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40oz

Icon of Sin Battle

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Success!

Through experimenting with DeHackEd, I successfully created a test level that lets you fight the Icon of Sin, kill it, along with the demon spawner, and not end the level! This thing is actually a lot more fun to fight when it's not a cheap ending to a map. This should definitely come in handy :) The explosions last a lot longer than I initially expected. They do eventually die down though.

(Make sure you run both files together.)

http://jbserver.com/forums/attachments/8342_iconofsin.zip

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I can't test it right now, so I'm asking: you merely removed the BrainDie codepointer from the sequence?

I can definitely see this being used in clever ways if given proper level design.

Too bad that maps other than 30 don't free space for the spawned monsters, eventually resulting in all spots occupied my ever-increasing overlapped idle monsters.

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printz said:

I can't test it right now, so I'm asking: you merely removed the BrainDie codepointer from the sequence?


Mostly, except that I replaced BrainDie with KeenDie, made a test map that includes a voodoo doll script in which killing the Boss brain causes the entire structure to lower down (So that by killing it it actually falls down and is out of your path) revealing the exit room just beyond it.

I'm also experimenting with it in ways hoping that I can have more than one Icon of Sin in a single map. Currently I think the only way I can do it is if they are in the same room firing at the same monster spawners, but also wondering how I can make one structure lower down without lowering the other.

I suppose I could utilize a generalized gunfire line action but that would defeat the purpose of using KeenDie.

printz said:

Too bad that maps other than 30 don't free space for the spawned monsters, eventually resulting in all spots occupied my ever-increasing overlapped idle monsters.


In my tests, the monsters were being telefragged. Which can be good or bad. Good considering the number of monsters you have to fight is dependent on the amount of time you spend not blowing up the Icon of Sin, and being as though the map doesn't end after killing it, it would be difficult to determine how much ammo the player will need to defeat it, and monsters telefragging each other (as well as infighting) should be a load off the mapper's shoulders. But also bad because... well the monsters dying without the player having to kill them is kind of a waste of a monster.

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I remember that vanilla Doom behavior doesn't support Icon of Sin monster telefragging in levels other than 30, and the one in MAP30 happens because all manner of telefragging is allowed.

The problem is that if all hotspots get occupied by overlapped monsters, it's most likely game over for the Boss. -Fast could save it, though.

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Yeah... being telefragged isn't so fun being on the business end. Unless you're playing Quake, then even teleporting monsters gib when they attempt to telefrag you. Also amusing.

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One complex way of making voodoo dolls stackable is by having the keendeath trigger on ledges short enough that a slow scroll can push the doll up and onto the ledge, then when the doll crosses a line on the ledge it raises the keendeath ledge back to the original height with a 'lower floor to highest floor' action so it can't sail through all the other ledges. However it doesn't really matter unless you put the monster spawner attribute on the icon and it ends when you kill it, otherwise the spawner will keep on spawning until the level ends.

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Oh i forgot to that I gave the Icon of Sin 50 health (as opposed to 250) and the spawner 50 health and made it shootable as well. I haven't really tried to be precise yet, but it maybe possible to kill the spawner without killing the icon of sin.

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40oz said:

Oh i forgot to that I gave the Icon of Sin 50 health (as opposed to 250) and the spawner 50 health and made it shootable as well. I haven't really tried to be precise yet, but it maybe possible to kill the spawner without killing the icon of sin.

Yes, it is. Run this with ZDoom and bind a key to "linetarget". Aim it at the Icon's brain-hole and shoot repeatedly into it with your pistol. Keep pressing the linetarget key after each shot and you'll see that the BossEye actor is affected by the shots. You can kill it this way, and then (at least with this map), carry on offloading pistol shots at the brain to kill it.

It's also possible to kill the spawner with a well-placed rocket shot (hit the linetarget key while aimed at the brain-hole, get the BossEye in your line of sight, and fire off a rocket). If the rocket explodes outside the brain-hole that means that it's hit the spawner.

Even so, this is a really cool little map. With a few extra tweaks (such as making the spawner and the brain a little harder to hit) it can be pretty much flawless. Well done 40oz! :D

...It's only taken the Doom modding community 16 and a half years to figure this one out. XP

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What if I made the monster spawner not shootable but still with 50 health, and just made sure it was close enough to the bossbrain to be affected by the rocket blast? Would that work?

What is it with that trick that makes resurrected crushed monsters able to walk through walls and and be impervious to hitscan weapons? How do I give the monster spawner those same properties?

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