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Majnun

Co-op mod?

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Howdy Doom people.

I'm just curious if anyone is planning to make a co-op mod for Doom 3. Something along the lines of the sven-coop project for the original Half-Life (sorry for saying half-life I know it offends some folks :P).

Or if anybody even knows if it will even be possible. I think it should be fairly easy since the game has limited multiplayer code built in. To make it a balanced co-op the whole game would have to be tweaked to add enemies and maybe make some halls wider of course. But I hope someone trys, and makes a basic 2 person co-op mod using the existing game pretty quickly after the game comes out.

I plan on attempting to make some SP maps myself. But since this will be the first time I've ever tried modding/mapmaking, AT ALL, I'm pretty sure making the game co-op would be a little beyond my abilities.

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Saying Half-Life doesn't offend anybody ("We don't need other games to suck for ours to be good"). People have talked about a Coop mod for a long time now, but I don't think it'll be possible until a good time after the release, when the mod community has grown and possibly (wishful thinking) the source code gets released. But that's just IMO anyway.

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Co-op as in sven co-op - probably easy. Co-op as in 2 players going through SP - nigh impossible, I'm sure.

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Co-op won't exist mainly due to large scripted areas in the game that rely on there being only one player to trigger them, etc.

So yes it's probably be easily possible to make new co-op maps, but to be able to play through the SP game in co-op will be nigh impossible as said above.

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Hollenshead said in a recent interview that he would love to see a coop-mod being among the first community products.
Despite Hollenshead being only the CEO of id, I think this gives reason to hope, that it may be difficult, but not impossible.

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I guess it depends on just how advanced the editing goes though. Another thing: what is doom3 doing regarding editing? waiting for an SDK as usual, or is it different this time?

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We will have to see how the x-box handles the coop, i mean its not impossible, you either remove the cut-scenes or have the game simply pause when the cut-scene plays or include an extra character appearing in the cut-scene with you, that would be cool imo and probably not that difficult.

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As far as cutscenes go I'm thinkin that you have it like Halo co-op, the second character doesn't appear in the cutscenes.

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Majuub said:

As far as cutscenes go I'm thinkin that you have it like Halo co-op, the second character doesn't appear in the cutscenes.

Exactly, why not avoid it altogether? After a cutscene the second player spawns again. Shouldn't be too difficult, right?

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kalamari22 said:

Saying Half-Life doesn't offend anybody ("We don't need other games to suck for ours to be good"). People have talked about a Coop mod for a long time now, but I don't think it'll be possible until a good time after the release, when the mod community has grown and possibly (wishful thinking) the source code gets released. But that's just IMO anyway.


Heh - yeah, but I'm sure we won't see the source code released for at least five years. :D

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I think he meant the SDK, not the source code. :)

They just released the Duke 3d source code last year, heh. So yeah, it'll be a long while. That's how they'll make the big bucks...licensing the Doom3 engine to other developers. So there's no way we'll get the source code for a long long time.

But a coop mod is probably doable with just the built-in editor, if someone had the motivation. Definitely doable with an SDK.

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I still really don't understand the whole scripting issue being used as an excuse for why DOOM 3 doesn't have co-op on the PC. It's a non-sequitur as far as I am concerned and just sounds like an excuse to me.

If anything, the ability to script the map stuff rather than having it hard-coded ought to make it EASIER to put in co-op handling, not harder. If scripting were such a major obstacle to co-op, then how could any of the modern recent FPS game engines have co-op? Virtually all of them have scripting engines.

So with that in mind, I really doubt co-op on the DOOM 3 engine will be a difficult thing to achieve.

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I don't see how most of the scripted sequences could be much of an issue either. Just make them trigger ONCE when the first player arrives at the trigger spot (or does whatever triggers it). If the other player isn't there to see it (the fiend coming out of the ceiling, breaking thru the door, bursting thru the wall, whatever), then too bad. The only scripted sequences that would be a problem are the ones that trigger a "point of no return" kind of thing. Like if the corridor behind you collapses and you can never go back that way again. If one player is BEHIND the collapse when it triggers that would um, not be good.

