Boom/MBF questions

[gemini09]

1. Do they allow for whichever colors you want, for example purple?

2. Any simple scripting at all?

3. I want to have some sounds play during a map, for example a wolf houling, but I want to control it, and I don't want it to loop (as if, I replaced the door-open sound with a wolf sound, and when crossing an invisible line you'd hear it........)

4. Animated sky? For example a sky with occasional lightning?

5. What kind of graphics do you need for a sky box in ZDoom?

And can ZDoom do all these things? I'd rather use Boom but I need some of these effects too...

I am still looking for someone to compile a graphics wad, so send me an e-mail.

[Graf Zahl]

gemini09 said:

1. Do they allow for whichever colors you want, for example purple?

2. Any simple scripting at all?

3. I want to have some sounds play during a map, for example a wolf houling, but I want to control it, and I don't want it to loop (as if, I replaced the door-open sound with a wolf sound, and when crossing an invisible line you'd hear it........)

4. Animated sky? For example a sky with occasional lightning?

5. What kind of graphics do you need for a sky box in ZDoom?

And can ZDoom do all these things? I'd rather use Boom but I need some of these effects too...

I am still looking for someone to compile a graphics wad, so send me an e-mail.

1. colors for what? Please be a little more specific.
2. only the voodoo-doll-on-a-converyor-style.
3. Some hack with Dehacked might accomplish that - but it isn't easy.
4. no
5. A skybox in ZDoom is just an alternative viewpoint in the level that is drawn everywhere there is sky. It doesn't require anything specific. A ZDoom skybox is not the same as a Quake2/Vavoom skybox.
6. ZDoom can easily do anything you want (except that I don't know what you want to do with the colors.)

[Nmn]

A bit extension:
1.Colors-depends on where You use them. Graphics? Without a new pallette, no. Coloured Sectors? Unless it's opengl (Glboom, Zdoomgl, etc.), no.
2.The trick is to place a fakeplayer (voodoo doll) on a scrolling floor outside a map. Once a line in the map is triggered the conveyor belt scrolls the doll as he activates next lines specific things happen, i.e. some doors open, others close, also You the bigger distance between the lines the bigger delay in activating them. Simple.
3.Dehacked I suppose, only. It's not that hard. You can make things that are just making "idle sounds" like change a demon into an invisible thing that does nothing, only stands there and makes it sound. You can make a wolf houling, once. Simply, hack the ambient sound thing that once it sees You, makes it see sound (and does nothing more) which is the wolf houling.
4.not really
5.It's more like an Unreal type skybox, however, you can achieve a Q2/Vavoom skybox by texturing a large cube with the specific skybox textures. You need either some foregroun (mountains, cityscape) and a flat of clouds that will scroll on the ceiling of the skybox, or, 6 images of an environment map. (top, front, back, left, righ, bottom)
6.Zdoom can do ALL above-including animated skies, with the exception, that it is limited for specific colours from the pallette (i.e. no purple)

[Kaiser]

Graf Zahl said:

4. no

actually, depending on certain boom ports, you can implent animated skies.

MBF, and Prboom supports the linedef 271-272 types which transfers a wall texture to a sky. Simply tag the sector to contain the custom sky. This will work on any texture, including animated textures.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think Eternity supports these line types as well.

[chilvence]

Just out of curiousity, does Zdoom keep up with boom updates?

[boris]

chilvence said:

Just out of curiousity, does Zdoom keep up with boom updates?

There are updates to Boom?

[chilvence]

I thought there was a new version of prboom in the works?

[boris]

chilvence said:

I thought there was a new version of prboom in the works?

Is prboom actually adding new editing functionality?

[Grazza]

You may wish to take a look at how certain sound effects are implemented in Asylum of the Wretched (also Aliens TC), and also at the "spaceship taking off" graphics in map01 of Hell2Pay.

Chilvence: Prboom and Zdoom have developed in different directions. When one refers to Boom features, it is generally taken the mean the features supported by Boom 2.02.

[Nmn]

Deathman said:

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think Eternity supports these line types as well.

I remember that Caverns of Darkness had an animated scrolling sky (it was simple ROCKRED, animated, as the sky) Yeah, COD had it's own exe, but I tested this with Zdoom and it works. Hmmm.. COD exe is based on Eternity and MBF iirc

[boris]

Yes, it works in Eternity (I tried it).

[Graf Zahl]

Deathman said:

actually, depending on certain boom ports, you can implent animated skies.

MBF, and Prboom supports the linedef 271-272 types which transfers a wall texture to a sky. Simply tag the sector to contain the custom sky. This will work on any texture, including animated textures.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think Eternity supports these line types as well.

