Pros and cons of each Port.

[Ninjalah]

Ok, since I've only made one and a half less than par maps, i thought that i should maybe try different ports. I was wondering if you guys can give me the Pros and Cons of different ports? I use GZdoom, and i think its pretty good, but from other posts, im not sure if its the best.

[Patrick]

GZDoom is a fantastic port simply due to the volume of available editing features and customization. Definitely the best GL port for sure.

Eternity is an excellent choice. The only drawback is lack of hardware rendering, but who needs that anyways?

EDGE has scripting capabilities much like Eternity and GZDoom.

[Jodwin]

Patrick said:

Definitely the best GL port for sure.

GLboom+, depending on what you want.

[Gez]

Ninjalah said:

im not sure if its the best.

There's no best. There's a vast offering which fill different niches.

- Chocolate Doom is as accurate to the original Doom engine as possible, with very few extra features (which just allow to bypass the need for external tools like dehacked, deutex, nwt or novert; so they're actually not extra features as far as gameplay and modding are concerned). It supports only Doom and Chex Quest, but Chocolate Heretic and Chocolate Hexen are in the works.

- ZDoom is a feature rich port which is very accessible to modders. Most port-specific mods nowadays are made for ZDoom or one of its children. It supports all Doom engine games: Doom, Heretic, Hexen, Strife, Chex Quest.

- GZDoom is ZDoom with undistorted, hardware-accelerated 3D.

- Skulltag is GZDoom with a client/server netcode and an integrated resource pack adding more stuff.

- Eternity is a promising port which might become as popular as ZDoom soon. For now, it only supports Doom and partially Heretic, but Hexen is planned for later.

- Doomsday is a series of port for Doom, Heretic and Hexen. It has a nice hardware renderer, with more graphic features than GZDoom's, but is less easy to mod than the ZDoom family.

- PrBoom+ is strictly for Doom but is able to emulate many versions of the original doom executables and of the early Boom port. For this reason, it's a favorite for recording and playing demos.

- GLBoom+ is the same thing as PrBoom+, but with a hardware renderer.

Those are the big ones currently.

[Ninjalah]

Damn.
But lets say if i save a map using GZdoom, can i play it on skulltag or even chocolate doom?

[Patrick]

As far as flexiblity is concerned, EDGE, GZDoom, ZDoom and Eternity offer the most editing features, especially ZDoom branches (GZDoom, Skulltag, ZDaemon, ScoreDoom)

There are TONS of Doom ports, to name a few:

Legacy: Kinda outdated and buggy, but supports 3D models, FraggleScript and Hardware rendering. Worth a look if for no reason other than playing Nimrod.

Risen3D: Again, much like Legacy, only it still is getting updates and is not nearly as buggy. Has an impressive library of 3D models and maps. Not nearly as felxible as ZDoom ports, but still worth a look

Doom64EX: Faithfully recreates the original Doom 64 engine and behavior, it's relatively new and is still in development, but one could go crazy with some of it's lighting features

Ninjalah said:

Damn.
But lets say if i save a map using GZdoom, can i play it on skulltag or even chocolate doom?

A GZDoom map may be able to run in Skulltag, definitely not chocolate doom.

[Gez]

Ninjalah said:

But lets say if i save a map using GZdoom

GZDoom is not a map editor. No Doom port is a map editor. If you want to save a map, use something like Doom Builder 2 instead.

[Ninjalah]

Gez said:

GZDoom is not a map editor. No Doom port is a map editor. If you want to save a map, use something like Doom Builder 2 instead.

Oh no i know this. My question was if i saved a map using the Gzdoom as a base (for Doom Builder 2).

[CodeImp]

There are 3 map formats for Doom: Doom format, Hexen format and the relatively new UDMF format. Almost every sourceport can read the Doom and Hexen formats, but the features in the form of actions and effects are different. The UDMF format is currently only for ZDoom-based sourceports (ZDoom, GZDoom and Skulltag) and Vavoom.

The only features that really formed into what you could call a 'standard' are the vanilla Doom actions/effects and Boom actions/effects. Most sourceports support these features and they behave the same for most sourceports (though each sourceport may have an exception or two). If you use any other (port-specific) features, you are limiting your map to that sourceport only. With ZDoom this means that you could likely play it with GZDoom as well, because they are closely related and kept up-to-date. Skulltag too, but that one is more outdated, so it does not always have the latest ZDoom features/fixes.

