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Agar

Doomed Again - A high-res sprites mod for Doom (and more...)

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Now that the website is online, I can finally make an "official" announcement about the project I've been working on for a few months: Doomed Again

Doomed Again is a complete remake of the classic Doom games based on the EDGE sourceport, featuring high-resolution sprites and textures, improved sounds, and a whole new way to create Doom levels.

FEATURES:

* 90 levels.
* Completely new high-resolution sprites for all monsters, weapons, scenery and items.
* A handful of new weapons and enemies.
* An all-new level editor.

There's a lot to say and I won't bother you with a huge post. You can find more info HERE, or watch gameplay videos here: Video #1 - Video #2 (the videos are quite dark, make sure you view it in fullscreen mode).

So, my fellow doomers, do you have any comments or suggestions ?

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Looks cool.

The shotgun is too high up, it points above the crosshair.

Also, I think the editor is looking a little too simple.

I also worry about the legality of this venture.

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webpage (editor) said:

Random map generator


can this be use to make layout with out monsters and items?

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DuckReconMajor said:

Looks cool.

The shotgun is too high up, it points above the crosshair.


Yes, this is one of the many glitches I still have to fix. :)

Also, I think the editor is looking a little too simple.


Well, I've always wanted to create a "wolfensteinesque" editor for Doom, and I still think that extremely simple levels are often the most interesting, gameplay-wise.

Plus it's still possible to create levels with Doombuilder or any other WAD editor. I'm merely providing an alternative.

I also worry about the legality of this venture.


Really ? Why ?

As far as I know, I didn't use any copyrighted material. I created all sprites using Poser.

The only exception being the sounds - some of them are edited versions of Neverwinter Nights 2's sfx -, but they're "placeholders" and will be removed from the final version.

Malinku said:

can this be use to make layout with out monsters and items?


Yes. It can create a "raw maze" without things or even doors.

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Agar said:

Really ? Why ?

As far as I know, I didn't use any copyrighted material. I created all sprites using Poser.

The only exception being the sounds - some of them are edited versions of Neverwinter Nights 2's sfx -, but they're "placeholders" and will be removed from the final version.

You're recreating data from the game, even using almost all of the same names. As far as I know this is illegal unless it requires Doom/Doom2 to run.

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DuckReconMajor said:

You're recreating data from the game, even using almost all of the same names. As far as I know this is illegal unless it requires Doom/Doom2 to run.


I didn't know that. I thought it was ok as long as no original data from the IWAD is included.

So... Freedoom is illegal too ?

I'll make sure the game requires an official IWAD to run. Won't require a lot of changes. :)

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Freedoom is not illegal as it's contain is different from the original doom's data including the music.

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Yeah. Freedoom is an original creation that can be used as a Doom iwad. Yours is a remake of id's intellectual property. Just make it require the iwad and you'll be okay.

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DuckReconMajor said:

Yeah. Freedoom is an original creation that can be used as a Doom iwad. Yours is a remake of id's intellectual property. Just make it require the iwad and you'll be okay.


I edited the website (as well as the first post of this thread) accordingly.

Thanks for your advice, you saved me a lot of trouble... :)

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This looks very impressive. Dont let these trolls tell you what's legal and what's not. As far as I'm concerned no one will care unless you go on an ego trip and start asking id software for permission :P

Now getting back to what this is really about, and that is a totally sweet and awesome looking mod. The only thing you said that kinda makes me want to barf is the fact that you're using EDGE. Otherwise, if this turns out well, I may just have an excuse to try to use EDGE again. Keep up the good work!

EDIT: I guess I might was well ask, need any high-res textures?

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Definitely ambitious-looking. Good luck on it. (:

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I must admit, your idea of 90 levels would take even the most experienced mappers years to complete. I mean, it took years to make and release Mordeth 2 ... oh, wait :P

My suggestion is:

MAP01: Phobos
MAP02: Deimos
MAP03: Inferno
MAP04: Thy Flesh Consumed
MAP05: Hell on Earth
MAP06: The Living End
MAP07: Secret level (plutonia?)

Its much more manageable, and allows you to dedicate more time to making beautiful maps.

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Patrick said:

I must admit, your idea of 90 levels would take even the most experienced mappers years to complete.


Well, you're right and wrong at the same time.

The question is not "how many months does it take to create 90 doom maps?", it is "how many days does it take to create 90 wolfenstein/rise of the triad maps?".

Don't forget Doomed Again revolves around its rather peculiar map editor. Trust me, it doesn't take long to create maps using this thing.

Of course, I know the "pro" mapmakers, the ones who have Doombuilder set as a startup program on their computers, are gonna complain about the simplicity of the maps. I can hear their teeth grinding from here.

Yes, it's a design choice with its pros (focusing on gameplay, relying only on the hi-res textures/sprites and dynamic lighting to build up an atmosphere) and cons (ninety degrees walls, pacman-esque architecture).

