ESRB gets a ton of flak for not factoring in GTA: SA's sex "game" while rating it.

[Submerge]

First of all, the ratings are there for a reason, and I wish people would actually fucking look at them.

Second, GTA:SA is not for ****ing little brats the age of 6!

Third, This is a MOD, apparently, not a piece of the game you can just buy off of a shelf. Are we gonna have to start putting ESRB ratings on our DOOM mods now or something?

Fourth, It's a minigame? O_o I'm trying to imagine how you'd control such a game, and the closest thing i can think of is the controls for the lowrider contest

[Darkstalker]

Submerge said:

Third, This is a MOD, apparently, not a piece of the game you can just buy off of a shelf. Are we gonna have to start putting ESRB ratings on our DOOM mods now or something?

The minigame is already in the game. The mod unlocks it.

[Bashe]

Submerge said:

Third, This is a MOD, apparently, not a piece of the game you can just buy off of a shelf. Are we gonna have to start putting ESRB ratings on our DOOM mods now or something?

Heh, I can see it now.

"Hello Kitty mod for Doom 3. Rated E for everyone."

[AndrewB]

Submerge said:

Third, This is a MOD, apparently, not a piece of the game you can just buy off of a shelf. Are we gonna have to start putting ESRB ratings on our DOOM mods now or something?

Rockstar DID produce the (I guess) pornographic scene, and they DID distribute it on the discs. But this is truly a gray area because it required a lot of effort to find it. But how much effort should be required?

There ARE theoretical areas of a game that the ESRB cannot find or access but consumers can. If developers hide pornography in these areas, who should be held accountable? I think the developers should be, because you can't expect the people at ESRB to be superhumans.

[insertwackynamehere]

i dunno, since this wasnt accessable in the real game, it doesnt matter if it was in the code or not. Anything could be in any code, i mean who knows what the code looks like. Thats like saying the code has a comment with the word "fuck" and therefore the game should be rated M. Mods are not officially supported by Rockstar, and if you were to only play the game officially without voiding any warranties (and I assume ratings) then you would never be faced with it.

[Scabbed Angel]

Submerge said:

First of all, the ratings are there for a reason, and I wish people would actually look at them.\

Agreed. I do. If it's not MA, it probably sucks.

I don't see what the big deal is. Considering how incredibly violent and vulgar the game is, how can people claim that the esrb wasn't "looking out for their children"? At the least 17 year olds can play the game, and that's the only minor group that should be playing it legally anyway. It's not as if it's real porn. I mean two poorly animated/modeled characters (i'm sorry but that game's graphics sucks) can't represent that much (I haven't seen it so maybe I'm wrong). If it wasn't meant to be played in normal game play anyway, and can only be accessed when modding it, no one should be respnsible. It wasn't arguabley rockstars or take twos intent to have that viewed in the context of normal, unmolested (no pun intended) gameplay.

Also.. any one to my knowledge can pick up say a Stephen King novel... they are not hugely graphic, but to some degree, and they are especially vulgar. Him or any other major novelist... Clive Barker... especially gory, violent, sexual etc... there's no one complaining about books... be consistent if you're going to be at all.

**For the record I do not want them banning books as I love books.

[DooMer87]

I am sick of soccer moms.

If the game's rating is shifted up to AO, then retailers will stop selling the game. Almost no retailers will accept any AO rated games. I'm sick of parent groups, too. They stopped us from getting hoverboards. The world was once a free place, where we could do whatever we want. The censors stepped in, and we definitely reached a climax right there. I HATE CENSORS! they suck

[Caco-Puff]

It's not a minigame either,It's a cutscene.

[leileilol]

omg doom should have ao it has imp vaginas!

[Scabbed Angel]

They would still sell the console versions wouldn't they?

[DooMer87]

hmm...thats the question. ive never heard of anyone hacking a PS2 game...hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...i like the sound of hmmm because i'm drunk...heh jk

[NiGHTMARE]

DooMer87 said:

I'm sick of parent groups, too. They stopped us from getting hoverboards.

From what I heard, it was health & safety inspectors who stopped this particular invention.

[Johnny]

DooMer87 said:

ive never heard of anyone hacking a PS2 game

Are you an idiot? PS2 games are hacked regularly, as are Xbox and PC games.

[wildweasel]

But in those cases, it's usually illegal to reverse-engineer such games.