The title of the configurations in Doom Builder tells you what you are going to make your map for and in what format it will be saved (if the format is not explicitly stated in the title, it is saved in the format intended for the sourceport that the configuration is for). Aside from that, the configuration also determine the features you can work with. If you want to make a map for ZDoom-based sourceport, choose one of the ZDoom configs. If you want to make a map that works on pretty much every sourceport, choose (Ultimate) Doom, Doom 2 or Boom. If you want to use the features of the Eternity engine (which limits your map to Eternity sourceport only), pick an Eternity config.

[NoWits]

Doomsday (or jDoom) has ONLY vanila editing features but looks fantastic.

ZDoom is definitely the most feature rich - search on KDiZD to see just how feature rich.

GZDoom is OpenGL ZDoom - it also supports 3D floors, dynamic lighting and models. This could be awesome like jDoom with high res textures, and models, and as feature-rich as ZDoom. That would make the ultimate source port. Until then, I would recommend ZDoom for a more faithful Doom experience.

Chocolate Doom is just Vanilla Doom for Windows. Good for testing maps to make sure they're Vanilla compatible. But also it has a few more control options and such than vanilla Doom.

PrBoom is an awesome source port. it stays true to the original and adds more editing features. It has all features from Boom and MBF. Additionally, it can do things that ZDoom can't, like change the invulnerability colour map (I know Nuts and HacX do this).

Uhhh what else? Oh yeah, EDGE sucks. Don't go near it. It makes the music out of tune and the texture filtering is blocky on one side and fuzzy on the other. Not recommended AT ALL.

ZDaemon is based on really old ZDoom and is really meant for online play.

And that's about all I know. Bye!

[Super Jamie]

Personally, I like to distinguish between Vanilla, Boom-compatible, and other ports.

Boom adds alot of bugfixes and extra actions to the original codebase, and was a defacto standard for many years. PrBoom, Eternity and jDoom are probably the most popular modern Boom ports.

ZDoom does a similar thing, but for the Hexen mapping format. It is compatible with most (but not all) of the Boom changes and fixes. Note that ZDoom also changes the game physics, so for instance the chainsaw has a different range and demos recorded with Vanilla will desync in ZDoom.

Most people can run a ZDoom port today, I'd go as far as to say it's a new de-facto standard.

There is no real "best" port, it depends on your needs. If you want over 9000 monsters on the screen at once, you're probably going to limit yourself to GlBoom+. If you need 3D sectors and slopes and scripting, I'd suggest GZDoom. You can do this in Legacy but nobody really maps for that much anymore.

My suggestion would be to read the wikis (Doom, ZDoom and Eternity) and learn as much about the engines and their development path as possible. Watch some videos, play some maps and open them in Editors. This is what I did, and I have a fairly good understanding.

Considering you're a new mapper, I'd also suggest to learn to crawl before you walk. Stick to Vanilla or Boom format until you learn about detailing and flow and balance. Post your maps to free hosting sites (Megaupload, etc) and make a thread asking for suggestions here before filling idgames with more "my frist map"s. A crappy GZDoom-only level with 3D and slopes and GL lighting and scripting is still a crappy level.

Edit: However, I would also recommend testing your maps with as many ports as possible. Some things do break between ports that shouldn't, but you can almost always work around it.

[esselfortium]

Super Jamie said:

Considering you're a new mapper, I'd also suggest to learn to crawl before you walk. Stick to Vanilla or Boom format until you learn about detailing and flow and balance. Post your maps to free hosting sites (Megaupload, etc) and make a thread asking for suggestions here before filling idgames with more "my frist map"s. A crappy GZDoom-only level with 3D and slopes and GL lighting and scripting is still a crappy level.

I agree with this, though I'd have probably phrased it more like "learn to walk before you go hopping off the nearest cliff". :)

[Gez]

CodeImp said:

There are 3 map formats for Doom: Doom format, Hexen format and the relatively new UDMF format. Almost every sourceport can read the Doom and Hexen formats, but the features in the form of actions and effects are different.

