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Doom Marine

Election '08


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Enjay said:
The McCain camp in particular, the candidates, the rhetoric, everything seems to be styled after a small scale, feuding, backwards, inbred, tin-pot little country, not a bunch of people vying for the most powerful job in the world.

His campaign seems to be representing that style... partly at his own chagrin, because having to reject the worst of it doesn't make him look good. You can see it in his choice of a VP with a small-town attitude.

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ive noticed that obama is kind of socialist... /communist...

and AMERICA of all places is voting for him to win!

dont take this post super seriously btw, im just pointing out that its kind of ironic that the commy-hating USA is about to elect the very thing they hated 50 years ago to run the country.

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Butts said:

ive noticed that obama is kind of socialist... /communist...


Only stupid Americans think Democratic socialism is synonymous with Communism.

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Butts said:

ive noticed that obama is kind of socialist... /communist...

and AMERICA of all places is voting for him to win!

dont take this post super seriously btw, im just pointing out that its kind of ironic that the commy-hating USA is about to elect the very thing they hated 50 years ago to run the country.

You should be more worried about the fact that he's a leprechaun.

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To some Americans anything but absolute free market economy where public spending on anything that isn't directly profitable or somehow benefits "the market" immediately is "communism". That is, they uphold stuff "libertarians" spout because they don't really need to administer nations, which allows them to support idealistic and retrograde economic theory, as if the United States were some small town business endeavor.

Obama is a center or center-left politician according to US standards (which are relatively to the right in comparison to those of many other countries). He definitely isn't a communist, and isn't even a socialist. He now espouses, during his campaign (how much of this is to be applied will be seen), some socialistic policies, such as more general (possibly universal) medical coverage. Stuff like this already exists in various free market oriented countries, of course. If Obama is anything like a communist then Europe is lead by Leon Trotsky, or something.

If he were anywhere near communism he wouldn't be considering maintaining the embargo on Cuba. Even Cuba itself isn't communist.

He's as much a communist as he's a Muslim. Probably less, if that is possible.

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Guest DILDOMASTER666

If McCain wins, my family has agreed that we will move to another country.

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Come to Canada. There should be a short window before the death throes of USA's economy bring Canada's down with it.

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fraggle said:

You should be more worried about the fact that he's a leprechaun.


Why did I hear Krusty's laugh at the end of that video?

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well since he is a leprechaun he lost my vote!

but kidding aside, he has very socialist views, with universal health care and taxing people who make decent amounts of money quite a bit more, and providing welfare, which in my opinion is pretty horrendous. i know its typical democrat views, but a lot of that stuff i do not agree with. i dont want my hard earned cash going to a family of people that sit on their asses waiting for there government check, and yes, i realize there are examples of when welfare is good, but i personally know people who do that. the spreading of the wealth is very socialist, almost to the point of communism.

however, i honestly think that with either mccain or obama, USA can only improve at this point.

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You do realize this, right?

He's cutting taxes for 95% of America. 5% sees an increase. oh no stop the socialism. The taxes on the upper class in this country have done nothing but go down for like 25+ years. McCain is just using the term "socialist" as a red flag of fear. All he has to do is spew out a bunch of nonsense that gets people worried if he even wants to come close to winning.

There are a lot of people that are against welfare (lots of people I know plus many Americans). I'd like to point out that welfare isn't even enough to live on. There's a cut off after several years in most states, I believe. It's not really a ride on the gravy train. In the grand scheme of things, there are many people in this country that start off farther behind than others. Early childhood development, education, parents, economic mobility, job availability, etc all play a role in determining how successful you are going to be in life. When you are at the bottom, it's hard as hell to climb up. If you start off in the middle, for example, it's much easier (comparatively) to meet your needs and save money.

There's about 50 million people in this country that are uninsured. Something has to be done and leaving it completely to the insurance companies has led to some pretty nasty situations. Reform is needed and McCain doesn't seem to have any new material to run with. He's pretty much dedicated to upholding the status quo in all situations.

