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funduke

Betray, MAP33 of Xbox DooM II: Does anybody know the original?

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Hello!

As some of you might know, there are two new levels in the Xbox version of DooMI+II, one for DooM and one for DooMII.
The new Xbox level for DooM, E1M11: Sewers, has already been identified as SEWERS.WAD by David Calvin and David Blanshine. ( http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=13407 )

But the source for the new Xbox level for DooMII, MAP33: Betray, has so far not been found.
Can anybody help?
Ledmeister was so friendly to put up a webpage with screenshots (including automap) and descriptive texts for that level. So can anybody, who doesn't own the Xbox Doom, look at theese and try to find out, what original PC level that might be.
Here is the URL to that website:
http://classicdoom.com/betray33/
Click on the thumbnails to enlarge the screenshots.

Please post here, if you find the original.

Thanks in advance,

Greetings
FunDuke

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Hmm..if sewers is any indication, they picked some pretty piss poor levels to include. It certainly wasn't the worst doom1 level I've played, but it wasn't anything special...and kinda ugly.

and that one, SS gaurds mixed in with monsters: always a sign of quality?!

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Having SSs in the same level with monsters is never good, unless there's not a whole lot of them, but in the same ROOM? Blech...except for map31 and 32, which somehow managed to do it right.

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I got stuck in the sewers level, where you would pick up the chaingun and the yellow keycard.
When the floor raises I got trapped inside the tiny sector, had to idclip out of there.

Apart from that I liked it, the bad looks of it didn't bothered me too much.

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maybe those maps were created by bill gates under a pseudoname back in the mists of time... adding nazis sounds like his style.

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Ledmeister said:

Original and debugged versions now here. Sorry it took so long.


Yippee!
:)

Thank you very much!

Greetings
Funduke

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Is there some significance to Sewers and Betray as to why they chose these two particular maps to add as special bonus maps? Quite frankly unless they were made by John Carmack or something unique, they shouldn't have bothered. These were possibly two of the worst levels I've ever played, far below even the quality of maps made in 1993 for the original Doom.

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Yeah, I know a lot of people don't like the maps (Opulent already voiced his displeasure in email ;P ). But some die-hard console Doomers have been asking around for the PC originals, so I wanted to oblige.

The maps seem unprofessional, because they are. They were both made long ago by guys who were just out of high school at the time, and at least one of them was a first-timer at level editing. As fate would have it, a decade later both of them wound up being involved with the team that ported classic Doom to the Xbox.
These maps are so hard to find that they're not meant to be a part of normal gameplay; they were just tacked on by some long-time Doom fans who had a couple of their original maps handy.

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Ahhh.... so People who made some old Doom levels that ended up being on the Doom3 porting team added them? If that's the case then it makes perfect sense... I'd add my stuff too even if it sucked :P

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Not sure who made it, but it sure looks pretty crappy, by the minimap, i mean, those sectors look like just randomly shaped things.

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Nautilus said:

Those maps are just OLDSCHOOL.



No. Those maps are just bad. Even 1994 had its share of much better maps.

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Graf Zahl said:

No. Those maps are just bad. Even 1994 had its share of much better maps.

Truth. I was being sarcastic, of course.

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Scuba Steve said:

Ahhh.... so People who made some old Doom levels that ended up being on the Doom3 porting team added them? If that's the case then it makes perfect sense... I'd add my stuff too even if it sucked :P

Well, they didn't add them 'cause they thought those maps were awesome, any more than a restaurant owner hangs a framed dollar bill on the wall to impress the patrons... I think in both cases something like that is just a personal memento of humbler beginnings, a reminder of where it all began, for them.
In the case of the maps, they included their first-ever (or as close to it as they could dig up); but they're not even out on the wall, they're folded up and hidden back in the kitchen behind the dishwasher. ;) No one will be subjected to them unless they hunt them down.

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Hmm, if they are maps of one of the port developers, I guess that makes some sense, and I can forgive the low-quality. We all have our first maps.

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I was not really impressed. The most uninspired map I've seen in a long time. If they took any of the maps that are usually in "newstuff" it would have made for a much better level. :-)

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I wasn't impressed either, but that wasn't the intent.
Like I said, those maps weren't really meant to be a part of actual game play... frankly the developers didn't really expect them to be found, especially within days of the game's release.
(They don't know me very well. >;)

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Ledmeister said:

(They don't know me very well. >;)

hehe, no they don't!
you run one of those websites where even the game designers can learn something they never knew.

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Funny you should mention that... In my first discussion with the lead developer, he wrote back to say they'd used the site several times for information.
I only wish they'd contacted me before the game went public. I would've gladly flown out to playtest, and hopefully prevent some of those annoying bugs. (Or at least yell at them in person for not fleshing out that Options menu. ;)

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