MM map 29 UV speed in 0:18

[Kristian Ronge]

Following a recent Strolling demo I did on this map, I noticed that Marijo "Sedlo" Sedlic's UV speedrun, mm29-019.lmp, for the COMPET-N, used a slower route. He went for the switch farthest from the exit, whereas I had used the closest, "invisible" co/op switch. My guess is he probably just didn't know about the closest switch.

I then started wondering how much this "mistake" cost Sedlo. His exit time using the inferior route was 19.31, and it wasn't unlikely that choosing the closest switch had landed him in 18.xx. Curiosity got the better of me, So I decided to find out!

The first 12 seconds in this demo are taken directly from Sedlo's COMPET-N entry mm29-019.lmp; from there on in, I'm running the show. By using Andrey Budko's modified PrBoom 2.2.4 I "took over" in the middle of Sedlo's demo and re-recorded the last part with the quicker route. And lo and behold ...

MM map 29 UV speed in 0:18.

[Searcher]

Great detective work.

Cool demo.

[Kristian Ronge]

Thank you. To tell you the truth, I hesitated a bit to upload this demo. I'm not sure what the policy is on these types of demos. As I said in the .txt, I hope Sedlo doesn't mind this; if he does, I'll remove it.

[Searcher]

I agree, hard to say if they will like it or not since it is not your own "complete" run.

However you clearly state that it is built.

The major problem will be with Sedlo if he minds you using part of his demo or not.

Can't recall this issue ever being addressed before.

Its still cool. Thanks

[Opulent]

I don't think Sedlo would mind at all... you document what you have modified. no harm done.
agree: cool demo.

[Grazza]

Bit of a bump, but on-topic.

Just wondering about the origin of this trick. You're normally fastidious about giving route credits, so the lack of one here seemes to suggest that you found this one independently. I just happened to notice, which idly watching some compet-n demos recently (what better way to amuse yourself while waiting for some new snow?), that Oyvind Stenhaug's mm29p022 features this same trick. Oyvind's demo is dated a couple of months after Sedlo's mm29-019, and he commented:

I don't know if anyone else is aware of that last hidden switch, but it might be helpful if anyone is going for the speed record. I think I saw it in an old Max demo, so credits should probably go to Istvan.

[Vile]

Neat. It's good to keep in mind the possibility of old tricks falling through the cracks, as they may resurface just when they are needed (map27 nightmare route for the archvile trick).

[Kristian Ronge]

Grazza said:
Just wondering about the origin of this trick. You're normally fastidious about giving route credits, so the lack of one here seemes to suggest that you found this one independently.

Let's see... IIRC, I studied the map in an editor a great while back (late 2002 or something) and found that there was a switch that rises there if a certain red wall in that room is shot at. To gain enough height to hit it, you have to play co/op and let one player flip another switch (at the back wall of that room) which raises a ledge, so the other player can shoot at the wall. Of course, knowing about such tricks as the E2M2 switch trick, I tried it out and it worked. I didn't think more of it, I assumed it was "common knowledge".

Then I watched the mmuvlmps pack, and Istvan Pataki used it, which strenghtened that assumption considerably. When I some months later watched Sedlo's speedrun, I thought it was strange he didn't use the trick. I again just assumed he didn't know about it but that implementing it didn't save enough time to reach 0:18.

It wasn't until I thought about looking at the exact time in Budko's PrBoom that I understood he'd made a very costly oversight!

EDIT: I guess the route credits go to Istvan, then?

EDIT # 2: No, wait! Actually, the credits should go to Michael "Migru" Grube, who uses the swith trick in his mmdemoup-collection (which predates the mmuvlmps-collection by several months). I just checked to be certain, and sure enough, it's in there. The earliest demo pack for MM, mmdemos.zip, doesn't contain the switch trick... So unless someone else made a demo in between february and may of 1996 with this trick in it (really doubtful), Migru must be given credit.