Compet-N: incoming and discussion, part 1 [please post in part 2 instead]

[Ryback]

Paska said:

I'm not sure, but in the last room I think it's possible to kill the arch-viles quick by shooting 1-2 rockets to the left side then simply lean to the opposite wall and shoot another 1-2 rockets to the right side and so on. At least it would make rockets flying constantly, but it might be too risky.

I just tried this and it seems to work, but the timing in switching from wall to wall has got to be exact, one mistake and it's instant death. Also it's harder to keep track of when the door is going to close again, which could lead to rocket death. But practice should iron out those problems.

[SAV88]

I think it's not worth the trouble. A faster and safer way is concentrating on cleaning one side first -- after it's done, one of the corners near the door will become a safe spot for quick hiding, and you'll be able to freely shoot at the second side without teleporting out at all.

[Archy]

Plutonia
UV Fast
Map 11 in 2:44

pf11-244.zip

[Archy]

Plutonia
UV Fast
Map 11 in 2:42

pf11-242.zip

[Revved]

Alien Vendetta
UV Fast
Map 11 in 16:38

af111638.zip

[Revved]

Classic Episode
UV Fast
E2M6 in 8:28
----------------------------------
So, that's 10 UV Fasts left.
Anybody else willing to help out?
I didn't want this to be a one-man (excluding Ryback)
project by the looks of it.

cf26-828.zip

[Memfis]

Your demo desyncs on the idgames version for me. What version should I use?

EDIT: playsback fine with 2000 version. But why do you use it instead of 2002?

[tempun]

Memfis said:

Your demo desyncs on the idgames version for me. What version should I use?

EDIT: playsback fine with 2000 version. But why do you use it instead of 2002?

I think 2000 version is the version that C-N uses.

[Memfis]

Oh, I see, thanks.
Why they didn't move to 2002 version? Isn't it better? :)

[Grazza]

The later version made the maps easier, so they preferred to stay with the more "hardcore" version.

Also, changing to the new version would have meant nuking all the old records, which seems kind of unfair to those who spent a lot of time on them. It might have also set a bad precedent, and discouraged people from bothering recording on compet-n wads if there was much chance of new versions of them appearing.

[Mr.TF]

Hey all,

http://competn.doom2.net is dead

Could someone tell me, where can I get the original (structured) CompetN database?

Thanks,
Tamas

[myk]

I think Andy could well zip the contents of Compet~n and provide them as a link at the DSDA, assuming this wouldn't cause any issues. The file wouldn't be too big and this would be an appropriate temporary solution till all the Compet~n stuff is added to the DSDA individually.

[Revved]

Classic Episode
UV Fast
E2M8 in 8:54
---------------------------
The number of UV Fasts left
now enters the single-digit
category........9.

cf28-854.zip

[tempun]

Since no one seems to bother reuploading the archive from first post: http://www.sendspace.com/file/h2ti90

[Mr.TF]

Thank you!

[KennyJC]

I can't download any of the demos from that website and I can't find them anywhere else "30uvmax4" for example.

[tempun]

Yes, competn.doom2.net is down. You can download myk's copy of it here: http://www.sendspace.com/file/h2ti90
This is only the demos.

[KennyJC]

Thanks.

I just watched that 30uvmax4 demo. It was good, but there were many situations were I felt like he wasted away a lot of time. I don't know what type of monitor/brightness he was playing at, it looked like he couldn't see a lot of the invisible demons or monsters in dark locations (the imps at the end of map15) when I could see them as plain as day. He also spent a lot of time doubling back to see if he missed some monstors even though I could tell there wouldn't be as there were no grunts etc. Also going for a lot of items that he didn't really need.

I notice that he had only 90% secrets on one map. Is there a good reason for that?

It would be a challenge, but surely someone can beat that? It's been 9 years! Does nobody try to break these IWad records anymore? This forum seems really active with speed runners. I'd love to see someone beat some of those endurance runs.

