:
LOH2 Map06 (Painkiller) UV Max in 2:01
Recorded with Prboom 2.02 - first time I've used that.

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Has anyone tried a cooperative UV run? Not necessarily with more than one player.

I added a ton of extra monsters in cooperative mode. It should be a bit more challenging to get 100% runs.

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http://www.planethalflife.com/uncrossable/personal/cyc/l208-355.zip

uvmax map08, 100 64 100 . 3:55. about my 8th exit and the first under 4 mins. took me several exits to work out how to get all the secrets, kept getting 75% and 50% somehow, heh.

working on map09, though i was desperatley trying to complete my first exit while being followed around for the last 3 minutes by a bloody ghost cacodemon and in the end just couldnt get out of it's way while cleaning up the last of the demons! fuck

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http://www.planethalflife.com/uncrossable/personal/cyc/l209-822.zip

map09 uvmax 101 96 100 8:22

there are, hopefully, only lost souls floating about at the end, i would have cleaned them up had i not had to resort to throwing rocks at the cyb!

this is the first time i've taken on a cyb and it's taken a few hours to figure the route out, though i could (alway) be better. i try to take out the archviles straight away and getting the cyb up the steps was, frankly, lucky as fuck as that's the first time that happened!


edit: notes to self

1. soulsphere "grab" how did i not miss that!?

2. blue key "grab" was a little close too

3. bfg + chaingunners, you need lots of health, this was where i died the most in my failed runs, i tried allsorts of different ways/times to clear this room

4. shotgun and chaingun pickups both interfere quite badly with the flow of things, if you watch my map08 carefully you'll see how i overcome/avoid this in that map

5. a box of rockets i had trouble collecting, too close to the wall?

6. in the mid part of the demo i slow down a little, just trying to get through in one piece

7. those fucking pain elementals... why!?!?

8. should've used those two last bfg shots on the cyb and the rockets on the minions, ho hum.

still probably my "best" demo yet in my opinion, due to the cyb and sheer amount of monsters!

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http://www.planethalflife.com/uncrossable/personal/cyc/l209-720.zip

map09 uvmax 100 95 100 7:20

that's 1:02 faster than my previous exit. i addressed most of my issues with the first demo though somehow missed the first soulshpere while launching past. heh. fortunatley it was handy later on!

edit: oh by the way my attempts on this map were severly hampered by two, yes two, mice failing completely. the first one just locked up and the computer refused to recognise it and in the end the second just wouldnt turn right (interesting demo, that one!). i'm now using a super chunky serial mouse off my linux box, heh. hope it can handle the heavy bashing :-)

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had a short while trying to figure out map10, except that i havent even managed to exit using savegames, the first two areas i can cope with (lots of circle strafing and cunning use of arachnotrons to block revenant missiles) but after that there are just too many barons to cope with, like 15 or something and there just isnt any room to manouver, i did manage, after a few attempts to launch myself past the hordes and make it to the plasma rifle, but that's pretty much where i'm stuck as even with that i dont have the ammo or space to deal with the constant tide of everything that's followed me there!

a speed run might be more feasible, mind.

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It's tight but it should be possible. When I played it back in January, I exited with just a few monsters alive (due to that last archie) and was sure that with a better strategy I could have killed them all.

I think the infights need to be organized quite well. IMO it makes sense after picking up the yellow key to run for your life, leaving the barons and knights to fight it out with the revenants. I don't recall many monsters following me when I made for the plasma gun - I presume I'd cleared up most of them.

Sorry that this isn't more helpful - it's more than two months since I played this map.

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yeah, i rearely seem to luck-in when it comes to infighting, when i leave an area they tend to just sit there waiting for me to come back despite my attempts to line them up and provoke them! also on that map the majority of the doors can be openened by monsters. i'll give it a go though, just need to figure it all out, heh

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Well, infights depend a lot on the monster types...
for example gunners, mancos and cybers are very good to create big and long infights.

But monsters like barons, revs, imps or cacos are not very good at that because they don't shoot in salves... so they hit their foe shot by shot... so they rarely hit something else unless it's really crowdy and somebody gets in the way. These kind of infights need luck especially if the player gets out of sight and go do some other part.

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