Doom Limbo (looking for legal help)

[Dee]

I think it would be a great idea to create a web archive for the doom community to publish unfinished doom mods. This would not only be a great contribution to the community, but it would also give the original author at least some credit for the work, and we would also see many more projects actually getting finished instead of getting everyones hopes up high and then ditching the project, losing very good works. When a project is abandoned, usually the files are lost forever, which is pointless when they could be used in another project or even completed by other people. It would almost be selfish for someone to scrap a project instead of turning it over to someone who could use at least some of it.

Of course the authors would be allowed to specify the rights to using their work. for ex. if someone posted up a megawad project, that consisted of new graphics, sounds, and maps, and a storyline. then the author would be able to state that the project is available to be completed as is, and none of the provided media would be allowed to be used in a different project. or they could also state that the project is open and any of the media may be used simply as resource materials. or could state that its available for any purpose. so long as the author received credit for the work provided. something along those lines.

If I created a website like this, where you could upload sounds, sprites, maps, ideas, scripts, everything. Would you use it?

[Guest]

Well this is a really good idea. It would allow use of resources that would otherwise never see the light of day.

I hope this gets off the ground.

[Dee]

as long as the web site will get good use, then I have no problem buying web space for it and building the website. just gonna wait and see what everyone thinks first!

[GreyGhost]

It could work, though the first thing you need is a web host that'll let you to run a file archive on a shared server.

[Vegeta]

As long as each author has a space to specify conditions for what uses or restrictions his resources might have, I think this will be very promising. Some authors will just say "do whatever you want with this", but other might as to add limitations like "only use in heretic/hexen", or "use in gl only", or whatever.

I remember that after the DOOM 2.5 team allowed everyone to use the resources with no restriction, the author of the doom3mod raped the resources making a semi joke wad that most people think is the original and only doom 3 in doom 2 mod.

[Dee]

yeah, the author should have full respect and rights over their work, so the author will be able to allow the work to be used as resources or whatever, or the author will be able to basically turn the project over to the community like, "the media included in this package is to be used solely for this project, and may not be used in alternative project or be used to create a different project. by downloading these files you agree to modify and build on this project as it was originally intended."
or something, i mean the author can basically make his/her own guidelines. if they want the project to have the same title, story, idea, whatever the case may be, its their choosing.



however the only problem that i'm trying to figure out is how im supposed to set it up, because lets say for example that several people want to work on the same project. well we cant have that because then there would be multiple different versions of the same thing. any ideas or suggestions???

[Glass Rook]

It would have to somehow be set up like the reviews section here on the forums; once someone "claims" a WIP then nobody else can access it until it is either finished or released again. Unfortunately I know nothing of web design so I have no idea how to set that up.

[Dee]

Great idea! I can set that up, could basically give a specified user administrative rights over the specified download and no one else would be able to access the files unless they are given rights.

It would also be necessary that the project end up in the hands of the right person. perhaps like a 'resume' of sorts. it would be a shame to turn over a decent project to just anyone that just learned how to map.

I suppose however, that any of the projects that have given rights like "you may use the files provided as resources for other projects." can be given full access to anyone on the site.

[Phml]

Sounds like a good idea. I'd upload quite a few maps to such a site, and am often interested in seeing other people's unfinished stuff.

[Kira]

Good idea. We have an "abandonwads" section in the french doom community since years, although it hasn't been used that much : http://doomfrance.forumactif.com/abandonwads-f56/

[Dee]

it will be made much like wadsinprogress.info same concept quite a bit different though.

[Kira]

Why not, it looks like it is the best way to go ;)

[Dee]

a agree, very user friendly and good idea. post three screens of the project and list what is included with the files your uploading and what not and then choose to make the project locked or free to the public.
if they want the project to be carried on and finished from where it was left off, they should probably lock it so that only a certain person or persons can download the files when they take the project over.

[40oz]

The /idgames archive already has a pretty big handful of unfinished stuff. A lot of people like to upload the first map they make for their megawad to the archives. There are also some random texture packs that were never used in the project they were intended for, some wads that were intended to become full blown megawads but only featured a small increment of the game (Doom Resurrection: Episode 1 or even Mordeth for example)

My best suggestion is to promote the idea that every single creation made for doom is always valuable, even if it's unfinished or unused in the final product. I always store every creation I ever made with Doombuilder 2 in a folder and many times that stuff gets recycled into new maps that I make. There is value to everything you can create, so never delete it. Reuse it in another project you might make in the future. Just think about all the research that went into finding out about the doom prealpha and beta versions, and how much valuable content is in it that tends to get reused in newer projects all the time.

