Is TF2 really that good?

[GooberMan]

I think the only games I've played more than TF2 are Civilzation (including all its various sequel forms) and Doom. For my money, Civ > Doom any day.

Also let it be known that TF2 has DirectX8 support and plenty of community modifications to make it run on hardware that's at least five or six years old. There's usually at least one thread on the subject active on any given day on the Steam forums.

And, you know, all this "I want to feel like I own something" stuff by having a physical copy is just plain rubbish. Because you never owned it in the first place. You owned the right to use it. On media that will degrade and not last anywhere near as long as a permanately-available digital download. With additional media available that you can pay a few dollars to get printed off professionally if you want a physical gloss manual. Arguing for physical media is almost a status symbol these days, it's like having a vinyl collection - sure, it's cool, but it's very impractical. One look at the number of shelves I have for my physical media is all you need to see that.

[Sharessa]

DuckReconMajor said:

Well I wanted a 1080 but I didn't want to pay $200 for one. Where'd you find one for $150?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824160051
It was $10 less when I got mine. Still, it's a bit less than $200.

[Shaikoten]

GooberMan said:

I think the only games I've played more than TF2 are Civilzation (including all its various sequel forms) and Doom. For my money, Civ > Doom any day.

This. It's much easier to play Civ for extremely long stretches of time and not get bored or tired. Although to be fair I'm sure I've played lots of games more hours than TF2. THPS comes to mind. And so do MUDs, which have many thousands of hours logged.

[Epyo]

I dunno if this is still the subject of the thread, but Team Fortress 2 kicks ass, and I don't think there's anything much like it. Valve's design teams are geniuses, the class balance and the maps are impeccably polished, I love the new weapons they're always carefully adding, I love the art style. I might consider it the best game of the decade, but I'd have to think about it more.

Anyway, IMO, anybody with a little FPS experience would probably adore TF2 if they try it. The high death-frequency can be jarring when you first start, but it actually makes the game much more fun, for both newbies and experts, because you can actually get kills when you start, and there's always room to improve when you're good.

[Kinsie]

It's a pretty damn good game, though some optional things like the items system might grate on some people. Plus, hey, maps by Dario Casali and Iikka Keranen for that extra Doom cred.

[magicsofa]

Viewtiful-Chris said:

I'm sick of hearing about it

[Use]

Viewtiful-Chris said:

Yes. Again, I'm asking for someone to deliver some sort of an intelligent, unbiased comparison between the two rather than all this bullshit drama.

Well you're not going to get one because THEY'RE NOT THE SAME. TF2 does what it does extremely well. Doom does what it does extremely well. There's your stupid comparison. Comparing Doom to Heretic, that works, this doesn't.

[DuckReconMajor]

Danarchy said:

but it seems like most games don't come with manuals these days anyway. They're either on the disc or are 3 pages long.

heh

[Spleen]

DuckReconMajor said:

heh

They're forgetting to mention the savings in packaging costs. :P

"Hey, we're going green, so we're going to stop including the manual, but we're still going to charge you the same price. Sucker!"

[Sharessa]

That's 90% of the reason any company "goes green". Hey, we could save a lot of money by not printing things/not having to pay waste costs/getting money from initiatives!

The other 10% is, of course, publicity. Actually, maybe I have that backwards.

I don't know why Ubisoft is making such a big deal about this. At least 50% of the games I've bought in the last 10 years or so have had their manuals on the discs.

[GooberMan]

While I'm here...



Too many polys for your baby video card? Problem solved!

I can't find the the particle reduction thread I'm after, but I may fish it up later if bored.

[phi108]

GooberMan said:

While I'm here...
Too many polys for your baby video card? Problem solved!

That's AWESOME, I may install TF2 now...

[Viewtiful-Chris]

phi108 said:

That's AWESOME, I may install TF2 now...

Don't rush yourself.

[phi108]

I found the in-progress download in the skin packs section, it's not complete yet, but it has a bunch of models included.

http://www.fpsbanana.com/skins/78349

[GooberMan]

Viewtiful-Chris said:

Don't rush yourself.

Of course, if you actually looked at the page:



It's right there above your 0% progess pane.

And yes, as phi pointed out if dug a bit deeper you'd realise that there's already available releases for it. The pack completely replaced the default weapons when I first stumbled upon it. The WIP appears to be for the unlocks.

Now begone, troll.

[Chow Yun Thin]

One caveat: some servers will force you to use the default models instead of the custom models you install.

[Mr. T]

GooberMan said:

Low poly TF2 models

Here's some low poly models for ya... he he

[geekmarine]

This thread was so much less confusing when I only thought Viewtiful-Chris was simply out to bash TF2. When I realized what he was actually asking, it hurt my brain. Comparing the two games doesn't even make sense. It's like asking, "I just want to know if Earthbound has anything to offer that Super Mario Bros. doesn't. I mean, I know they're both Nintendo games, but I was just curious if Earthbound made any serious innovations over Super Mario Bros., or if it's all just hype."

[Viewtiful-Chris]

geekmarine said:

This thread was so much less confusing when I only thought Viewtiful-Chris was simply out to bash TF2. When I realized what he was actually asking, it hurt my brain. Comparing the two games doesn't even make sense. It's like asking, "I just want to know if Earthbound has anything to offer that Super Mario Bros. doesn't. I mean, I know they're both Nintendo games, but I was just curious if Earthbound made any serious innovations over Super Mario Bros., or if it's all just hype."