One thing that might be an issue is the cut-scenes. As in little movies where you're not in control. But I kinda hope there aren't too many of those anyway since I like to PLAY a game and not just watch it like it's final fantasy or something. No clue how many cut-scenes there are in Doom 3, but I doubt there's very many. Probably at the beginning and when you go to Hell. If they're a problem for coop you could just do away with them entirely.

The size of some corridors/rooms (and numbers of enemies) will probably be an issue too. Who wants to be the guy in the rear while you're both crawling through ventilation shafts? Even something like that could be fun though if it were designed for coop (have demons come into the shaft from behind and in front). You'd need to add more demons to make it a challenge for 2 people, and then need to resize most areas to account for that.

I think there'll be quite a bit of work to make the SP game work well with coop, but not as hard as some folks seem to think it will be.

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AirRaid said:

Co-op won't exist mainly due to large scripted areas in the game that rely on there being only one player to trigger them, etc.

So yes it's probably be easily possible to make new co-op maps, but to be able to play through the SP game in co-op will be nigh impossible as said above.


Then how does the Xbox version do it? I mean Halo did it and all you did was have one player trigger an event and the cut scenes are one player. Not that hard.

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I've just saved myself a heap of cash by finding out that Doom3 will not be supporting Coop.
ID paved the way by adding coop to Doom and Doom2, why kick us coop players in the face by not implementing it in Doom3. Coz everyone will buy it anyway, so why bother to put the extra effort in to include it?
I can wait - by the time a coop mod is available the game will be cheaper in the stores...

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Huntley said:

I've just saved myself a heap of cash by finding out that Doom3 will not be supporting Coop.
ID paved the way by adding coop to Doom and Doom2, why kick us coop players in the face by not implementing it in Doom3. Coz everyone will buy it anyway, so why bother to put the extra effort in to include it?
I can wait - by the time a coop mod is available the game will be cheaper in the stores...

The XBox version does have co-op, in case you missed that, unless you're just talking about the PC version. The PC version probably doesn't have co-op because M$ paid them to only have it on the XBox, or something like that, because if they can do it for XBox, they could have done it for PC.

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The co-op's Xbox only because VV coded it and id didn't. Simple enough, ey?

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Trasher][ said:
The co-op's Xbox only because VV coded it and id didn't. Simple enough, ey?

Ah, makes sense. I never even knew that little detail :p

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Huntley said:

I've just saved myself a heap of cash by finding out that Doom3 will not be supporting Coop.
ID paved the way by adding coop to Doom and Doom2, why kick us coop players in the face by not implementing it in Doom3. Coz everyone will buy it anyway, so why bother to put the extra effort in to include it?
I can wait - by the time a coop mod is available the game will be cheaper in the stores...


yep, I won't buy it either until it gets coop... we might wait a year tho.

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WARNING SPOILERS (Found this its a co-op mod in the works) You have been warned it shows a boss fight in the first video.

http://www.harvsnews.com/doom3mods/

EDIT- If you don't want to watch the first video because of the spoilers it shows that he had to kill his co-op friend to get the cutscene to work. Hopefully if they release the mod they can find some way to get around that.

The second video has very little spoilers if any at all.

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It'd be fairly easy to script teleporters in for players who are behind a point of no return situation anyway. I agree with Quasar on this one.

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Quasar said:

So with that in mind, I really doubt co-op on the DOOM 3 engine will be a difficult thing to achieve.


sweet man, you lighten up my life :)

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Just found the co-op mod, irc.efnet.net, #doom3mods. The guys who are working on it are there, and you should be able to get a buggy alpha of the mod if you ask for it.

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Huntley said:

I've just saved myself a heap of cash by finding out that Doom3 will not be supporting Coop.
ID paved the way by adding coop to Doom and Doom2, why kick us coop players in the face by not implementing it in Doom3. Coz everyone will buy it anyway, so why bother to put the extra effort in to include it?
I can wait - by the time a coop mod is available the game will be cheaper in the stores...


Heh, i wonder if they're going to change his title like they did with the guy that said he wouldnt buy doom 3 until they made the monsters die different.

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Combustable said:

Heh, i wonder if they're going to change his title like they did with the guy that said he wouldnt buy doom 3 until they made the monsters die different.


Monsters dying different? Now THAT really is dumb !!

But Coop would be sweet, and keep the game alive long after everyone is tired of the SP. A long time off, sure, but it will happen.

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