And also, what myk said.

edit: grammar

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Butts said:

but kidding aside, he has very socialist views, with universal health care and taxing people who make decent amounts of money quite a bit more, and providing welfare, which in my opinion is pretty horrendous. i know its typical democrat views, but a lot of that stuff i do not agree with. i dont want my hard earned cash going to a family of people that sit on their asses waiting for there government check, and yes, i realize there are examples of when welfare is good, but i personally know people who do that. the spreading of the wealth is very socialist, almost to the point of communism.


I really don't understand this American way of thinking.

There's all this honkey tonkey touting of Americans and how awesome you are and that you should support the troops and etc. But if anyone suggest something humane like free health care for everyone. Then that's horrendous? What is it that is so horrendous with working together to build a better stronger society?
It's the poor people who make the rich people richer. Is it such a horrible thought that the rich people shell out more taxes to help the poor people to get some social security for themselves and their children?

You're the only country that I keep hearing such hypcritical nonsense from.
Americans are great, the greatest people of the world... except those Americans over there. They suck and they don't deserve what we got. Cause they don't have the money/opinions/belief/color we do.

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i meant welfare was horrendous. i wasnt trying to imply that free health care was horrendous, as it would certainly be nice, BUT with the current state of things, insurance companies own health care... and they dictate what happens pretty much. and its not that the rich should stay rich, i just dont want my family getting taxed further than we already are being taxed.

and also, how do you think rich people got rich in the first place? spending the little money they started out with and earned on drugs and alcohol? have numerous children? sit on their asses and hope they get rich? to become rich in the first place it takes discipline and self sacrifice, thats just the way it is. its also only your opinion that america is just a bunch of hypocritical retards.

oh and did i state anything about race or beliefs, or opinions? its what makes us as people unique. you also certainly have a knack for taking any words i use, twist it into a meaning that gives you a moral higher ground to stand on to attack me with your better beliefs than mine, and you also seem to like to add things that make me look like a worse person, to help your argument. way to go make a fallacy here.

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First, I can assure you that it's not only my opinion. Even many Americans agree with that.

Not to mention that I find it intriguing that a nation so smack filled with Christians don't agree with anything Jesus advocated. I'd say that's for another thread, but since USA have started to look more like the Islamic nations in the middle east for the last decades (where state and religion twined together into one big intolerant mess). It's not off topic.

Ok, so you oppose welfare. because anyone who needs welfare in America must be a lazy son of a bitch, and not some poor sod who lost everything in an economic crisis because of a bunch of rich people fucked him over.
You also seem to be of the illusion that ever rich person has had to work for it. I see a glaring flaw in your argument, and that flaw is sitting in the oval office of the white house.

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I have a US passport, and I say that most Americans are fat, ignorant mouth breathing retards who can't even vote for the correct candidate for the past fucking eight years.

The uneducated trailer trash hicks who screams "Ay-Rab!" and "'Terrists!" are the ones who stands to benefit most from universal health care, education reform, and tax breaks for households making under $250,000. Yet instead of improving their living standards, these gun-toting, NASCAR attending faggots are bought into the paranoia that terrorists might nuke their water tower in the middle of boonytown if we don't declare war on brown people. Vote for Bush!

The cost of a fucking million dollar Tomahawk cruise missile to bomb some mudbrick bunker could've went to buy five houses in America, or eight lifetimes of health coverage... or renewable energy research that would've steered us away from the terrorist-filled dust bowl known as the Middle East. National Security Issue solved.

Stupidity is disgusting.

I'm glad I live in the better part of America that values well-being over picking fight with a foe that can't be seen and can't be won. The red states can go and fuck themselves.

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alexz721 said:

My God Butts, take a sociology course or something. Please.


I concur.

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why, because you don't like my opinion? not everyone agrees, you know.

The uneducated trailer trash hicks who screams "Ay-Rab!" and "'Terrists!" are the ones who stands to benefit most from universal health care, education reform, and tax breaks for households making under $250,000. Yet instead of improving their living standards, these gun-toting, NASCAR attending faggots are bought into the paranoia that terrorists might nuke their water tower in the middle of boonytown if we don't declare war on brown people. Vote for Bush!


sad part is, thats true.