But it's absolutely possible to use any other WAD editor to create levels for Doomed Again. I'm doing my best to keep the same numbers for things and special linedefs/sectors, plus I will provide a Doombuilder configuration file in the package.

Fisk said:

Yeah, when this is done, I'm totally sitting down for like 2 months and will probably do nothing but make maps for this. This looks awesome.


Time for a mini-poll. Fisk (and you other mapmakers who find this project interesting), would you rather use the included level editor or a "classic" WAD editor ?

Anyway, I'll soon (probably sometimes next week, maybe before) upload a video of the editor in action so you can get a better idea of what it can and cannot do.

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Agar said:

ninety degrees walls, pacman-esque architecture

I suggest having diagonal tiles, it will make a world of difference.

Plus I assume that floor tiles can have different floor and ceiling heights, and support sky?

Then all you mainly need is a stair tile, a lift tile, a window tile, and a door tile (of course), and the editor will allow pretty decent maps to be made.

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andrewj said:

I suggest having diagonal tiles, it will make a world of difference.

Plus I assume that floor tiles can have different floor and ceiling heights, and support sky?

Then all you mainly need is a stair tile, a lift tile, a window tile, and a door tile (of course), and the editor will allow pretty decent maps to be made.


Floor tiles can have different floor height/ceiling height, there are interior and exterior tiles (so skies are supported).

There are stairs tiles (and even slope tiles, thanks to EDGE), door tiles, window tiles, "alcove in the wall" (for buttons/signs/other decorations) tiles. There are tiles flooded with swimmable water/slime/blood/lava. There are extrafloors (a.k.a "sector on sector", a.k.a. bridges). It is possible to create switches to raise/lower bridges or water level. No lifts for the moment as they aren't really needed in the maps the editor can create, but I may consider adding them as it wouldn't require a lot of work.

Diagonal tiles are an excellent idea but they might be a bit tricky to implement as the editor only understands the concept of "square" at the moment. :)

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Agar said:

Diagonal tiles are an excellent idea but they might be a bit tricky to implement as the editor only understands the concept of "square" at the moment. :)

Do you mean the code which converts the cell map into a DOOM map (creating vertices, lines and sectors etc) ?

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I can't say I care for the way the monster models look. But that's just me. This is a very ambitious undertaking. I wish you luck.

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andrewj said:

Do you mean the code which converts the cell map into a DOOM map (creating vertices, lines and sectors etc) ?


Yes.

I've uploaded an image explaining how the editor works. You can see it here.

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I'd probably go with a mix between the two. I may use just the included editor for some stuff, but at some point or another I'm going to use Doom Builder 2 for something, whether it be detailing a preexisting map generated by the inclusive tile-based editor or be it making a map from scratch in traditional style.

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Whatever happened to that guy who was making all the hi-res Doom sprites by simply doubling the size of them in photoshop, adding a bit of 'noise' and increasing the sharpness? Those looked awesome and i think he was doing pretty well.

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Fisk said:

I'd probably go with a mix between the two. I may use just the included editor for some stuff, but at some point or another I'm going to use Doom Builder 2 for something.

Seems a good idea.



The imp is done (and animated)! You can forget the sorry-looking brownish things you've seen in the video. Picture here

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Weren't the imp's legs plantigrade as opposed to digitigrade?

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Agar said:

I've uploaded an image explaining how the editor works. You can see it here.

Thanks.

It works more-or-less the same way that Oblige V2 did.

A simple way to make diagonal tiles can be done like this. Imagine the tile starts off like this:

........
#######.
#######.
#######.
#######.
#######.
#######.
#######.

.=floor  #=wall
In the top-right corner (where the wall meets the floor) you will get a single vertex. Just move that vertex to the middle of the tile to form a diagonal wall.

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Mr. Chris said:

Weren't the imp's legs plantigrade as opposed to digitigrade?


Yes they were, but the hi-res imp didn't look as good with humanoid feet - he felt more like a "klesk-esque" alien than a demon.

And there's an inconsistency in vanilla doom: ever heard DSBGACT (the imp's active sound) ? Sounds like horse hooves, not plantigrade footsteps.

andrewj said:

In the top-right corner (where the wall meets the floor) you will get a single vertex. Just move that vertex to the middle of the tile to form a diagonal wall.


Worth a try. Easy to do in theory but it might be a little trickier in practice because of the way my editor handle vertices.

Anyway, I just added "reserved for diagonal walls" tiles in the editor, so even if I don't have the time to implement this right now, I'll be able to do it later without breaking the maps.

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Imp said:

Finally someone that agrees with me. I thought there were only Legal Nazi's (DON'T RELEASE THAT THAT IS ILLEGAL!! OH GN0Z) on this board.


I'm emailing ID right now buddy. Shouldn't have be mouthin off

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