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Raziel

Best doom wad from before doom's source was released?

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What was the best doom wad in your opinion that was made/released before source ports were released? Sorry if there's threads already on this but I haven't been here since before 2004.

And also, if possible, provide a download link please.

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'prior to source released' is different than 'requires a source port'
if you are looking for doom(2).exe compatible wads, there are quite a few beautiful (and playable) wads released.
Mordeth, Alien Vendetta, Requiem, Dystopia, Class_ep, Nullspace, etc...

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The Ultimate DooMer said:

AV was made after the source release. (and isn't truly vanilla compatible anyway as some of the maps cause savegame crashes)

Who needs to record savegames? :P

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Eternal Doom, imho. It's much on the limits, and still plays very well. It uses many clever tricks and even provides the illusion of 6 independet keys. You really should plan in a lot of time playing through it due to its size.

The vanilla savegame buffer doesn't really count. It's more like a bug, because it's just far too small, and there are a lot of wads which make saving impossible not even intentionally. When I first played Eternal Doom, I had Boom already installed. Not knowing the maps, it really can take many hours to find through it. Even the 100% demos are HUGE. It would be a pain, not able to save the game, even if this would be just once per day or so.

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DEMOn said:

Who needs to record savegames? :P


People who don't record demos. (and believe it or not, people like that do exist - and I'm not one of them before you ask)

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If you're saying that the inability to use savegames makes a wad not Doom2.exe compatible, then Doom2.wad fails (due to map30). So do Hell Revealed and quite a lot of other wads from the pre-port era (as LogicDeLuxe also indicates). Besides, due to the sleeping monsters issue, saving was rather a broken feature in the original game anyway.

According to this, what was "technically the first source port" was released on December 23, 1997.

My answer to the question is Hell Revealed (other notables: STRAIN, Requiem, Icarus, MM, MM2, etc.).

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Grazza said:

Besides, due to the sleeping monsters issue, saving was rather a broken feature in the original game anyway.



That may be but I still can't play 30 levels without taking a break so I need savegame functionality!

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I think the topic could be reformulated in :

what are the best vanilla wads ?

(doom2.exe compatible except the savegame buffer and HOMs)

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I wasn't being very serious. I note the need for savegames, especially with wads like AV.
I suspect that many of the pre-source pwads also broke savegame support too; that's all. :)

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VinceDSS said:

I think the topic could be reformulated in :

what are the best vanilla wads ?

(doom2.exe compatible except the savegame buffer and HOMs)


But maybe he is asking for wads that were made before the source was released?

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DEMOn said:

I suspect that many of the pre-source pwads also broke savegame support too; that's all. :)



Of course there were some. The oldest I know of is castevil which was released in 1994. The first time I played through it was in mid-1998 (with Boom), though because without being able to save the level was nearly impossible to explore.

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Hey that Eternal DOOM how do you get it to run right? (I use Doomsday) I can play the first level but when it loads level 2 I'm back to the desktop. No errors its like if I closed it. Is there more I need to do? (I only loaded the wads from the zip file I saw no .deh files)

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UltraMarioMan: You really only need to load ETERNALL.WAD, the rest of them are not needed. And if Doomsday is crashing on Map 2, then there's a console setting you need to change - I can't remember what it is, but it is supposed to turn off the ability to use textures as light sources. Since Map 2 uses so many of one texture (and that texture is classified as a light source), your system is overloaded trying to calculate lights for all of them.

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UltraMarioMan:
I didn't try it in Doomsday, but it's mentioned in Risen3D's map notes, so it should be supported there and you might try it.
For playing in other ports (I made it through it in Boom) make sure to use the compatibility options, especially you will need the original stairbuilder method. Should be no problem in PrBoom and Eternity as well, though I didn't try it with OpenGL renderers.
TeamTNT didn't seem to like Dehacked, so there is no DEH with it. You could easily make you own if you are annoyed by the Doom2 map names in the automap.

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If you want purely technically impressive stuff from before the source release, its kind of hard to top Requiem MAP31.

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Well I just discovered two things. First it appears the guy I bought DOOM 2 from on Ebay sold me the German version in an English jewel case. (Eternity told me in was the German version no wolf levels) Is there a way to I dunno patch it?Second it appears the start level in Eternal DOOM is messed up in Doomsday. In Eternity you start like in a ship I think. In Doomsday you start outdoors with a bunch of pillers you lower some of which hide Cyberdemons. Odd...

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UltraMarioMan said:

Well I just discovered two things. First it appears the guy I bought DOOM 2 from on Ebay sold me the German version in an English jewel case. (Eternity told me in was the German version no wolf levels) Is there a way to I dunno patch it?Second it appears the start level in Eternal DOOM is messed up in Doomsday. In Eternity you start like in a ship I think. In Doomsday you start outdoors with a bunch of pillers you lower some of which hide Cyberdemons. Odd...


1. There is a patch for the German version somewhere in the archives. I don't know its full name, though.

2. The Cyberdemon level is a bonus level called Cybersweeper. Remove CSweeper.wad and Credits.wad from the list of loaded WADs and it should work.

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And note that if you want to play Cybersweeper, then you need to run RANCY.EXE each time to randomize the level. Otherwise it gets boring rather quickly. :)

The German upgrade patch is here.

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Heh, Cybersweeper was genius.

Fraggle, cheers for reminding me where that Quake map came from.

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Where that Quake map came from?!

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The Doom Quake map, called Return to Quake or something like that. I hadnt seen it since 1996. It boggled my eyes what they managed to do with it back then :)

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Hah, I see, I had read it like "where the map in Quake had come from."

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Quake 1 is my favorite quake game.

Quake 2 i didn't like the military base/mine settings and quake 3, well I just like UT more.

But yeah, I mean maps that use the vanilla engine.

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Before the source release some people made aimbots for DM cheating.
And Uwe Girlich produced some TAS-like demos (with slo mo and connections).

That means these people were able to decompile the DOS exes....
Would it be possible to do that to remove the savegame buffer limit, the VPO, the HOM and the maxdemo limit ?

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VinceDSS said:

That means these people were able to decompile the DOS exes....
Would it be possible to do that to remove the savegame buffer limit, the VPO, the HOM and the maxdemo limit ?


No. These are statically allocated buffers which cannot be resized by binary patches. For that you have to recompile the source.

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