First, I can assure you that it's not only my opinion. Even many Americans agree with that.

i don't doubt it.

Not to mention that I find it intriguing that a nation so smack filled with Christians don't agree with anything Jesus advocated. I'd say that's for another thread, but since USA have started to look more like the Islamic nations in the middle east for the last decades (where state and religion twined together into one big intolerant mess). It's not off topic.

Ok, so you oppose welfare. because anyone who needs welfare in America must be a lazy son of a bitch, and not some poor sod who lost everything in an economic crisis because of a bunch of rich people fucked him over.


people thinking that state and religion are twined together are basically that aforementioned scenario that doom marine stated.

its not a regular hard-working family rich people that fucked over the "unfortunate" people, its corporate businesses and ridiculous policies that fucked people over. im not saying that everyone who has welfare doesnt deserve it, because some people who are disabled and cannot physically perform tasks etc. actually need it, but they should not be living on their own in the first place.

The cost of a fucking million dollar Tomahawk cruise missile to bomb some mudbrick bunker could've went to buy five houses in America


or the cost of a really shitty house where i live (1 story, 3 rooms, but the location is good)

also, if i worked hard for my money, why the fuck would i want to just hand it out to someone?

I'm glad I live in the better part of America that values well-being over picking fight with a foe that can't be seen and can't be won. The red states can go and fuck themselves.

because thats what being republican is about. yeah, obviously blue states are the right way to go for the entire world, there is no other truth. you are all promoting your "better" political views in very much the same way christians would preach and spread the word about how much better they were than other religions, its the same damn thing.

come on, flame away any day. ill be back when there are like 30 responses calling me a moron, idiot, etc. and personally attacking me and my views.

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Butts said:
its not a regular hard-working family rich people that fucked over the "unfortunate" people, its corporate businesses and ridiculous policies that fucked people over.

The corporate businesses are made by the cream of the crop of working people (among others) that have accumulated a lot of money. They are the top result of the free market model. These luckier or shrewder people may think government subsides to education, transport or medicine that may have allowed you to develop and maintain a decent living style with your hard work is a "waste" the same way you're saying welfare may be a waste. Besides, by what you are saying, you should definitely consider what Obama plans to do in respect to taxes. See here.

im not saying that everyone who has welfare doesnt deserve it, because some people who are disabled and cannot physically perform tasks etc. actually need it, but they should not be living on their own in the first place.

Welfare isn't charity in a market driven society. If it's acting in such a stagnating manner it is being applied with a bad policy. The idea is to encourage labor, economic activity and social development. People who do not want to live in a society formed by many broken down ghettos surrounding a few isolated urban islands for the rich use public spending, including welfare, to generate a base where citizens may have chances to give worth to their efforts.

People who love their country and are wary of the misuse of welfare should make an effort to ensure it is regulated to be productive and fair, as opposed to rejecting it blindly.

because thats what being republican is about.

Not necessarily, but it does seem like McCain's campaign is veering towards that image. Voters cross party lines anyway, which is part of what makes one candidate win over the other.

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I saw this today and I thought it was too funny to pass up.

Him - "I don't like [Obama]. Even the colors in his posters are communist. Like China."

Me - "The poster of his face in my window?" *points to iconic "hope" poster*

Him - "Yeah."

Me - "That poster has three colors, Mark. What are they?"

Him - "Blue and.... red. And white."

Me - "..."

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Butts said:

well since he is a leprechaun he lost my vote!

but kidding aside, he has very socialist views, with universal health care and taxing people who make decent amounts of money quite a bit more, and providing welfare, which in my opinion is pretty horrendous. i know its typical democrat views, but a lot of that stuff i do not agree with. i dont want my hard earned cash going to a family of people that sit on their asses waiting for there government check, and yes, i realize there are examples of when welfare is good, but i personally know people who do that. the spreading of the wealth is very socialist, almost to the point of communism.

I think it's best not to be fundamentalist about these kind of issues; it's a matter of being pragmatic and choosing a sensible place somewhere in the middle that makes sense. For example, I agree that money shouldn't just be given by the government to people if they will make no effort to support themselves. It is easy to take socialism too far and to fall into the trap of introducing policies that allow this kind of situation.

