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Do0minat0r

The best map ever

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What is, in your opinion, the best map ever made for a Doom I/II?

No, I'm not talking wad, like so many other threads already have (unless, of course, the wad has just one map). I'm asking, what do you think is the best individual level ever made? This is because, sure, people often rate a megawad of 32 very good levels just as well as or better than one outstanding map, since the former has more quantity for a still good quality. This thread's purpose is to discuss what you think are, even taken individually, truely outstanding maps made for Doom I/II.

For me, my favorite would probably be either ZDoom Community Map Take 1 or Terror Cube (E2M6 of ZPack). Both levels are long and are extremely good in every way - and both just gave me that rare feeling that I was playing something truely epic, something of a quality very, very rarely seen in the community, as I played my way through them.

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Joshy said:

Thunderpeak first comes into mind.


Yeah, that one's really good too, really close to the ones I mentioned. Same for Blackrock.

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I do love Blackrock and Thunderpeak, but I don't think the atmosphere of any Doom level has ever sucked me in quite as much as Espi's "The Shrine", Eternal Doom 4 map27 (screenshots here). It looks like nothing I've ever seen before in the Doom engine.

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I think my favorite map in a megawad has to be MAP05 from Eternal Doom III. It's really atmospheric, really nicely laid out and textured, and has good flow and continuity. That, and you TRAVEL BACK IN TIME. :P

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DOOM II: Hell on Earth, Map01: Entryway. It is a game of its own.

I'm thinking of deathmatch, of course, whereas single player (along with cooperative) is too much about variety to have a single best map, and playability is more important than technical innovation or elaboration, so I can't really see "that's impressive" as a determinant, just something to consider in a secondary category of merit, editing artistry.

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I've been appreciating all the ins and outs of The Sky May Be just a little bit too much lately. Hopefully after putting one more demo together it'll be out of my system.

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cybie3, no competition :P

Honestly though very difficult to pick just one. Alexander S' Remain1 MAP10 is probably the most visually stunning level I've ever seen. Jan Van der Veken's classic10, Ray Schmitz's Yesterday's Nightmare and Simon Judd's Redemption E1M1 all spring to mind when I think of the level I would take if I was stranded on a desert island.

Of the IWAD levels, MAP07 hands down.

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jute said:

Where did you get those DNF screens?

:|

I forget exactly, but they were posted somewhere a few days after 3D Realms closed up.

Now back on topic, folks.

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Thanks. Sorry for the off-topic post. Anyway, I think I agree with Essel about Espi's "The Shrine".

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jute said:

Thanks. Sorry for the off-topic post. Anyway, I think I agree with Essel about Espi's "The Shrine".

1+ Definitely a masterpiece, forgot about that one. I would be sure if I showed my gamer friends the map, they wouldn't think it was doom in the first place, heh.

Other single maps could be considered as really good: Decade and Nullspace by Russell Pearson, Void by Cyb, Suspended in Dusk by Epsi.

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Joshy said:

Other single maps could be considered as really good: Decade and Nullspace by Russell Pearson, Void by Cyb, Suspended in Dusk by Epsi.


Suspended in Dusk is not a single map.

However, I agree that all of these are really good (even classic).

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It's very difficult to choose, but I'd say it's map21 of Deus Vult II. Map27 of Alien Vendetta and map29 of Plutonia 2 are also stunning and impressive.

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"Darkdome" - Map 12 of Eternal Doom III. It still looks awesome and it plays remarkably well, even with the backtracking switch-hunt.

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Demonologist said:

It's very difficult to choose, but I'd say it's map21 of Deus Vult II.

Which one was that again? Because if it's Eagle's Nest I totally agree with you.

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I really loved Doom II Master Levels: Vesperas.wad by Dr. Sleep and Scythe II MAP27: Afterlife by Erik Alm.

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Eternus said:

Which one was that again? Because if it's Eagle's Nest I totally agree with you.

Nope, it's The Unholy Cathedral. But Eagle's Nest is very nice too - the visuals are great.

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Deus Vult 1: Map02 - When you walk into the large hellish chamber, you know killing all these monsters is not going to be a easy task.

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Geez, this is a pretty hard question. As far as vanilla maps go, I'd go with Endgame's MAP07. I just love the map design to it. As far as source port specific maps go, I'd go with Enjay's NJTrain. It's what got me hooked on ZDoom.

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While a mulitude of maps come to mind here (Thunderpeak, Eternal DooM II Map 27, and Halo of Wonders) I'll cut those selections down to about six:

-AV~29 Fire Walk With Me-
In my honest opinion, what a hell map 'should' look like as far as architecture and layout is concerned. Also...we cannot forgot the first Revenant Curve...

