Progressive Fiction (Hadephobia now on /idgames)

[purist]

Hmmm, how about using the area for arachnotrons? Maybe you need to kill it's children first. Or if you can't make it work as well as a mastermind put one in and we'll have two. Just make sure it's not too hard as walter's will need to be harder than yours and put something in the story so it makes sense (they could be twins or something).

Also, I've not downloaded yet. Have you put the story, name, music etc in a .txt file? The story might need changing when you finish putting in monsters.

EDIT: Downloaded now. The start area is really dark and I'm not sold on the tech doors and rooms - remember the map is set in an natural underground space that has been corrupted by demons. I do like the wood areas though - there's some potential there. Knowing that walter is working on the boss map are you going to revise the ending to be more appopriate?

@Vaporizer: How's MAP06? I had an idea about the map: It's a freight ship but maybe it's cargo would normally be people taken to the asylum and mines. Only they are now either dead or zombies. Also, to explain why it goes to the mine, maybe it could have an autopilot that cannot be overidden so Doomguy couldn't choose where to go. For ease I would set most the map below deck.

[A.Gamma]

Ok, maybe the level can end when you fall in the hole past the blue skull door?
Or add another fall after the mastermind/arachnotrons fight?

[purist]

To be honest I expected the level to end when I dropped into the hole and I thought 'cool way to end'. But then IIRC the area after that looked the best part of the map so it would be a shame to cut it.

My advice would be to just concentrating on finishing the map up to the fall. If you're satisfied use that as the exit and cut the rest of the map. If you feel as though the map is missing something continue then add a second drop where the current exit is.

[A.Gamma]

I'll cut the last part of the map and make the cave parts feel more natural.
Also, I'll try to make the base part feel more hellish. (although, i was going to do all this from the beginning)

[purist]

Sounds good. It seemed quite big even without monsters so I don't think it'll be too short without the last part. For the base part maybe use gothic/marble textures where you've used metal/tech and swap the tech doors and lights for their hellish variants.

So your map will now end with a drop. We might need to do a bit of tinkering to the end of your map and the start of walter's to make them seamless so I wouldn't spend too much time on the exit until walter's done. Concentrate on the other areas first.

[Walter confetti]

layout of what i did until now...

[Vaporizer]

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[The_MártonJános]

Vaporizer said:

Looks nice. Short, but a boss map shouldn't be aeons long afterall.

Even if somebody is mapping for an E4M8-style, the concept remains. However, it's up to the mapper whether he stretches the gameplay or puts the boss directly in front of you.

[purist]

Good to see you're off to a start walter but the mine map is MAP09. A.Gamma is removing the tech from MAP10 and making it more Hell influenced. You might want to replace your tech outpost with a Demon outpost.

I like the stepping stone section. It will echo the similar area toward the end of my MAP09. Explains why the Mastermind is trapped down there too.

It looks like you'll have at least a fair amount of your map finished in time for the Sunday upload. Don't forget to write your story, pick your music and name your level.

EDIT: Been playing about with STBARs. Don't be too mean these are my very first attempts :-)

First, here are the first 3 efforts. Note the last one is a mask that I've used to overlay the backdrops for all 3.



And here's a screenshot of my favourite of the three. Note the weapon part hasn't been done yet. Also the red numbers would need changing colour.



A.Gamma, when you've finished MAP10 you could use these as a starting point or a reference for theme if you like them.

[Walter confetti]

looks psychedelic

[The_MártonJános]

The one with ROCKRED* is pretty cool, but I liked the one with RROCK01 as well. Maybe you should make ASHWALL2 and RROCK04 ones, even if they don't seem that hellish - the black, burntout Hell does give some feeling about the worst nightmares ever.
About MAP10, it has too huge sectors I suppose. Spidy minions or something else to fill them with is affordable, but still way, way enormous, such as some of the sectors in the previous MAP06... the correct filling of these requires first-class mapping skills. I don't know how you solve this, but good luck with it!

[Vaporizer]

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[Katamori]

yellow border isn't good, I think... change them

also, my favourite is the 4th HUD, with the hellsky texture (:

[The_MártonJános]

That's not "hellsky", that's ROCKRED*-themed.
Well, I would have prefered the HUD to have black or grey border instead of that yellow one. That looks rather ridiculous.

[Katamori]

Cell said:

That's not "hellsky", that's ROCKRED*-themed.
Well, I would have prefered the HUD to have black or grey border instead of that yellow one. That looks rather ridiculous.

Oh, I just saw the red clouds... :D

[Walter confetti]

pics from the map...

http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/6692/daiprog11.png
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/3461/daiprog12.png
http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/8656/daiprog13.png
http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/8526/daiprog14.png
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/4858/daiprog15.png

[purist]

More HUD pics...



The last pic is the new mask. I've swapped the yellow/orange border for black/grey and the orange shadowing on the texts for black but I've kept the yellow text as I like the contrast.

The first of the 3 new HUDs is my favourite of the last 4 but with the new frame. The other 2 are new ones.