However, I think *some* degree of socialism is useful and a good thing. Healthcare is one example. While capitalism is mostly a fair and sensible system, it's important to always remember why it's a good idea it in the first place; ie. to motivate people to work and contribute to society. The idea, though, that someone can fall ill and die from being unable to afford a doctor or treatment seems barbaric for a modern society.

I write this from a country (ie. England) where the government health service is pretty poor. But at least there is always something to support you if the worst does happen and you have no other choice.

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Oh brother:
http://wvgazette.com/News/200810180380

"I pushed buttons and they all came up Republican," she said. "I hit Obama and it switched to McCain. I am really concerned about that. If McCain wins, there was something wrong with the machines.

"I asked them for a printout of my votes," Ketchum said. "But they said it was in the machine and I could not get it. I did not feel right when I left the courthouse. My son felt the same way.

Virginia Matheney, one of those voters, said Friday, "When I touched the screen for Barack Obama, the check mark moved from his box to the box indicating a vote for John McCain."

Retired factory worker Calvin Thomas of Ripley said he experienced the same problem.

"When I pushed Obama, it jumped to McCain. When I went down to governor's office and punched [Gov. Joe] Manchin, it went to the other dude.

"After I finished, my daughter voted. When she pushed Obama, it went to McCain. It happened to her the same way it happened to me," Thomas said.


I have no words but this... Electronic voting machines, especially with uncalibrated touchscreens, have no place in the voting booth.

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somewhere in the middle


which is where i fall, and i really hate how presidential candidates are so black and white (no pun intended) about the issues, clear cut democrat or republican. the other third party candidates are so radical, even if i wanted to not vote for either mccain or obama, i would not vote for any third party candidates.

The idea, though, that someone can fall ill and die from being unable to afford a doctor or treatment seems barbaric for a modern society.

then why aren't our taxes going towards health care instead of having to buy all this insurance (when i say our im talking about america)? im pretty sure that some other countries do that.

what Obama plans to do in respect to taxes


obama has better figures in that and looks like he will be more likely to pay off debts with that. im just glad i wont be taxed an extra 700,000 dollars. (or 100,000)


and voting machines dont have confirmation boxes?

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Csonicgo said:

I have no words but this... Electronic voting machines, especially with uncalibrated touchscreens, have no place in the voting booth.

<cynical> I'm betting there's nothing wrong with the touchscreens - the machines are just following their programming. The lack of an audit trail (a major complaint during the last election) means there's no way to dispute the tally. There's no place for electronic voting machines in "free and fair elections".

From Csonicgo's linked article- She said she caught the mistake, called over a worker in the county clerk's office and was able to correct her vote. But she worries other voters may not catch such a mistake.

So much for "secret ballots"! </cynical>

Butts said:

Then why aren't our taxes going towards health care instead of having to buy all this insurance?

Most likely because for-profit hospitals can make more money from insured patients than from Medicare.

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My family sealed the deal with Obama, all four of us. Not that it matters in liberal Washington anyway... you know what, fuck the electoral college... having an electoral college just means some backwards redneck states have more voice than deserved when they really should just shut the fuck up.

I'm angry, and will stay angry until we have a black president. ARGH

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All I know is McCain is an old crusty moron who is opposed to net neutrality, which honestly, is enough in of itself for me to vote obama.

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Csonicgo said:

"When I pushed Obama, it jumped to McCain. When I went down to governor's office and punched [Gov. Joe] Manchin, it went to the other dude.

Haha, when I first read that I thought it meant that he was so pissed off at being a victim of rigged machines that he went to the Governor's office and punched him in the face.

But seriously, if they're being so obvious with their rigging of the elections this year, that's fucked up. I'll never vote with a fucking machine. In Washington, all we have now are absentee ballots, which seem to work excellently. Only allegation of voter fraud was the stupid Rossi vs. Gregoire election 4 years ago. IMHO they both suck, I didn't vote for either one, and I'm just brimming with joy that they're going for a rematch again this year. God damn it. Just bring Gary Locke back.

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