Doom 4 should have...

[DooM_RO]

I would like to clarify something, I am not against story, really. I like the story in Wolfenstein. What I am against is cutscenes and animations that are pointless. Here are a few examples from TNO. In the first mission you have to use a lever to open the gate. Why did the devs feel the need to put a forced animation? Why couldn't it just move "itself". In the mission right before Eisenwald there is that part where you go in the car, fall and then an animation with a robot trying to stomp you is triggered. Why was this necessary? In Eisenwald there is that part where you walk on that ledge and overview a nazi taking in some prisoners. I get it, nazis are bad but why am I forced to watch this? Why do developers think these type of sequences are interesting? Yeah yeah, they are only 10 seconds max BUT there are quite a few of these forced animations, I mean they do not exaggerate with them but when you add them all up you see why they are annoying. They break the flow of the game for no reason. Cutscenes with Tekla, Max Haas and J? Yeah, totally! They actually show something interesting and they are SKIPPABLE too.

I want to replay Wolfenstein over and over like Doom, I really do because the game is fun but the things I have mentioned make the levels longer than they are supposed to be. That's why I think there should have at least been some kind of horde mode that you could play with a few buddies...or a mode where you can play with cutscenes and forced animations disabled. They are cool for the first time...but after 5-6 times? It is clear that TNO was not designed to be played years after its release. Doom should be different and that's why they need to be very careful with how they implement the story.

[Doomguy777]

DooM_RO said:

I would like to clarify something, I am not against story, really. I like the story in Wolfenstein. What I am against is cutscenes and animations that are pointless. Here are a few examples from TNO. In the first mission you have to use a lever to open the gate. Why did the devs feel the need to put a forced animation? Why couldn't it just move "itself". In the mission right before Eisenwald there is that part where you go in the car, fall and then an animation with a robot trying to stomp you is triggered. Why was this necessary? In Eisenwald there is that part where you walk on that ledge and overview a nazi taking in some prisoners. I get it, nazis are bad but why am I forced to watch this? Why do developers think these type of sequences are interesting? Yeah yeah, they are only 10 seconds max BUT there are quite a few of these forced animations, I mean they do not exaggerate with them but when you add them all up you see why they are annoying. They break the flow of the game for no reason. Cutscenes with Tekla, Max Haas and J? Yeah, totally! They actually show something interesting and they are SKIPPABLE too.

I want to replay Wolfenstein over and over like Doom, I really do because the game is fun but the things I have mentioned make the levels longer than they are supposed to be. That's why I think there should have at least been some kind of horde mode that you could play with a few buddies...or a mode where you can play with cutscenes and forced animations disabled. They are cool for the first time...but after 5-6 times? It is clear that TNO was not designed to be played years after its release. Doom should be different and that's why they need to be very careful with how they implement the story.

This! :D

I don't want DOOM 4 to be exactly like DOOM 1, I just want to see a proper reboot or remake of DOOM 1. Also, yeah I would be happy with that.

You know why? Because, id Software doesn't always put out a good story. You know they can and they want to too. But more than often they hire a TERRIBLE writer! *Everyone looks at Matthew Costello*

They are known for their gunplay, and their fast-paced awesome gameplay.

Fast-paced gameplay can work on a console. Has anyone played Serious Sam on a console? Nobody? OK... what about Quake 3 Arena on Xbox Live Arcade? Nobody.....


The point is DOOM should return to it's roots. Who gives two fucks if it isn't Halo or COD or Battlefield? It's DOOM, not another generic cookie cutter shooter.

If this new DOOM game is going to be good, they better return to their roots, do it right, and kick ass; seriously just ditch those silly modern gameplay mechanics of regenerating health, two weapon limit, cover-based gameplay.

It seems as if ChickenorBeef and Kaskaum want a COD-based DOOM.

Do you want a COD-Based DOOM? I don't, I want a DOOM that's a DOOM game.

I don't want Halo in my DOOM.

I would like to have some Plato though!

I certainly don't want a COD in my DOOM.

Keep that piece of SOD out of DOOM.

I certainly don't want Battlefield in my DOOM.

But I do want to be on the battlefield in DOOM!

DOOM DOOM DOOM!

DOOM is a game about one man vs Hell.

The man is doing well, and he's knee-deep in the dead.

Through the shores of hell, and to another realm.

Now he's in Hell, but he's going to quell.

