QuipFrok Posted August 21, 2004 Man what an editor this could be! For me though it has a few problems. Textures...I can place them in the 3D mode but they don't appear in the game. Some do and some don't. Can't tell which or why. Things...place a supershotgun but in the game it's not there. Configuration needs lots of sprucing. For instance...How am I to know that I need to put zdoom in my heretic folder if I want to build and run a heretic map and not have the doomguy's gun and hand in the map? I have spent an hour or so fooling with all the configs and I can't run any map unless I choose zdoom. jdoom? Forget it. The fellow that does this program should spend a lot of time on the configuartion issues AND have a quality FAQ not one that looks like it was a bother. What good is Freeware when there are so many issues? Don't think I don't appreciate the editor..I do. It just needs lotsa work. I think there are alot of system specific incompatiblitys as well. I'd like to hear from you guys on what I wrote. I have an open mind and if I'm missing something or lotsa somethings I'd like to know Quip Frok 0 Share this post Link to post
Sporku Posted August 21, 2004 Heh, Doom Builder is one of the least buggy editors out there. Uhm.. I don't know what to tell you about your texture/things problems besides: Are you playing your map in Doom 2 or Doom 1? Doom 1 doesn't have a supershotgun, so that wouldn't appear if you placed one in there. Same thing goes for textures. Also, make sure you set your Files up right in options. For example: Doom: Doom.wad Doom 2: Doom2.wad Heretic: Heretic.wad Legacy: Doom2.wad ZDoom (Doom in Hexen Format): Doom2.wad Etc.. 0 Share this post Link to post
MasterOFDeath Posted August 21, 2004 I hate doom builder, it drives me insane. sbsoftware.com DeePsea is good, but its shareware... 0 Share this post Link to post
Chris Hansen Posted August 21, 2004 QuipFrok said:What good is Freeware when there are so many issues? I think that comment is way off! If it's freeware you can expect certain difficulties and because it is freeware you're not entitled to expect the author to support every minor issue. And some of the things you mention can't be DB's problem. Like the one with the SS... I never experienced something like that! I'm betting you're misunderstanding something here. DoomBuilder is the best thing to have happened to the classic Doom editing community for ages! 0 Share this post Link to post
Amaster Posted August 21, 2004 A lot of the issues you describe sound more like mapping errors than programming errors. For instance, are you sure you're not setting your weapons with the multiplayer flags? I personally dont use doombuilder that often, since I prefer Wadauthor. But it is indeed a good editing program. It may also be possible that you have some system specific issues. I've never heard of anyone else having some of these problems. 0 Share this post Link to post
CodeImp Posted August 21, 2004 RTFM. John Anderson didnt write that 146-page Doom Builder manual for you to ignore. 0 Share this post Link to post
QuipFrok Posted August 21, 2004 AgentSpork said:Heh, Doom Builder is one of the least buggy editors out there.[/code] It maybe that. Ten years ago I was using DCK and DoomCad. They weren't near as buggy as DB. So, compared with todays curret editors that may very well be the case. DB is the only one of the current crop I've tried. >Uhm.. I don't know what to tell you about your texture/things >problems besides: Are you playing your map in Doom 2 or Doom 1? Doom >1 doesn't have a supershotgun, so that wouldn't appear if you placed >one in there. Same thing goes for textures. Your tip led me to solve my problem. I can only get this editor to compile if I use zdoom or glzdoom. I was using the zdoom I had in my Doom folder. I extracted zdoom to my doom2 folder and now it's a go. Thanks for the tip. Quip Frok 0 Share this post Link to post
QuipFrok Posted August 21, 2004 Chris, My expectations are different than yours. I expect a guy to have enough pride in his project to supply data that will allow it to be easily setup and used. I have built enough different editors: http://www.coyoterock.net/Inigo/files.htm to know a good product when I see it. I won't call DB a good product at this time. It's usable. When it quits crashing and displays textures on a consistent basis then I'll call it passable. As soon as DB is solid I'll recommend it. The 3d view is a very good thing Quip Frok Chris Hansen said:I think that comment is way off! If it's freeware you can expect certain difficulties and because it is freeware you're not entitled to expect the author to support every minor issue. And some of the things you mention can't be DB's problem. Like the one with the SS... I never experienced something like that! I'm betting you're misunderstanding something here. DoomBuilder is the best thing to have happened to the classic Doom editing community for ages! 0 Share this post Link to post