[Dee]

much agreed. thats the overall idea of this. we see all these stunning maps and graphics and stuff in screenshots and stuff for new projects every week, but they end up never getting used at all. this site will help give back to the doom community and put the mods to use rather than just letting them sit on a harddrive and eventually get lost or erased. while also increasing the percentage of projects that actually get finished, which would help expand the community and give us much more to play and enjoy!
I believe this will be an excellent start in community recognition as well as opening much more content and entertainment for doom.
many small time editors and artists can post even the smallest creations on here and when people start using them, the author of the work would be given recognition for it, so its really a win-win for everyone.

I was thinking about calling the website something like "Doom Boneyard" or something like that I dunno still workin on ideas.

[DeathevokatioN]

Hmmmm, sorry this is probably a dumb question, but is this a place to upload half finished maps (that have been given up on but had potential) or half finished projects? I fully support this by the way.

[Dee]

yeah thats exactly whats its for along with other unfinished or abandoned projects or works. its like, instead of just trashing a project or idea or any kind of content, you can upload it instead for other people to finish or use in their projects.
so when someone pops onto doomworld showing off their super awesome project, and then 3 weeks later gives up on it, they could just upload it and still get credit for the work that they did do! so even if you get stuck and dont finish something, you can still get something out of it and give back at the same time.

[Guest]

The more I look at this, the more I like it.

With this, we may well see more actual projects get done, coz people will be able to grab scraps of maps and stuff to incorporate in their own projects.

Nice.

[valkiriforce]

I have a few maps I would probably scrap for other people to use; one of which was going to be for CC4 but lost motivation to continue. Also out of curiosity, would this include unfinished midi tracks? I think more than maps I've scrapped a lot of midi tracks.

[Dee]

sure I mean it can really be any kind of files. even if they arent in a doom format, as long as your not uploading porn or anything. although im going to have to create some kind of scanner to check files for viruses and stuff before uploaded. if there is any form of content that can be used to help with any kind of doom project, then it may be uploaded. as long as its a relevant file. I mean the files will be checked and approved before posted for download

[purist]

I vote yes. I can envisage only positive things to come out of this idea.

[Dee]

anyone have any ideas on what the name of this site should be?
suggestions?

and everyone please keep voting, I know more than 13 ppl have viewed this thread but for some reason you cant click yes or no? I mean really?

[purist]

How about Project Limbo or something along those lines. It's roughly descriptive of it's purpose and it'd be cool to be (partly) named after a Doom map.

[Dee]

the limbo idea is cool, i will see what I can come up with

[myk]

Sounds like a smart idea, as it would give an incentive to find a "home" for projects people don't want to finish, when they don't want their efforts to go to waste.

Also make sure the author had rights to what he was doing in the first place. Going by idgames standards should give you a good footing. After all, the projects will likely end up there if finished. Basically, don't allow community members to rip other community members; don't worry too much about other stuff (except warez and the like, of course) but do take down anything a commercial company complains about directly.

[Tango]

excellent idea. Project Limbo is fitting

[DeathevokatioN]

Maybe Suspended in Dusk would be a good name? Just a suggestion.

[Glass Rook]

Dee said:

anyone have any ideas on what the name of this site should be?
suggestions?

and everyone please keep voting, I know more than 13 ppl have viewed this thread but for some reason you cant click yes or no? I mean really?

Just semantics, but perhaps switching the words around to "Limbo Projects" would be more fitting, immediately telling new visitors to the site that this is a site with more than one project, where "Project Limbo" sounds like a single megawad WIP.

I clicked "yes" BTW.

[D_GARG]

sounds brilliant! I would throw all my trash in here and see what people think of what I got tired of :)

[Dee]

love the idea!

"Doom Limbo Projects"

well its pretty much settled that this should be done, I think everyone would use it and enjoy it, so im starting work on the site today.
Once the site gets started of course we will need some moderators and people to maintain the site, so anyone interested in helping out with anything on this site can pm me.
If anyone has anything they think would benefit and help towards getting the site going and running please help out.
or if anyone knows anything about creating websites or just whatever.

if you wanna help, your very welcome to!

thanks everyone, we will see where this goes!