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Lutrov71

Congestion 1024 released!

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Szymanski said:

Were the nodes rebuilt on map07 and map17? i've just run through with prboom and some texture offsets are screwed. The original map is fine :(


I've just noticed the same in one of my maps. I'll just send the original to Lutrov again. Maybe the nodes have been rebuilt in some maps, that might explain some of the texture offsetting i've seen in some other maps (the start of map21 looks really ugly in Boom). Is it ZDBSP that causes these problems?

Thanks Grazza/Graf for the passthrough stuff, I wasn't aware of that and surprised I haven't stumbled across it before. I think those problems should be easy to sort out. I have wondered previously what that Passthrough flag in Doombuilder was for...

Regarding crampedness. Personally I never viewed this as a project to make over-cramped maps, rather it was more of a challenge to use the confined 1024x1024 space effectively. More a case of trying to think of an interesting way to use the space limits, than simply cramming a normal map into the tight confines. There are maps in the set that are too cramped for my personal tastes, and I guess some people will like them, but there are others where it isn't so bad.

Edit: I'm noticing texture offset problems in lots of maps. I've just noticed stuff in map03 and 21. Rebuilding the nodes with Zennode gets rid of the problems. There's probably plenty more maps with problems of this sort somewhere along the line, that can be easily fixed.

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The Flange Peddler said:

Is it ZDBSP that causes these problems?

Most source ports get the texture offsets from a value stored in the seg data. ZDoom does not and instead retrieves them by calculating the actual offset in the renderer.

For some reason this isn't written correctly on occasion by ZDBSP. I have seen this problem with at least one other node builder as well.

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Just out of curiosity, whilst I wait for this to download, how does zdoom differ from the other ports with respect to texture alignments?

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The Flange Peddler said:

Thanks Grazza/Graf for the passthrough stuff, I wasn't aware of that and surprised I haven't stumbled across it before. I think those problems should be easy to sort out. I have wondered previously what that Passthrough flag in Doombuilder was for...

Just one comment: if these problems are solved in a way that makes them require Boom features, then this can be a little offputting from the recording viewpoint, as it means you (obviously) need to use Boom compatibility. This means non-dead monsters can fall off ledges, which can be problem with Max-categories (makes it easier to miss monsters, or even make them unreachable, and at any rate reduces the player's control of events, making good times more luck-dependent). Just a small thing in some respects, but if they can be fixed in a way that keeps them purely limit-removing, then that's even better. And it gives jDoom users a better chance too.

Jon: didn't Graf's post just above answer your question? Or is there something deeper going on?

And I'll just repeat that the map02 issue really should be fixed (if it hasn't been already - I haven't redownloaded). The shortcut I referred to shouldn't be left as the intended route. Try it to see why. ;)

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No need to worry, I've sorted out the problems without having to resort to using any Boom-specific features, it just involved removing/moving some WR linedefs a little. Some of them were just 'back-ups' for other lines that did the same effect anyway.

Hopefully it won't be too long before the fixed version can be uploaded to Newstuff.

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Grazza: I just tried map02 in prboom 2.2.3, among other ports (legacy, jdoom) and the doors seem to work fine.. In fact the only thing I notice that's wrong is the texture misalignment on the two switch textures. I do believe that there is something wrong with it... but everything I try shows no error, so I really don't know how to blindly fix it...

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OK, on further investigation, what it needs in order to work on Prboom 2.2.x is the compatibility option:

Use exactly Doom's linedef trigger model = no
So it won't work with a purely limit-removing port as it stands - it requires this Boom feature to be enabled. (Initially I thought the switch didn't work even with Boom compatibles because I tried it in Prboom with the default compat {-1}, but of course my cfg has this option set to "yes"...; the switch works when compatibility is set to 5 - i.e. Boom compatibility, which overrides the cfg in this case. I would have tested this with more exes, but as I mentioned it failed at start-up in two others that I tried.)

The texture issue is, I presume, related to what Graf mentioned above.