The 'no' referred to the lightning. You can't do that with 271/272.

[NiGHTMARE]

Unless you make an animated texture where some frames use a brightened version of the texture used in other frames.

[Bloodshedder]

Nmn said:

Coloured Sectors? Unless it's opengl (Glboom, Zdoomgl, etc.), no.

Uh what? Colored sectors are very possible in software-rendered ports.

[chilvence]

Grazza said:
Chilvence: Prboom and Zdoom have developed in different directions. When one refers to Boom features, it is generally taken the mean the features supported by Boom 2.02. [/B]

Ah, well, I don't know. I dont even have a copy of either, I was just curious :)

[gemini09]

The purple colors, I want to use in wall textures. I'm surprised Boom can't have purple, how about ZDoom?

Thanks for your input fellas.

[Kaiser]

if you want purple, you'll have to modify Doom's colormap and playpal lumps.

[gemini09]

I was looking through Eternal's graphics earlier today, and there actually is some purple there. On one of those wall flag banners. Those 3-4 types of purple should do...

[Nmn]

True.
Actually, Doom's pallette has 4 shades of Purple, which are used only for Commander Keen's sprite. Mind that sprite is fullbright, so Purple fading to dark is horrible (ID needed purple just for Keen, so they didn't care how will this color fade to dark if used for example, on wall textures), just take away few steps to see that it fades to grey on those banners (Colormap lump is responsible for colours fading darker so the depth darkness effect is achieved) So all in all purple is a colour that doesn't really cope with the pallette. You would have to modify the pallette, or create a new one (though that means that You can't use Doom Resources in Your project, because they will look shitty). Both Zdoom and Boom, on software, make fading of the purple colour ugly. Opengl doesn't need the colormap lump, so fading is generally ok. Yet, because of only 4 shades of purple it can't be used so much in textures. If 4 shades of blue is enough for You, then sure, use them.
EDIT:

Bloodshedder said:

Uh what? Colored sectors are very possible in software-rendered ports.

I know! But just try to make a cyan coloured light in a sector to see what I mean. They look horrible, so there's no real point in using them (unless You want it to look bad)

[Quasar]

I've said it before and I'll say it again -- the common response of "zdoom does this, zdoom does that" when someone is asking if BOOM can or cannot do something is just a bit annoying to me. Maybe I'm biased, but I think designing for a greater number of ports sometimes is a good thing.

[Graf Zahl]

Quasar said:

Maybe I'm biased, but I think designing for a greater number of ports sometimes is a good thing.

I disagree. I'd rather see maps that actually use the features of the different ports. Going for the largest possible amounts of ports to work on normally results in lowest-common-denominator WADs which can often be unsatisfying.

Speficically as in this place where there was asked for specific features and it was specifically asked whether ZDoom can do it all.

[Quasar]

Graf Zahl said:

I disagree. I'd rather see maps that actually use the features of the different ports. Going for the largest possible amounts of ports to work on normally results in lowest-common-denominator WADs which can often be unsatisfying.

I like seeing wads for different ports, sure, but not the kind that would otherwise run on Vanilla DOOM, but cannot because they contain 2 particle fountains, a door that opens slightly faster than a normal door, and a script that says "WELCOME TO MY DUNGEON!" when the level starts. That's a waste and it goes on way too much IMO.

Graf Zahl said:

Speficically as in this place where there was asked for specific features and it was specifically asked whether ZDoom can do it all.

Crap, you're right. I didn't even see the part where he asked about zdoom, so I was wrong to make this comment in the first place, at least in response to this thread ;)

[Mordeth]

Nmn said:
Actually, Doom's pallette has 4 shades of Purple, which are used only for Commander Keen's sprite.

Cacodemon fireball.

[Graf Zahl]

Quasar said:

I like seeing wads for different ports, sure, but not the kind that would otherwise run on Vanilla DOOM, but cannot because they contain 2 particle fountains, a door that opens slightly faster than a normal door, and a script that says "WELCOME TO MY DUNGEON!" when the level starts. That's a waste and it goes on way too much IMO.

You are right about those but I haven't seen many projects of this kind. I can only remember a handfull of ZDoom-only projects that don't really use its features. In fact most of the needlessly limited projects I can think of are of the 'You need JDoom because it's too dark otherwise' kind.

[Grazza]

Or: "For my last wad I said you needed jDoom because it's too dark otherwise but you all ignored me - so goddamnit you're gonna have to play this one in jDoom because every sector causes 20% damage in any other port! LOL!".

I've also noticed some recently where there appear to be some minor map errors/issues that restrict the map unnecessarily to just a few ports, even though there is nothing truly port-specific in them.

That "WELCOME TO MY DUNGEON!" map sounds cool.