Pretty sure any Doom-only (or Heretic-only, or Strife-only) port will not read a map in Hexen format. That leaves just the ZDoom family, Vavoom and Eternity.

Nixot said:

Doomsday (or jDoom) has ONLY vanila editing features but looks fantastic.

For mapping features, yes. However, it has other modding features, with its DED lumps which serve the same purpose as EDGE's DDF, Remood's RMOD, Eternity's EDF or ZDoom's DECORATE.

[Ninjalah]

Ok, I've made my first two maps with the Gzdoom base, hope im not getting ahead of myself :D

[Vermil]

Nixot said:

Doomsday (or jDoom) has ONLY vanila editing features but looks fantastic.

Incorrect. Doomsday has loads of additional mapping features over Vanilla Doom. Though admittedly because of the rewrite of the engine they are currently a little basic in some areas compared to other ports (i.e they've fallen behind other ports).

However the way they work prevents the creation of something like a DB editing config...

For instance with Doomsday's XG, you create your own line/sector types from scratch.

For instance you select one or more activation requirements from the available ones such as the player must "use" the line along with additional activation requirements such as having the Red Keycard and Blue Skull card etc etc.

For instance below is an "armour charger" "chain". You place the activation line on a map (5320). The other "lines" do not need placing on the map as they are "dummy" lines.

The line will only activate if the player uses it and their armour is between 1-149. A "count" of one means that it can only be used once. Though the count field of a line can be dynamically increased/decreased in game. For instance one could have another XG line that when activated adds 5 to the count of this one.

Once the line is activated, it prints the "act message" and will run down the "dummy" lines (the IpX fields), which in this case play a sound in the sectors with the same tag as the line, though you can refer to sectors with specific tag numbers as well if you wish, and randomly give the player between 65 and 75 armour up to a max of 150.

Finally, the mid wall texture of any line with the same tag as the line will change 0.1 seconds later. One would use Ip3 and 5 to refer to the upper and lower textures. The FpX field is the delay for each part of the chain.

Line Type {
ID= 5320
Comment= "Armour Charger"
Class = chain_sequence
Count = 1
Type = timed_off
Flags = "ltf_player_use_a";
Flags2 = "ltf2_when_act ltf2_any ltf2_power_above ltf2_power_below ltf2_multiple";
Time = 10
Ip0 = done_d
Ip1 = 5321
Ip2 = 5322
Ip3 = 5323
Fp3 = 0.1
Power Above = 0
Power Below = 150
Act Message = "Armour Repaired";
}

Line Type {
ID= 5321;
Count=-1;
Class = "ltc_sound";
Flags2 = "ltf2_when_act ltf2_any";
Ip0 = "lsref_line_tagged";
Ip2 = "vortexop";
}

Line Type {
ID = 5322;
Flags2 = "ltf2_when_act ltf2_any";
Class = "ltc_power";
Count = -1;
Ip0 = 65;
Ip1 = 75;
Ip3 = 150;
}

Line Type {
ID = 5323;
Flags2 = "ltf2_when_act ltf2_any";
Class = "ltc_wall_texture";
Count = -1;
Time = 1;
Ip0 = "lref_line_tagged";
Ip4 = "CIRWLA";
}

Heh. I ended up writting alot more than what I intended.

[40oz]

Ninjalah said:

Ok, since I've only made one and a half less than par maps, i thought that i should maybe try different ports.

You probably shouldn't. Vanilla Doom is about as simple as you can get. I always though as making a map that is exclusive to a certain port excludes the people who don't regularly use that port. If they suspect the map maybe good, they may consider downloading the port just to play your map. But if you are gonna make people download a new port just to play your map, your map better be REALLY good.

[Ninjalah]

JohnnyRancid said:

You probably shouldn't. Vanilla Doom is about as simple as you can get. I always though as making a map that is exclusive to a certain port excludes the people who don't regularly use that port. If they suspect the map maybe good, they may consider downloading the port just to play your map. But if you are gonna make people download a new port just to play your map, your map better be REALLY good.

Yeah, I know that now. Actually, I should probably start to draw quick sketches of maps rather than work straight off of whatever comes to mind. This way i won't get up with maps with long hallways because i didn't really have a structure.

This WAD i'm making is gonna be a progressive one, since it goes from worse to hopefully good.