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It was good. The Former Humans (that includes the pistol dude, shotgunner and chaingunner) and low amounts of health made it a real challenge. One of the later maps with the 4 masterminds shooting you from their tower was very impressive, and then Hell breaks loose after a while. MAP32 was the hardest I thought.

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Any particular reason why the txt file isn't recomending Coop play?

I have played the first 9 maps solo, but so far they seem suited also for coop.

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Darmuss said:

Any particular reason why the txt file isn't recomending Coop play?

I have played the first 9 maps solo, but so far they seem suited also for coop.


dude, unless you wanna "Ride the train" through the levels like a conga line, coöp is not a good idea. when you fit 2 or more hot sweaty marine bodies in a map that's 1024 units square, you're bound to have sector tag problems, 3d effect problems, and worst of all, the inablity to even move. you can barely move as it is, imagine having 2 or more. we could call it "sardine doom".

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Grazza said:

Jon: didn't Graf's post just above answer your question? Or is there something deeper going on?


Well I missed it when I made my post, but I don't understand it now ;) However it's late...

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Just a quick question about this map set -- are all the secret areas accessible? I seem to have trouble getting the green armor in map 2, even with a map editor.

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Pacifists will like map27... silence is your best defense.

rrwoods said:

Just a quick question about this map set -- are all the secret areas accessible? I seem to have trouble getting the green armor in map 2, even with a map editor.


Go around the back of the fort that has the blue key. You should find a switch on the back wall of the fort (it'll be up high, so enabling mouselook would make it easier to see) which will lower an elevator on the front side of the fort.

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If you can describe the detail in one word, "uber" will be just what the doctor ordered.

And the music is great! I snagged some of it for my own project.

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Vile said:

Go around the back of the fort that has the blue key. You should find a switch on the back wall of the fort (it'll be up high, so enabling mouselook would make it easier to see) which will lower an elevator on the front side of the fort.

Mouselook FTW.

I really, really enjoy this WAD. Quick levels are just my style, given that I don't have much time to Doom nowadays.

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-_DLD_- said:

If you can describe the detail in one word, "uber" will be just what the doctor ordered.

And the music is great! I snagged some of it for my own project.

I'm just curious, which music are you going to use? I'm just wondering which music you guys like the most because I made some of it.

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Hmmm...I forget exactly which...I've got only 6 level's worth of music used thus far. I'll check later and tell you which ones I'm using.

What I really want is a "DOOM version" of the music from the Lobby Scene in The Matrix.

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I've only played the first few maps so far - and I must say: it's amazing! Quick and extremely good looking levels. VERY good work everyone!

For a bug report: in the first map however, I was able to get the secret blue amor behind the door at the start through the closed door in (g)zDoom. The autor of the map should move it a bit farer away from the door.

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One question about the game.

How the hell do you beat all those Cacos in Map11?! I tried everything I could think of, but I ended up getting surrounded and roasted alive. I'm talking about after you hit the switch with the Megasphere.

EDIT: NVM, I just went berserk with rockets until they got close, then ran round the level gunning them down.

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I got lucky and managed to get around to the hall that went around the map filled with shotgun zombies. I didn't even notice all the cacos until I got hit by one. :( From there I just strafed side to side in my limited space as the cacos closed in (using the SSG), and eventually wittled them down. My advice is to learn how to strafe in a really tight space with monsters right in your face. :/

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I had to remove many of the cacos and other enemies from the map because Boom wouldn't handle it if I didn't. There were a bit too many too, it should be more 'humane' now. :P

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Brilliant stuff!!!!!!!!
Most of the levels were fairly good and the music was great.
BTW: Where did the music for Map18 come for is it an actual song or is it something composed just for this?

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Killer_of_Doom said:

Brilliant stuff!!!!!!!!
Most of the levels were fairly good and the music was great.
BTW: Where did the music for Map18 come for is it an actual song or is it something composed just for this?

Thats Children of Bodom, I don't know which song though..

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I'm on Map21 or something now.

Still brilliant. I had to cheat on the end of Map20, since you DIE and the level restarts as soon as you walk in the exit teleport...so I had to IDDQD and clip to the part where there's a "playerdoll" and John Romero's head and shotgun the head to make it to Map21. =(

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