-DooM II~08 Tricks and Traps-
Just the simple concept of the map alone stands out...why don't I see other maps (sans ONE that I've seen) that focus on such a concept.

-Cheogsh-
The sheer magnitude of the design of said map, overall flow, and the Bruiserdemon <Cheogsh>...quite possibly one of my favorite decorate monsters to date.

-DVI~03/DVII~21 Unholy Cathedral's-
I classify both here for they both deserve a similar mention...namely the design of the main halls. Again, the architecture of the maps is what draws the player into the feel of the gameplay (albeit the many locations where the not-so-seasoned player will flat out die). DVII's version due to it's 'open', non-linear design.

-Scythe~26 Fear-
This map made an impression on me upon first touching it, despite it being a pure BFG slaughterfest. It's simple, yet challenging...

-CC3~29 For We Are Many-
Upon first playing this map it instantly left an impression on me...for you're constantly under pressure by the 'many' denizens that dwell here. Now that I'm mentioning this map, Leviathan and Abyss (if I remember correctly about that map name...it was a single map release) also come to mind. Whatever happened to Matt Tropiano by the way...>>...I also became a fan of his works.

Ugh...I guess that one can get carried away with such topics...;P

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Creaphis said:

I've been appreciating all the ins and outs of The Sky May Be just a little bit too much lately. Hopefully after putting one more demo together it'll be out of my system.

This is not the greatest map in the world! This is just a tribute!

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Lizardcommando said:

Geez, this is a pretty hard question. As far as vanilla maps go, I'd go with Endgame's MAP07. I just love the map design to it. As far as source port specific maps go, I'd go with Enjay's NJTrain. It's what got me hooked on ZDoom.


Totally agree with you on Endgame MAP07.

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You know I was almost going to pick Endgame MAP01, which is based on the classic10 I said above anyway. I was blown away the first time I played it. Jan VdV makes some kickass maps.

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Well, this is a real old fogey's answer, but ransacking my brain without having played in ages, because of the impact factor alone, I'd have to say the second or third level of Nukemine. It was the first evidence I'd seen of full TC-ability in Doom. There were new sounds, done REALLY well (like the zombie soldier "AI upgrades" (OMG - they're talking to each other!) which we coincidentally nabbed and later placed in Eternal Doom. There were all new textures, expanding the original theme, without any loss in quality. The author had basically just moved some of the existing textures' details around to create new sets, but it was hugely effective at the time. I knew it was an entire episode replacement, so the sense of depth as I stepped through the ongoing levels was unsurpassed too.

Dr Sleep's stuff was superior at the time, but he delivered single dosage, and I don't think I'd played any of his when I'd found Nukemine. The first map of his that I played was a big eyeopener, first white-collar wads they were.

Other than that, as a level designer, I have to mention one of the maps in Memento Mori, though I fail to recall the number (15 perhaps?), where the insanely inventive author had come up with a way to give an Archvile a corpse-filled room at the start of a fight. I had tried to get that effect before just using gib-decorations but I guess the Archvile reacts to code, not pixels. Upon dissecting the wad in question I found it was something to do with crushed barrels propelling zombies across a teleporter-line - gleefully I replicated the technique for a dank corner of Eternal Doom later on. Anyone else use that trap these days? Probably would work best if you didn't see the corpses tele-gib into the room just before the fight though! :D

For the different beast that is deathmatch - my adrenaline glands and various other containers of joy-juices have probably pumped at their hardest inside of Doom2 Map01. If I had to take ONE map to a desert island it would be that one. Uhm... if there were anyone to deathmatch with on the island I mean. If there weren't, I'd have to bring a copy of Eternal Doom 4, since its a pack I haven't played yet, and the screenshots linked here makes it look a damn sight sexier than any Doom level I thought I'd ever see. Rivers & sloped moats? Man...

I'm pressed to come up with a single allround BEST single map like the post is asking though, and that's kinda annoying. I guess I should really try one or two of the newer levels mentioned here, cause its been so long since I actively played Doom that I'm having a hard time singling out one of the many, many awesome levels I've played in the past.

Still love Doomworld though!

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Soundblock said:

Uhm... if there were anyone to deathmatch with on the island I mean.

It's the 21st century, desert islands have mobile broadband these days ;)

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rf` said:

This is not the greatest map in the world! This is just a tribute!


Well of course it isn't. It's interesting as a mutation of Doom but definitely can't stand on its own. It's just the first thing that came to my mind at the time.

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