Vaporizer, feel free to make some HUDS of your own. You can use the mask to save yourself time if you wish (this was the most time-consuming part of making them for me). Please wait until after MAP06 is finished though as I don't want you to delay it longer than need be.

walter, thanks for the progress update. I'm not sure on the computer, it clashes a bit with most of the map being rock/hell. I've noticed in the PCCP thread it was noted that your maps have intricate details in one area with large bare rooms in the next. I know you're still working but in some screens that same critism could be applied here. You'd be better making the areas look good just by architecture alone and then add details in a consistant manner afterwards. Finally, it's obviously impossible to comment on gameplay without playing but it's clear you're using large areas, which is difficult to make fun battles with. It's unavoidable to a large extent in the Spiderdemon area but the others might benefit from being broken up a bit with pillars, raised floors etc.

[The_MártonJános]

Slight notices for the first screenie:
1. You should use an unpegged door track
2. MFLR8_3 looks silly as the ceiling of the door

[purist]

I had an idea for a title pic. With the title Hadephobia, the start in the asylum and the theme of madness I thought the title screen could be an inkblot of some sort? I did a bit of lazy googling and came up with this proof of concept...



I don't think the white background is very Doomy and it doesn't transfer to PRBoom+ as sharply but what does everyone think of it as a starting point?

[Walter confetti]

Thanks for the feedback guys....

[TMD]

From the "too little too late" department: My laptop is running again. Unfortunately school starts next week.

[jerrysheppy]

purist said:

I had an idea for a title pic. With the title Hadephobia, the start in the asylum and the theme of madness I thought the title screen could be an inkblot of some sort? I did a bit of lazy googling and came up with this proof of concept...

I don't think the white background is very Doomy and it doesn't transfer to PRBoom+ as sharply but what does everyone think of it as a starting point?

I'm not part of the project, of course, but I just wanted to chime in that I like this idea. I can't tell if that inkblot is supposed to represent anything or if it's just a random one you found, but what about one that vaguely (yet distinctly enough that you can tell it's deliberate) resembles the Icon of Sin or some other bit of distinctively Doom imagery? That, plus changing the color scheme to something else--perhaps red on black, or black on a stretched-skin graphic like the SKINMET textures, might be the ticket.

[Katamori]

purist said:

I had an idea for a title pic. With the title Hadephobia, the start in the asylum and the theme of madness I thought the title screen could be an inkblot of some sort? I did a bit of lazy googling and came up with this proof of concept...


I don't think the white background is very Doomy and it doesn't transfer to PRBoom+ as sharply but what does everyone think of it as a starting point?

I think this picture is better as the intermission screen

[Vaporizer]

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[The_MártonJános]

The titlepic looks cool, but better if reddened.

[Walter confetti]

actually my map have a exit portal (needs also the destination?) and i made a "better" battle place in the spider mini-fortress... also added few more details and traps...

purist said:Good to see you're off to a start walter but the mine map is MAP09. A.Gamma is removing the tech from MAP10 and making it more Hell influenced. You might want to replace your tech outpost with a Demon outpost

Whoops, sorry but i read this only now!
I'll see to re-texture it in hellish style, and also change few things...

[purist]

Thanks for the TITLEPIC comments.

@jerrysheppy: I more than welcome feedback from anywhere. Whether you're contributing directly or not, Of course, if you wanted to contribute something you're welcome. There's an unclaimed mapslot and plenty of other stuff to do if graphics, playtesting or music are more your forte. I agree about the background, problem is there's lots of shades of white that need equaling before I can cleanly transfer it to another background (I was thinking a red flaming background, or a darkended re-colour of the brain flat). I'm hoping there's a free program (GIMP?) that will let you do this painlessly. Otherwise I'll be looking for another inkblot. The one I used was off the first inkblot site I found but I do like it. It's obviously open to interpretation by it's nature but it looks a little skullish to me. Funnily enough the first thing that came to mind was an inkblot of the Icon of Sin.

@Katamori: What would you suggest for a TITLEPIC instead? I've been mulling this over since I finished MAP09 and an inkblot graphic is the best I've come up with. I was planning on using the BOSSBACK graphic for the INTERPIC. I like how it gives the impression the Icon of Sin is watching your progress.

@Vaporizer: I've uploaded http://www.hellbent.iwarp.com/box_widget.html but please finish MAP06 before you get bogged down in custom HUDs. They can wait for now, I'd rather see the gaps in the wad filled up.

@walter: Sounds good. The exit destination is up to you. I've posted before that my favourite theory is the mastermind escaped a UAC lab where it had been experimented on. The portal could lead to the lab where it's scientists have now been slaughtered and replaced by a demonic force. You can use this, your own idea or leave it unknown. I don't normally like mappers to leave the destination unknown but when it's the end of the episode I don't mind an exception. If you do want to show the destination include it in your story and maybe have the portal in a wall with the destination visible on the other side?

EDIT: Here's a very rough mock-up of what I meant by a portal showing it's destination. FIREBLUE the transparent mid-texture. An exit line would be before it. The next map would be in the tech area you see through the portal, though the portal would have to be blocked and it would need to look tech rather than hellish on the otherside.

[Walter confetti]

ok, i've got it...

[jerrysheppy]

Thanks for the offer, purist, but I really don't think I have the sort of freedom in my schedule to work in anything for this project. I do look forward to seeing what the rest of you come up with, though. I played the first few maps as they were posted, but then stopped figuring it'd be better to wait until I could properly play through them all in order :)

[purist]

OK, I just wanted to make the point that the project is not a closed deal.

It's always nice to hear of people showing an interest. I agree you're better off waiting until the end to play the finished wad but I've made it possible for people to decide for themselves as it is a community project after all.