Some playtesting requested

[exl]

I've finished a bunch of maps, all that it still needs is maybe some tweaking but most of all, playtesting. Best part is, be as critical as you can (without resorting to flaming of course).

It's set mostly in hell, the usual Doom teleport woe and despair story. It uses a lot of ambient sounds, some scripting and a few slopes here and there. Playtime is about 45-60 minutes without shortcuts. The ending credits\sequence is not complete yet, some names are missing from the images. The final statistics (secrets, monsters killed and playtime) can be seen after the ending sequence scenes.

(two imps near the start remain dormant, I'm aware of this)



Screenshots here
Requires the SVN r538 of ZDoom 2.1.7, which you can find here
11 Mb PK3 (that's the WAD file for some of you) here

[Belial]

Well, this was nice, atmospheric, on the easy side with all the health and ammo available.

Some of the secret megaspheres should be soul spheres instead, that'd fix the health balance for the most part.

In map02 the two hell knights next to the chainsaw secret open up when you enter the niche with the switch but stay dormant until you actually hit the switch, which gives you 2 HK statues to punch around.

Map03 could use more enemies at the exit portal, or less ammo in that area. You can't shoot through the corpses of the 'stone' barons. Take a look at the invulnerability secret as well, way too many secret sectors there :P I still couldn't find the last secret, there might still be another sector tagged by mistake.

Puke 666 didn't fix the stuck marine problem, which happens almost every time, not 'sometimes' to quote the txt file. The percentages in the final stats are broken, showing 0%.

The kills stat will be off anyway due to all the monsters spawned for decor in the scripted sequences.

[Antidote]

I didn't like it. There were some design flaws. You had way too many harder monsters in the earlier levels, and way too many easier monsters in the latter levels. Albeit, in more quantities, but there were easier. This of course, excludes the last level where you included just about every monster in the game.

My beef with this map is that you used too many Revenants and Pain Elementals in the first levels, which caused me to die... a lot. If you could possibly cut back on that amount, and place them, say, in the later maps, it would boost gameplay. It makes it way to hard to even experience the later levels if you're dying all the time.

I think I found a bug, although I am not sure. There is a teleporter to a secret area in MAP03, that takes you to the last area effectively skipping 3 large rooms. Because you didn't bother to place a return teleporter in the room you are warped into, you are forced to drop down to the last area. Perhaps you could fix this by closing off all the ledges making them impassible, and adding a teleporter somewhere in the room. Just a thought.

It is hard to tell if the, uhh, "Stone Barons" are invulnerable, as you give no warning to it. I wasted all my rockets and half my plasma rifle, before noticing that it didn't have a pain chance or any sign of deterioration. So in essence I spent a lot of ammo for nothing. Perhaps give some sign that they are invulnerable. Be creative, I have no suggestions there.

The architecture and atmosphere was great, and the sound was impeccable. The only problem with this map set is the gameplay being off balanced, other than that, it was great.

[gggmork]

Wow, you certainly know what you're doing. I currently lack know how to use anything other than standard doom monsters/textures/music/etc. And I've only played a small handful of maps that stray away from the standard stuff. I only played level 2 (and a bit of 1) so far. The visual of other humans fighting the war out the window with you is great. I was going to recommend just skipping the conventional difficulty increase (starting w/ former humans/etc), since most who play this will already have the skills for harder levels so might as well start with each level maxed out (but there were mancubuses and stuff on level 2 and I saw a cyberdemon on 3, so maybe nevermind). Anyway level 1 had a little bit of the 'wtf am I supposed to do' that many modern games have. Like the 1st door was dark so you wander around clicking stuff until you find it. And later it's not immediately apparent the computers act as switches, so I backtracked trying to click on walls and stuff until I figured it out (trying to find where to go/what to do next merely requires trying every combination until you find it so I regard that as irratation in the way of gameplay). It's just my personal preference that gameplay be in the immediate foreground (like hell revealed) with as little confusing unclear things as possible (similarly maze-like levels make it unclear where to go). I guess the reason is replay value; like it should remain challenging even to the designer who knows it inside/out. On the other hand level 2 was quite fun to play the first time through on the atmospheric/quest side of things. I'm just not sure if it'd be that fun the 2nd time (replay) and probably quite a bit less challenging if you know what happens already. You just chose to lean towards the atmospheric/exploring/quest side than brain frying replayable gameplay, and (level 2 so far) was excellent accomplishing that. There was a lot of darkness which *******ely makes it scarier/atmospheric but kind of hinders attack strategies. Cool slopes (not sure if it's just many sectors increased by 1 pixel or something more sophisticated).
Anyway, the unkillable (i think) lost souls were cool on level 1 and going in the warp resulted in a uknown p code (after I faced a baron) or something error twice (maybe because I don't have that additional file you mentioned or something) so I just idclev'd to level 2 (so I only the berzerk at the start which was fun). Bezerk + reverents is a good fun match. I didn't die too much, maybe not even once, I forget.