[AndrewB]

Scabbed Angel said:

Also.. any one to my knowledge can pick up say a Stephen King novel... they are not hugely graphic, but to some degree, and they are especially vulgar. Him or any other major novelist... Clive Barker... especially gory, violent, sexual etc... there's no one complaining about books... be consistent if you're going to be at all.

The difference is that novels are more of a "grown-up" form of entertainment. Video games are still most popular with teens and preteens. Believe me, Stephen King is very controversial among authors, but nobody really cares because kids simply aren't the ones reading his books.

[Hobbs]

Eh, say that again. I read The Stand when I was 12 and began reading the Dark Tower series when I was 13. Still, you have a point, because I began to play Doom at 8. Although Video games have not been just for kids for a while (the average age of a gamer is over 20) many of our youth play video games, even ones that the ever-idiotic ESRB rates as "Mature." The primary reason for this is neither the fault of ESRB (however stupid they may be) or retailers, it is the fault of parents.

[AndrewB]

I'll bet that the average age of Stephen King readers is around 55. GTA: San Andreas? My guess is mid 20's.

[insertwackynamehere]

i began playing Doom at 4, and my friend has read about 30 of Steven Kings books and he started when he was 12 or 13, he's 15 now.

[NiGHTMARE]

It's time to start imposing thousand dollar fines on parents who allow their kids to buy and play games which are rated for higher ages.

[Submerge]

Quast said:

Man, I can't wait until the democrats take over and we all live in goverment mandated styrofoam houses and wear bubblewrap suits.

Good thing I got a leg up by making my own bubblewrap suit :P

[Piezo]

geekmarine said:

By the way, I'd like to get a little political here and point out how screwy politics has gotten lately. Used to be, liberals were big government, everything regulated, and conservatives were small government, no regulation. Now it seems things have reversed. Liberals (at least extreme liberals) are all about no government regulation - abortion, gay marriage, free speech (which covers things like sex in video games), etc., whereas it seems like conservatives want more government regulation - Patriot Act, marriage amendment, limits to free speech. Of course, this was a total side bar, and has really nothing at all to do with anything. Just an observation. Weird...

They're called neo-cons. They call themselves conservative, but they aren't at all. Under our current cabinet our government has never been bigger.

[kc32]

NiGHTMARE said:

It's time to start imposing thousand dollar fines on parents who allow their kids to buy and play games which are rated for higher ages.

How many people here played Doom before they were 16?

[XXoXX]

Another great game mired in scandal.... Sad huh? Personally i think nobody should be held responsible (maybe the guy who made the mod but that is another issue) as it is not in the normal game.

[pilottobombadier]

AndrewB said:

Rockstar DID produce the (I guess) pornographic scene, and they DID distribute it on the discs. But this is truly a gray area because it required a lot of effort to find it. But how much effort should be required?

There ARE theoretical areas of a game that the ESRB cannot find or access but consumers can. If developers hide pornography in these areas, who should be held accountable? I think the developers should be, because you can't expect the people at ESRB to be superhumans.

It's not gray area, because Rockstar knew it was there, and they have to notify the ESRB, that, so far as I know, is law, because it's contractual.

They circumvented a censor, knowingly and willfully, so they should be dealt the necessary punishment, especially since this is going to bring the axe down on the head of our gaming culture.

[TheDarkArchon]

Rockstar knew it was there BUT it can't be accessed during normal gmaeplay. Hence there should be no requirement on Rockstar's part to inform the ESRB. The fact a mod is used to "unlock" the scene means that it shouldn't be taken into account. Period.

[pilottobombadier]

Yes it should be. It is game content, it is there. And it was accessed, user mod (that unlocks the content) or not.

[insertwackynamehere]

actually afaik usermods void the warranty, rating, etc

[TheDarkArchon]

In almost EVERY EULA EVER, it says that modified versions of the game are not supported by the developer. So if the developer doesn't support it, why the Hell should the ESRB?

[AndrewB]

Well, I have no sympathy for Rockstar. If they didn't want the flack, then they shouldn't produced the scene.

... Then again, maybe they DID want the flack; any publicity is good publicity.

And pilottobombadier, it is a gray area because, as you can see, nobody is agreeing here.

[DooMer87]

anyway, censorship just creeps me out.

Also, I'd like to point out that there WILL be another GTA game. the dude who owns take 2 said that they wont make another one for PS2. Anyway, I've heard we have to refuel cars and raise farm animals and there are "online possibilities." Holy crap