QuipFrok Posted August 21, 2004 CodeImp said:RTFM. John Anderson didnt write that 146-page Doom Builder manual for you to ignore. Why didn't you write it? No one knows more about the program than you. I find guys that release software than don't take the time to write a help file very lacking. Years ago I built some levels with QED. The author supplied extensive help files which were extremely valuble to me. The concepts he laid out to use his editor have served me to this day. Why you guys are so arrogant and won't support your stuff properly is beyond me. Is it an - I figured it out you figure it out mentality? There is a lot more you could do. Anderson I have a lot of respect for. He has made great maps and been a real aid to several communities. You Sir, are No John Anderson. as evidenced by your "my feelings are hurt you ingrate" reply Quip Frok BTW keep working on that editor..It needs it :-) 0 Share this post Link to post
Graf Zahl Posted August 21, 2004 And you are an idiot. You come here, insult the people that put a lot of work in their software and expect helpful assistance. You better shut up and go away before it's too late. 0 Share this post Link to post
boris Posted August 21, 2004 Have a look at my fbase6 that comes with Doom Builder. I used DB 0.04 and built it in a week, without any documentation at all so it can't be that hard to use, can it? 0 Share this post Link to post
CodeImp Posted August 21, 2004 You should know the time and effort John Anderson and I have put in this project, as well as the people credited on this page. But if you think there is a need for yet a better editor... And if you think one man could easily do it all by himself... I suggest you start up a programming enviroment an build a map editor better than mine (and dont you forget a manual as good as John's!). Now let me hear the "i dont have the time" or "i dont have the skill" excuse and fuck off plzktnxbye. Â 0 Share this post Link to post
Darkhaven Posted August 21, 2004 boris said:Have a look at my fbase6 that comes with Doom Builder. I used DB 0.04 and built it in a week, without any documentation at all so it can't be that hard to use, can it? That map was yours, Boris? Very cool one, my friend :) And QuipFrok, Graf Zahl is absolutely right. If you have problems with Doombuilder, why don't you just go back to using DEU and do things the harder way, just like all those Doomers did back in '94? Then maybe you will see what it's like to use a difficult editor. And before you go firing off on me, I know what it's all about, I use DETH and DEU most, if not all the time. EDIT: Wow, I didn't think I would be able to do that without at least swearing 3 or more times. :P 0 Share this post Link to post
cyber-menace Posted August 22, 2004 Darkhaven said:EDIT: Wow, I didn't think I would be able to do that without at least swearing 3 or more times. :P I'm trying to resist that temtation at this point. [speech] Excuse me Mr. I'm gonna be negative to this piece of crap programmer because I can't use his program properly... but have you ever thought the problem might be YOU! YES YOU! NOT THE PROGRAM! YOU! You OBVIOUSLY were doing something stupid and then you naturally blamed it on the program. CodeImp has gone through an unbelivable amount of time making his editor as up-to-date and easy to use as possible. Besides EVERYTHING HAS ERRORS! Doom Builder doesn't have any problems when I use it. Why? Because I know how to map. I've used WinDEU, Deepsea, WadAuthor, and Doom Builder and DB is by far the best at this point. So next time you're having problems with a program, don't bitch at the programmer. The problem is likely your fault. [/speech] 0 Share this post Link to post
sgtcrispyII Posted August 22, 2004 QuipFrok said:Why didn't you write it? No one knows more about the program than you.I find guys that release software than don't take the time to write a help file very lacking. Spot on my man. "my feeling are hurt" and "free" are no excuse for a proper help system. DB isn't all that original anyway - more like a copy of old ideas - some well done, some poorly. Graf: you seem awfully quick calling someone an "idiot" when your own comments border on idiocy and insults in other posts. Simply amazing lack of self awareness. Don't you guys moderate this sort of stuff? Seems to me that's a petty personal attack for absolutely no valid reason. An opinion such as QuipFrok is just his impression. IMO it's more or less correct. Finished programs have a good help system, not some bulky tacked together "how to" manual by somebody else. 0 Share this post Link to post