I'm fairly certain that comparing DOOM (a first person shooter) to TF2 (a popular-at-the-moment newfangled FPS INSPIRED by Doom) is entirely unlike comparing a platformer to some whacko JRPG.

[geekmarine]

My point is, the only similarity between the two games is that they both feature characters running around with guns. Beyond that, there's not a whole friggin' lot of direct comparisons you can make. I know you haven't played TF2, but that's the problem - you have no idea what it's like, and so you don't realize you're asking a question that can't really be answered. They're too dissimilar - completely different playing styles, completely different objectives, etc.

[DuckReconMajor]

Well if the dude's playing ZDaemon/Skulltag/Odamex and wants to know if people who enjoy them enjoy TF2, and if it's worth buying, I don't see it as such an absurd question.

[Viewtiful-Chris]

geekmarine said:

My point is, the only similarity between the two games is that they both feature characters running around with guns. Beyond that, there's not a whole friggin' lot of direct comparisons you can make. I know you haven't played TF2, but that's the problem - you have no idea what it's like, and so you don't realize you're asking a question that can't really be answered. They're too dissimilar - completely different playing styles, completely different objectives, etc.

This right here

http://vectorpoem.com/news/?p=74

proves entirely otherwise. I'm asking someone to, in miniature, apply those types of observations against TF2 so that I'd know, as a DOOMer, what I can expect from TF2 in comparison with DOOM.

Everyone seems to have either nitpicked, word-minced, flamed, or otherwise.

I've read reviews, they don't tell me shit besides that it has "amazing team-based gameplay" and "fantastic art direction and graphical fidelity". None of that means anything to me as a DOOMer.

[ptoing]

If you wanna play Doom, then just do that. Why do you need to look for comparisons with Doom when you look at other games?
Is this necessary? Does a game become better if it is more or less like Doom? Does it help your view on things if you define yourself as a "DOOMer"?

The "brilliant art direction" in TF2 actually contributes to the gameplay.

At the end of the day you could make something that plays kinda like TF2 in Skulltag or with other Doom Source ports, but then again that would technically NOT be Doom. It would completely change the dynamics.

[Viewtiful-Chris]

ptoing said:

If you wanna play Doom, then just do that. Why do you need to look for comparisons with Doom when you look at other games?
Is this necessary? Does a game become better if it is more or less like Doom? Does it help your view on things if you define yourself as a "DOOMer"?

The "brilliant art direction" in TF2 actually contributes to the gameplay.

At the end of the day you could make something that plays kinda like TF2 in Skulltag or with other Doom Source ports, but then again that would technically NOT be Doom. It would completely change the dynamics.

No, I want to play something that ISN'T Doom for once, otherwise I wouldn't have made this topic.

I'm ASKING for someone to explain to me why TF2 is appealing in DOOM concepts, so I can actually understand why everyone's so wanked over this game.

And,

The "brilliant art direction" in TF2 actually contributes to the gameplay.

HOW?

[ptoing]

Clarity. One of the main things that is important in games is clarity. Things have to read, and this is much more important in fast paced games.

Because all the Classes have very unique and differing silhouettes you can see what you are up against from far away and react accordingly. If all the characters would have realistic human proportions with less variation this would not be as clear.

The same goes for Doom monsters really apart from some examples where it becomes hard whether it is a Hellknight or a Baron in dark corridors. But that just goes with colouredits I guess.

Also the stuff like rimlighting and what not that TF2 does is all made so that stuff reads better and becomes clearer to be in favour of gameplay, not JUST to look fancy.

[Viewtiful-Chris]

ptoing said:

Clarity. One of the main things that is important in games is clarity. Things have to read, and this is much more important in fast paced games.

Because all the Classes have very unique and differing silhouettes you can see what you are up against from far away and react accordingly. If all the characters would have realistic human proportions with less variation this would not be as clear.

Well okay, that's interesting. It sounds like more or less a difference between the half-second it would take to discern otherwise if the models were realistic. Somewhat like the "disabling gibs in Q3 for heightened vision" thing.

where it becomes hard whether it is a Hellknight or a Baron in dark corridors.

Only difference is their health and attack power. Shoot regardless of color.

So TF2 has clarity... that's exciting. Big Rigs Over the Road Racing had some amazing clarity as well.

[Use]

Viewtiful-Chris said:

Somewhat like the "disabling gibs in Q3 for heightened vision" thing.

But..the beautiful splatter.

[Viewtiful-Chris]

Use3D said:

But..the beautiful splatter.

Exactly. Which is why I would never take away such aesthetic-enhancing effects for clarity or otherwise, unless I was determined to be the next fatal1ty.

[ptoing]

Actually it would be more than half a second depending how far people are away from you.

But anyway, from your general posting I assume that you are not really interested in intelligent conversation, so excuse me if I will not take part in your threads anymore (apart from looking in from the outside, laughing)

[Viewtiful-Chris]

ptoing said:
But anyway, from your general posting I assume that you are not really interested in intelligent conversation, so excuse me if I will not take part in your threads anymore (apart from looking in from the outside, laughing) [/B]

Of course I am, I'm just more interested in more significant aspects of gameplay than how immediately recognizable the character models look.

That's like admiring the components of a standard FPS HUD. Who cares?

(apart from looking in from the outside, laughing)

Oh thank god. For a moment I thought my contributions to this community were totally unwanted.