Top 10 Worst WAD Cliches

[Pete The Padre]

exl said:

I've always wanted to use the neighbour's cat as replacement for an Imp being gibbed...

Now that would be [THX] Quality sound right there

[Doom_Dude]

Enjay said:

I dunno, are Quake textures more bland than Quake2 ones? Whatever, they are both over used IMO.

While I don't mind Quake textures used in Doom, I do agree that they seem to be overused. The thing that kinda irks me though, is when I check out a Aztec-ish map and the mesoamerican (is that the right word) textures from HeXen II are used. Not that there's a lot of Aztec-ish textures out there to choose from and not everybody can make their own textures but an Aztec level should not require a rip from Hexen 2 IMHO.

[printz]

I can't believe a cliche has been forgotten: pointing arrow sectors, usually coloured in red or blue. This is Doom, not Cameltry.

[GGG]

Pointing arrow sectors can work at certain times when the player needs indication on where to go first and would become frustrated if he had to figure it out for himself. And sometimes, arrow sectors may fit the mood better than sign sprites.

[exl]

There are more subtle ways to give attention to a certain wall or corridor or whatnot. You could place a medikit in\in front of it, or something to that extent. Using arrows of any kind is insulting to the intelligence of the player.

[Linguica]

TOILETS

[GGG]

exl said:

There are more subtle ways to give attention to a certain wall or corridor or whatnot. You could place a medikit in\in front of it, or something to that extent. Using arrows of any kind is insulting to the intelligence of the player.

Well, in most cases you could. I was actually thinking of a certain instance where it could suit the theme of the map. If there are areas in the map where certain designs on the floor already exist through sectors, then I envision an arrow would fit perfectly well. And placing a medikit (or even a trail of medikits) just wouldn't do the trick in that scenario.

But in many cases, yeah it isn't necessary to have such a device used in a map.

[Enjay]

Linguica said:

TOILETS

I was thinking that the other day whilst playing a few Thief FMs. Every level has to have an obligatory toilet. I guess in Thief, you are usually supposed to be in a house, so fair enough, but there are toilets everywhere in all FPS games it seems. I wonder, were they creeping in even before Duke 3D or was that what really kicked off the trend?

[edit]I just remembered there's an area in E2M7 that I always thought looked like a urinal.[/edit]

[Doom_Dude]

I considered putting an arrow in a map that you could only see from a distance, maybe from a high secret area, which would be pointing out a super secret or something. otherwise I don't see the point of using arrows. heh.

[BoldEnglishman]

Enjay said:

I was thinking that the other day whilst playing a few Thief FMs. Every level has to have an obligatory toilet. I guess in Thief, you are usually supposed to be in a house, so fair enough, but there are toilets everywhere in all FPS games it seems. I wonder, were they creeping in even before Duke 3D or was that what really kicked off the trend?

[edit]I just remembered there's an area in E2M7 that I always thought looked like a urinal.[/edit]

You play Thief FMs? Oh that rocks man so do I great series. I guess toilets fit under "real furniture" as mentioned in a previous cliche.

[Enjay]

BoldEnglishman said:

You play Thief FMs? Oh that rocks man so do I great series. I guess toilets fit under "real furniture" as mentioned in a previous cliche.

The quality of some of the Thief FMs is absolutely mind blowing.

Although I play Doom far far far more than Thief and have done so since the week it came out, and have modded extensively for Doom and absolutely minimally for any of the Thief games I have to say that, in some respects, I find Thief a better game than Doom. I mean, when playing Doom, I've never sat there scared to touch the controls of my computer in case I alert a nearby bad guy, or conducted conversations with the other people in the room in whispers simply because I was playing the game. And although my feelings about Thief 3 are mixed, the Shalebridge Cradle (IMO) is quite possibly one of the best, scariest, most intense levels ever in a computer game.

Although the gameplay is entirely different, I did a Thief-themed level for Heretic (using GZdoom) a while back. It's actually a reworking of an earlier level I did for Doom but this one is more complete IMO. Of course, the gameplay is very Doom/Heretic as stealth simply doesn't work with the standard Doom-style AI.

http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?id=14353

[doom2day]

Doom Dude said:

I considered putting an arrow in a map that you could only see from a distance, maybe from a high secret area, which would be pointing out a super secret or something. otherwise I don't see the point of using arrows. heh.

Arrow that leads to a trap!

[BoldEnglishman]

Yeah I've tried mapping for Doom and I've tried mapping for Thief (1 & 2 as, like Doom, the first two games are extremely similiar), and I found both to be hard :P. Mind you with Thief you've got arguably more freedom, which is better in some respects, worse in others (I mean you can't just insert a torch and it'll stick to the wall, you gotta edit the height/width/length numbers to get it exactly right, otherwise the player can see between the torch and the wall :P).

I know what you mean about atmosphere as well. Doom has practically never scared me, but Thief? Oh god some levels are just legendary... Return to the Cathedral, The Shalebridge Cradle, Bloodstone Prison and The Cure are all breath-taking, literally :).

Oh, finally, if you haven't heard about it, look around for "Thief 2X: Shadows of the Metal Age". It is another mod, but it is staggering how much effort has been put into it. Approximately 13 new complicated levels (some IMO better than the original games), new briefings, new items, old decorations/items/enemies have been re-done to look better (the barrels are no longer hexagon-shaped), new weapons, just absolutely staggering. Great fun and it's free :)

[Enjay]

BoldEnglishman said:

"Thief 2X: Shadows of the Metal Age"

Yup, got it a couple of months ago. It is a very impressive mod.

[Optimus]

Well, I never ever read the story supplied in the text file with a WAD. But a cliche would be the same old predictable story presented with Zdoom scripting, the doom guy in a spaceship, something goes wrong, everyone is dead except the doom dude, alien invasion occuring, some bad mysterious enemy left for the end boss, etc. Not that it annoys me much (several cliche mentioned here are not necessary bad but it's funny to see how originality has gone lost)

p.s. Don't get me wrong! I love crates, I love the brown sky and music theme of MAP01! And revenants, machine gun dudes and archvilles are no match for me,. but I agree those are the most annoying monsters in Doom. While I can dance with Barons, imps and Cacodemons for hours without getting any damage while enjoying kicking the crap of them slowly slowly with a plain pump shotgun, it's not the same easy with the other enemies. At least I can predict whether a homing missile or regular is coming to me from a revenant and dance around and confuse it to make it my satellite bitch, but with three or more revenants in the place and an archville far away it gets harder.

[Ichor]

Optimus said:

At least I can predict whether a homing missile or regular is coming to me from a revenant and dance around and confuse it to make it my satellite bitch...

Heh, I do that sometimes if there's enough room. Get enough of them going and you'll have your very own melee shield (as long as you don't move, that is).

[BoldEnglishman]

Ichor said:

Heh, I do that sometimes if there's enough room. Get enough of them going and you'll have your very own melee shield (as long as you don't move, that is).

I do that with the Dark Imps in KDiZD ;) (well the homing variety at least).

I would have to say (regarding to Optimus' post) that depending on the circumstances, fighting a Revenant is worse than fighting a Cyberdemon. Practically all of the Doom 1 enemies (apart from the Spider Mastermind) its just a case of circle strafing, quite easy given the room. Even with just a narrow corridor its relatively safe to just strafe from side to side so Barons and Cacodemons pose no threat at all really :P