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chilvence

Icon of sin, with appendages

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Although its something of a running joke with me that I never finish a model I start, I did feel quite proud of getting this one to a fully meshed state. Its based on an old, old fan pic somewhere on this site.



Alas, its the weight of the other three tasks that usually stops me dead (uvmapping, skinning and animation). But I am having counselling for that.

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bad proportions, horrible edgeloops (or the lack of), hard to crit with a shaded view like this. Try learning an actual modeling program (i.e. not 1997-1999 quake2 only md2 tools)

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And how is it any of your business if I decide to use q2mdlr instead of blender or max or whatever? I have tried a dozen different programs, and I always reach the same conclusion; they all give you far too much more than you need, and in so doing become ugly and cluttered and I cant abide that in anything. I would just as soon replace my toolbox with a swiss army knife, thank you very much. And last time I checked, 3d models were still made out of the same triangles as ever.

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This shall be settled with a modelfight.

TO THE THUNDERDOME.

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Bank said:

This shall be settled with a modelfight.


No, I wouldn't have much of a leg to stand on, Cheapy is far more practiced at modelling than I am. I can still call him a snobby git though :P

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chilvence said:

And how is it any of your business if I decide to use q2mdlr instead of blender or max or whatever?


That's as pathetic as sticking to BASIC for a programming language and not moving on to anything more advanced. You'll never improve skills by using extremely limited and outdated software.

chilvence said:

And last time I checked, 3d models were still made out of the same triangles as ever.


What modeler with an amount of skill models by the triangle nowadays, anyhow? QUADS FTW

But whatever, suit yourself, bad artwork forever.

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Come on. You're just being indignant because I tried to make one of your precious gargoyles, aren't you :P

There are things in this world that I couldn't possibly dream of approaching without winning the lottery and devoting every minute of my time to practice and study. Incidentally, I was having a browse of a zbrush forum earlier and found it to be shocking.

Therefore, I don't try to. I use the tools that suit me and anything I learn is a bonus. When I started out, it pained me to make simple trees and pots and weapons. I myself am something of a joke to me at that time, and I am sure that this here will seem a joke to me another few months from now. But I don't point the finger and go 'ah-ha', to me nor anyone else!

You may find it amusing that I am stuck in my ways. Do you think I am that stupid that I enjoy being sentimentally attached to a piece of crap tool that crashes if you dont love it well? When I do find a new tool that suits my purpose, I shall be very happy indeed. It wont be because of your helpful advice though, I can guarantee that.

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chilvence said:

Come on. You're just being indignant because I tried to make one of your precious gargoyles, aren't you :P


Oh them's fightin' words boy.

I don't model at all. I've seen a lot of Cheapy's work and it's all very good. I thought that Chilvence's stuff was ok, but not as good as Cheapy's. Doesn't mean that it's bad just different and unpolished.

Now if you want a biased opinion on pixel art or traditional pencil work then that's a different story.

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Hmm...yeah - I often think I should take a step away from 3d modelling altogether, and focus on just being able to draw well, clear and proportionately. I don't find it as fun as computer art, because you have to have paper and stuff at hand. But theres alot to be said for it developing your overall arty knowledge.

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not bad. with the legs that short and trunk that long, I would assume it would move better on all fours than on two legs. I would say make the legs longer if you want a towering beast. it's a good start.

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Point taken to heart, the legs do actually look lots and lots better after a slight scaling. However, the gangly look and the oversize head is more of an on purpose thing - the intention was to make it look very sick and emaciated. That would have to be skinned to really be convincing though. This is actually a hastily edited cousin of hexen's death wyvern, if that helps conjure up the image for you.

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Looks like a minotaur. A skinny one, with wings and visible spine. I don't think it would be appropriate for Doom 2, fighting through demons, only to end up with an animal-face.

I'm not flaming your work or anything, it's just that you could make it fatter/more muscular. Give it that grin, too. For an example, see a specific monster in Knee-Deep in ZDoom, whose head seamlessly looks like the Doom 2 boss.

And leileilol, what about drawing your IconofSin model, and showing it here?

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Well, you're right on the nose with your description - its really just a winged skeleton with hoved feet.

But then I don't really know if I could say what would be appropriate for a Doom 2 boss. Certainly not a big wall texture though.