CodeImp Posted August 22, 2004 sgtcrispyII, read plz;CodeImp said:...if you think there is a need for yet a better editor... And if you think one man could easily do it all by himself... I suggest you start up a programming enviroment an build a map editor better than mine (and dont you forget a manual as good as John's!). Now let me hear the "i dont have the time" or "i dont have the skill" excuse and fuck off plzktnxbye. 0 Share this post Link to post
Bloodshedder Posted August 22, 2004 sgtcrispyII said:Finished programs have a good help system, not some bulky tacked together "how to" manual by somebody else. As long as the author knows what he's talking about and is helpful, why does it matter WHO wrote the manual? 0 Share this post Link to post
Hyena Posted August 22, 2004 Graf Zahl said:And you are an idiot. You come here, insult the people that put a lot of work in their software and expect helpful assistance. You better shut up and go away before it's too late. Bing! 0 Share this post Link to post
Darkhaven Posted August 22, 2004 Bloodshedder said:As long as the author knows what he's talking about and is helpful, why does it matter WHO wrote the manual? Damn straight. 0 Share this post Link to post
insertwackynamehere Posted August 22, 2004 Heh I love DB and never have problems. Oh well, you can't please everyone :D 0 Share this post Link to post
QuipFrok Posted August 22, 2004 Once I got the config problems ironed out...and figured out what NOT to do. Config needs lotsa work....did I mention that? It is a snappy editor. To be able to do things in 3D mode really elevates it. Good job on that CodeImp. QuipFrok 0 Share this post Link to post
Bloodshedder Posted August 22, 2004 Merging. No new thread was needed. 0 Share this post Link to post
Use Posted August 22, 2004 Doom Builder is a huge service to this community, even though I don't use it for mapping, I occasionaly open it up to look at a map or make teeny changes to my own and it has served me well (it's the only editor on this computer, my other computer is the Doom editing machine and I use Deepsea). I've not read a scrap of documentation and picked it up instantly. 0 Share this post Link to post
Nmn Posted August 22, 2004 It somehow seems strange that Codeimp brought us the best editor we could have IMHO and people still manage to moan. Listen-if You don't like it, try another editor. I used to toy around with multiple ones before I found my favourite-Wadauthor (in the past) later replaced by Doom Builder. Get Doomed, DCK or a plain Hex Editor! I believe that only a gorilla couldn't use DB. That is if it tried to read the manual first and some tutorials that can be found easily... 0 Share this post Link to post
Darkhaven Posted August 22, 2004 I actually got my dog to join two sectors together in DB before (with a little help) :P 0 Share this post Link to post
Dron Posted August 22, 2004 i don't understand HOW you can have problems with doombuilder. i've tried mapping with other editors (deepsea) and i could barely figure out how to do anything, but then i downloaded doombuilder and instantly understood how to do everything in it. 0 Share this post Link to post
Cyb Posted August 22, 2004 Use3D said:Doom Builder is a huge service to this community, even though I don't use it for mapping, I occasionaly open it up to look at a map or make teeny changes to my own and it has served me well (it's the only editor on this computer, my other computer is the Doom editing machine and I use Deepsea). I've not read a scrap of documentation and picked it up instantly. same (except I use wadauthor and not deepsea). the only thing I had to read was how to get the nodes builder configured. everything else is pretty simple. 0 Share this post Link to post
myk Posted August 22, 2004 This is a Forum; you can expect to find posts about issues found when trying programs related to the games dealt with here. In many instances when there's an issue, it's not clear yet to the user if it's on the software, the usage, or the user. So the user often makes an iquisitive (partly positive and partly negative) post. Such issues are easily dealt with by experienced users, who don't need to post like bitches, because they don't really need to drag their personal failures into the Forums, and that's because they are better than that and since they know opinions are not written in stone. 0 Share this post Link to post