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master lockwolf

IDL Season IV Signups are on

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I find it amusing that people with once strong opinions about zdaemon no longer seem to give a shit.

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exp(x) said:
I find it amusing that people with once strong opinions about zdaemon no longer seem to give a shit.

I don't. Most "friction" is or was in regard to the ZDaemon staff, and this isn't being managed by them.

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exp(x) said:

I find it amusing that people with once strong opinions about zdaemon no longer seem to give a shit.

IDL is played on private servers that do not communicate to the main ZDaemon master and are thus not obligated to use the master banlist.

It's quite silly that the IDL has to resort to such measures, but ZDaemon appears to be their only option, since apparently Skulltag isn't up to snuff even with the addition of demo recording and Odamex still has quite a ways to go. Such is the state of multiplayer Doom in 2008, ten full years after the source release.

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AlexMax said:

It's quite silly that the IDL has to resort to such measures, but ZDaemon appears to be their only option, since apparently Skulltag isn't up to snuff even with the addition of demo recording

How isn't Skulltag up to snuff?

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Anyway, as to prevent any source port wars on account of what we've been using allow me to give a little bit of history of the IDL.

When I began planning for IDL in the Winter of 2006 Odamex was just announced but not even released yet (first release dated January 18th, 2007). When I began the league it had 8 teams and 24 active players (3 per team). The winter 2007 season was basically a test to see if a league of this kind could be successfully run and how, if at all, the community would accept or embrace the idea. My own personal hopes were that Odamex was going to be ready for competitive play by the summer and perhaps the league could move in that direction.

Unfortunately, Odamex was not ready for competitive play by the summer (and still isn't for that matter).

This left me with the choice of either not continuing to run the IDL or continue to expand because I now had over fifty people that wanted to sign up for the second season. Though IDL is played on ZDaemon, the servers we've used are private, unadvertised to the master, and donated by server admins who also see merit in the idea and the league.

The IDL has now had three highly successful seasons and hopefully will have a fourth this summer. When the IDL was created, it was created with the primary purpose of bringing players who would not normally associate themselves with each other together and strengthening the DOOM player base. The fact that players became more competitive and practiced more, etc etc was simply a byproduct.

The IDL was created to bring people together, not divide them. Following in this spirit, there's no reason to cause a source port argument in any capacity here.

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I'm really not trying to start any sort of source port argument. I honestly don't care; I don't work on Skulltag anymore. Alex just said something about Skulltag not being up to snuff, and I was just curious what his reasoning was. If Skulltag isn't used, I could care less. Don't most of the people who participate in the IDL use ZDaemon anyway?

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Nah, I've left again so that I can work on another project. I haven't publicized it very much though, since I still enjoy being active in the community. Rivecoder is running the show now.

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I completely understand why odamex is not used; however, it would be nice to see more IDL involvement in bug testing and reporting.

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Carnevil said:

How isn't Skulltag up to snuff?


Good question, if you ask me Skulltag is light-years ahead of ZDaemon.

I'm not trying to troll, I'm simply going on what I've been told by people who play in the IDL. As for details, I asked once but their reasoning was so totally obnoxious or idiotic that I've mentally blocked their responses out of my head and can't recall their reasoning offhand.

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Well, I'm sure everyone can figure. Probably nothing one hasn't heard before. (not necessarily in a discussion about ports, but just about everything)

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Some maps can have an entirely different strategy based on the ports, namely due to certain features available in SkullTag vs ZDaemon. I mainly focus on the jumping ability. In Skulltag players can jump a good distance furthar than ZDaemon, which may seem insignificant at first, but can make HUGE differences in maps like ZDCTF Map26, where the trick jump from the Blue armor can be performed in reverse with a regular jump in ST but cannot in ZD. Even more commonplace maps like Something Epic can be changed by bigger trick jumps. My biggest qualm with ZD being the port used is the lack of 32 player support when it comes to spectators. One undeniable fact is that out of all the Multiplayer Doom Ports, ZD has the most IDL regulars, and the usuage of any other port would not allow most competitors to play at their best.

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TheMionicDonut said:

Some maps can have an entirely different strategy based on the ports, namely due to certain features available in SkullTag vs ZDaemon. I mainly focus on the jumping ability. In Skulltag players can jump a good distance furthar than ZDaemon, which may seem insignificant at first, but can make HUGE differences in maps like ZDCTF Map26, where the trick jump from the Blue armor can be performed in reverse with a regular jump in ST but cannot in ZD. Even more commonplace maps like Something Epic can be changed by bigger trick jumps. My biggest qualm with ZD being the port used is the lack of 32 player support when it comes to spectators. One undeniable fact is that out of all the Multiplayer Doom Ports, ZD has the most IDL regulars, and the usuage of any other port would not allow most competitors to play at their best.

Have you tried turning on the "limited movement in the air" compatflag in Skulltag?

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The great majority of IDL players are mainly ZD players, and it's true, for that level of serious business competitive play if you were playing with ST or Odamex there would be a lot of bitching and alienation of the main base. While I personally disagree with ZDaemon being the IDL port, I cannot deny that CTF on ST, Odamex, and ZDaemon feel completely different, and the choice of ZDaemon being the port used is probably a good one.

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Shaikoten said:

The great majority of IDL players are mainly ZD players, and it's true, for that level of serious business competitive play if you were playing with ST or Odamex there would be a lot of bitching and alienation of the main base.


A community of diehards sticking with an outdated source port? Now where have we heard this before...

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