These levels are visually excellent. It was creepy going down the dark steps of blood and the wave movement is realistic with nice sploosh sounds when you step in the blood. A lot was kind of linear gameplay that would be quite similar each replay, lacking much chaos that results from randomly moving/firing monsters over a larger area that randomly hit and fight eachother/etc. The disappearing hell knight was cool (couldn't tell it disappeared unless you brought it up the steps into the light), and that time when a scream was heard and guts fly was awesome and startling. Sometimes a sort of breathing sound was heard but it was kind of confusing whether I, the player, was making it or something else, and what causes it wasn't really apparent (like it started when I entered a certain area only, and got a tad repetitive.)

[exl]

Alright, thank you guys for the feedback, some interesting stuff.
I fixed the bugs (too many secret sectors, dormant hell knights, ending percentages, marine not moving, stone bruiser stays solid and deflects shots now) and have changed the contents of most secret areas as to try and balance things out. A few monsters near the start have been replaced with lower class versions, but I kept the rest as it is; it was never meant to be easy. In that respect I removed a little bit of health from the later parts.

Also the first door opens on it's own, casting a faint light out to make that more obvious, and the computers now have big clunky switches embedded in them. If there's anything I hate it's those puzzles where you have to switch something that is practically hidden. And last the teleport secret in MAP03, you can no longer run out of the room and have to use a teleporter to return instead.
As for the kill stats being off because of spawned actors for scripted sequences, I've taken those into account. They're removed before any final tally is made, the final kill statistics should be 100% accurate.

I updated the link in my original post with the updated version, if anyone feels like taking a crack at it too.

[Belial]

In map02 I'm blocked by 3 inactive imps where the PE used to be.

So I've skipped past that with noclip, and I'd say it's more balanced now. At least the health doesn't seem excessive now.

I've ran into a funny 'problem' in map03, the cyber that's thrown out of the portal will slide down the stairs into the lava if it doesn't start firing.

I also couldn't get into the supercharge secret in the red key room, did the way it works change between versions?

With that secret visited, I still get 7/10 secrets on the automap.

Final kills were 523 out of 554 despite having killed all the monsters possible, so there must still be some loophole.

[Antidote]

I realize it was meant to be hard, but pitting you against six revenants and no super shotgun in a cramped place can be a bit impossible. That was my big complain.

Going in for a second test now.

Edit: @Belial, I'll see if it does it for me too.

Edit2: Confirmed, the imps are dormant and will not wake up.

[exl]

Belial said:
In map02 I'm blocked by 3 inactive imps where the PE used to be.

Yeah aware of that, fixed.

I've ran into a funny 'problem' in map03, the cyber that's thrown out of the portal will slide down the stairs into the lava if it doesn't start firing.

I've never had that happen before, but maybe a monster used to get in the way for me.

I also couldn't get into the supercharge secret in the red key room, did the way it works change between versions?

Yes, it should be a lot harder to find I hope.

With that secret visited, I still get 7/10 secrets on the automap.

Good, not all secrets should be obvious :)

Final kills were 523 out of 554 despite having killed all the monsters possible, so there must still be some loophole.

Hmmm ok, I'll have to try and run though killing all to make sure of that.

Antidote said:
I realize it was meant to be hard, but pitting you against six revenants and no super shotgun in a cramped place can be a bit impossible. That was my big complain.

I think at that point you should have a rocket launcher as well though, and there is a good deal of escape routes. I suppose they are usually released before all monsters in the room are killed though, the switch is sortof inbetween that, if you know what I mean.

Anyways, thanks a lot again for testing, there's only so much I can test since I know the maps inside out. Very much appreciated.