[kmc]

As far as secrets go, it is generally accepted that only 90% secrets are possible on map 15 and 87% on map 27. Also keep in mind that the demo was recorded using the original dos executable, not a source port. As a result, the runner was playing at a lower resolution on a much darker screen than what you may be accustomed to. Or perhaps he was just tired :)

Either way I agree that the demo, as well as many other long runs are still vastly improvable, its just a very time-consuming process. We did have the coop (Looper/Xepop) and single (Looper) speed run records broken not long ago though.

[Creaphis]

Most people who are interested in making highly optimized runs are more interested in the SPEED rather than MAX categories. An exception is SAV88, who is such a perfectionist that if he started working on a 30uv max run we might not live long enough to see him release a demo he's satisfied with. Either way, you just can't win.

[Grazza]

I'd say it's not so much the category that determines how much effort is put into optimizing the time, as the length of the demo. The compet-n Max runs on the Doom and Doom2 iwad maps, especially the easier ones, look about as well optimized as Speed runs of a similar length on popular maps, if not more so.

Another factor is how much raw luck is involved - once the runner realizes that the only way he's likely to improve his time is for some random factors to coincide, he's not too likely to put masses of time into polishing the run. Who's ever going to try to beat Vile's lv11-205.lmp (where a big infight ended with zero survivors), for instance?

[KennyJC]

I'm tempted to put some effort into the 30uvmax myself, but it would just take a lot of research into the maps and routes etc.. but if I had knowledge of the maps right now I think I could beat it.

[SAV88]

Creaphis said:

Most people who are interested in making highly optimized runs are more interested in the SPEED rather than MAX categories. An exception is SAV88, who is such a perfectionist that if he started working on a 30uv max run we might not live long enough to see him release a demo he's satisfied with. Either way, you just can't win.

Another exception is Qaatar. I doubt if anyone before 2010 would go for such a speedy and precise execution on CChest MAP29 (as you can see from his failed attempt where he played almost flawlessly for over 20 minutes and then suicided after falling down). Ocelot, Hi Jango, Kimo Xvirus also optimize their UV Maxes to the highest level, though UV Speed interests them more.

As for 30UVMAX, don't expect it from me. Maxkill movies are not my cup of tea (though I enjoy watching well-done, boldly played multi-level Max demos by others, such as Ian Sabourin's 2552fa01). Breaking a number of minute-barriers on a single map is much more interesting for me than completing 10 or 32 maps at a more safe pace of playing. If I'll release my first movie sometime, it will be NM Speed (for an IWAD or an UDoom PWAD), or UV Speed (for something like MM/HR).

[Revved]

Alien Vendetta
UV Fast
Map 16 in 11:46
-----------------------------------------------
This now makes the UV Fast category more filled
than the UV Speed category, as there are 8 UV
Fasts undone (av26, av27, av28, av29, av32, ce29,
hr26, hr30) as compared to 9 undone UV Speeds
(av28, av31, av31s, hr20, hr22, hr23, hr29, m228,
m2s2)

af161146.zip

[fx02]

Hi, I've finally found time to reopen ma old Doom site http://doom.com.hr/ (it was doom.gamer.hr before) and I'm hosting many demos there, also I'd like to collect all new stuff and put them there. compet-n sda, dang, whatever, just upload somehere or I can give you FTP access to upload if you have tons of demos and stuff.

bye

[Mr.TF]

I just did an ep4-0419 (ultimate doom) a few minutes ago, but the run is so ugly, i just cant share it, lol

[Archy]

Plutonia
UV Tyson
Map 11 in 6:01

pt11-601.zip

[Revved]

Alien Vendetta
UV Fast
Map 32 in 8:18
-------------------------
Thank god.....

af32-818.zip

[Archy]

OMG Tatsurd-cacocaco, I am so sorry.

I severely spelled your name wrong towards the end of the .txt file!
I'm sorry.

[Archy]

Please show it Mr.TF, we all know my demos are the ugliest, so don't feel shy....
But in all seriousness, I would like to see the demo if you don't mind.