The grin is there by the way, its unfortunately lost in the flatness of it all.

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It's a nice looking monster, I like the spiked tail especially, but it doesn't say 'Baphomet' to me. It'd make a good 'generic' demon though. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I always liked him just fine as a wall hanging.

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MmM said:

but I always liked him just fine as a wall hanging.

That's because you've never seen him in game in other shapes?

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I'll certainly take any suggestions on what he should be, maybe I will want to start the idea afresh in future.

One thing I would like to argue though, is that most of the doom monster classes are hardly even vaguely similair to any of the others (except of course the obvious clones like the zombies). You have fatty, floating blobbies, pinkies, bruisers, imps, lanky alien looking things, giant skeletons, brains on stilts... While this does make you wonder how they organise the seating at dinner parties, its always been a good thing in my opinion. And with that said, I think I could just have easily made him into a giant worm with a goat head and still fit the context of the game :)

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I think this is the first model for DOOM that actually gets my attention.

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I do like the skeletal body. It would look great with ragged flesh and sinew hanging off of it. I have personally never pictured the Icon of Sin having a body in that kind of form. I always pictured the goat head attached to an exposed spine coming out of a mass of flesh composed of twisted bodies of humans, animals and demons suspended in midair by sinew attached to the floor and ceiling, with several massive tentacles coming from that main body. his body would not be mobile, but he could move his head around and attack physically with it. I am gonna have to try to draw that someday.

chilvence said:

While this does make you wonder how they organise the seating at dinner parties


LOL, would former humans sit at the little demons table?

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chilvence said:

I'll certainly take any suggestions on what he should be, maybe I will want to start the idea afresh in future.

One thing I would like to argue though, is that most of the doom monster classes are hardly even vaguely similair to any of the others (except of course the obvious clones like the zombies). You have fatty, floating blobbies, pinkies, bruisers, imps, lanky alien looking things, giant skeletons, brains on stilts... While this does make you wonder how they organise the seating at dinner parties, its always been a good thing in my opinion. And with that said, I think I could just have easily made him into a giant worm with a goat head and still fit the context of the game :)


You do make some good points about the variety present in Doom monster anatomy. I've always thought that, full-body, Baphomet would look something like a Baron of Hell/Hell Knight or Cyberdemon, as it's got the satyr/goatman thing going on, at least head-wise. I prefer to think of him as just a giant noggin, with perhaps some vital organs tucked away unseen, stuck in a wall though--some kind of biomechanical demon CPU or something (or a super-extravagant, giant helmet for John Romero's decapitated head). Granted, that's not terribly creative or imaginative. You're certainly correct that, for all anybody knows, it could have the body of a worm or something really exotic. Ultimately, it's your work. Don't let me, or anyone else, sway you if that's how you feel Baphomet should look.

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Bank said:

The wings are a turn off. The waist is actually too thin.

Apparently the pressure of Hollywood models has gotten to underworld leaders. Don't purge! We like you the way you are, IoS.

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heh...

It's actually the other way around, its the supermodels who all want to look like our dark demon spitting overlord. Not burdened with an actual stomach or digestive tract to speak of, he can easily maintain his extra slim figure.


Yes I am sorry the wings look a bit shit. They were only meant to be two sided polies, and it certainly doesnt translate well to a 3d rendering. Thats why I said test...

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Don't listen to the nay-sayers chiv, this model oozes character. Just needs polishing.

There are some minor proportion issues though (decrease the scale of everything from the bottom of the ribcage downwards).

I must say its looks good considering it was pulled out the ass of Q2mdlr.

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Well, I'm glad you think so.

I have been looking for something I can use to animate all my characters for the longest time, and now that I've actually got used to using blender, it seems like some of my projects might finally get some forward momentum. For one thing, I can finally stop juggling between formats... and there are some helpful uvmapping tools and rigging abilities in blender that I never gave it credit for before.

The fact that someone recently added in the sculpt mode though, is the biggest point of attraction. Now I can finally have some fun with this high poly modelling fad thats been going since Doom 3...

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Note that Bank is right about the waist. It's too thin, like it's gonna fall anytime due to wind, or with a more powerful Great Sword I'll just cut it in two.

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