The demons from Hell! DOOM!


OK sorry about that little poem, but in a nutshell. I just want DOOM to return to its roots and not become another generic modern military shooter like Halo or COD or Battlefield....

Kaskaum wants Halo in his DOOM......

ChickenOrBeef wants COD in his DOOM.....


I can't take it anymore!

KEEP THOSE DAMNED MODERN FIRST-PERSON SHOOTER MECHANICS OUT OF MY DOOM!

GeneralLotz was right... the last good first-person shooters to come out were back in 2004....

[ChickenOrBeef]

Shaviro said:

Already have on several occasions, but the best and most coherent post I've written on the subject of Doom 4's appeal is probably this one: http://www.doomworld.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=1220459#post1220459
including replies etc.

To be honest, your idea just doesn't seem very unique. You didn't propose anything gameplay-wise that would be different than today's other shooters, and instead you focused heavily on detailing an immersive story for Doom. Also, you didn't really detail how the story would be done differently; just that it should make the player care about what he/she is doing.

Can you go into more detail on why your idea for Doom 4 would be fresh in today's market and will help strengthen the Doom brand name?

Kaskaum said:

I and other console gamers will be very happy if they can simulate the Halo playsyle because it is the most fluent and arcade-like gameplay a console can have for a shooter, who played Halo, both campaign and multiplayer knows that.

I always thought Halo felt like a lamer version of Quake III and Unreal. And both Quake and Unreal had console versions that were worked with controllers and were still quite fast.

But if you're saying that Halo's speed is the best we can hope for, then I'd probably agree.

Doomguy777 said:

ChickenOrBeef wants COD in his DOOM.....

Huh? I want the exact opposite of that. lol

[Guest Unregistered account]

Lol, ChickenOrBeef, you're rising through the ranks of DoomWorld's statuses just by posting on this thread!

[Doomguy777]

ChickenOrBeef said:

To be honest, your idea just doesn't seem very unique. You didn't propose anything gameplay-wise that would be different than today's other shooters, and instead you focused heavily on detailing an immersive story for Doom. Also, you didn't really detail how the story would be done differently; just that it should make the player care about what he/she is doing.

Can you go into more detail on why your idea for Doom 4 would be fresh in today's market and will help strengthen the Doom brand name?



I always thought Halo felt like a lamer version of Quake III and Unreal. And both Quake and Unreal had console versions that were worked with controllers and were still quite fast.

But if you're saying that Halo's speed is the best we can hope for, then I'd probably agree.



Huh? I want the exact opposite of that. lol

Oh lol! I thought you did! Sorry a bit of a misunderstanding... you kind of want what I want to see!

XD We both want to see a late 90's version early 2000's version of DOOM. Something like Quake 3 Arena in terms of multiplayer, but something like Half-Life 1/Ultimate DOOM in Campaign and Soldier of Fortune in gore! :D

[Kaskaum]

Halo has a faster pace than CoD or BF, just play both games and you'll feel it. Halo has the best option gameplay wise for an arcade-like console shooter.

Don't forget that one things that made classic Doom playable on consoles(Classic Doom are available through online purchase for consoles) despite having fast pace is that in Doom you didn't need to aim, it doesn't matter if the enemy was below you or above you, if you had an enemy below-above you, in a higher or lower platform than you, you just needed to shot and the enemy would be hit.

Quake 3 style gameplay can't be put in a console because as I said before, joysticks can't handle a so fast pace as Q3 as a keyboard-mouse do.

Q3 was made in an time when PC shooter still stand out and made money. But now console AAA games make more money than PC AAA games, the only exception today are AAA MMOs that will have PC as main house for years to come with few a exceptions.

They can't ignore consoles; Rage, although had considered low sales, it sold over 1 million on PS3 and another 1 million on X360, while on PC it sold 200K. If Rage were focused only on PC as Quake and id pretended they still were in 90s - beginning of 2000s and went in the route of the fast paced Quake gameplay, id would have a bigger problem in their cash account.

Q3 was unplayable on consoles, yes it had console versions but it bombed.

He even made fun the fact Doomguy didn't need to aim:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm_MFauHzdo

Steam is one of the few companies that bet on PC gaming, and they went in a right direction offering lower prices to download original games, Valve is making a good profit through steam. They even forgot to make a Half-Life 3.

[Shaviro]

ChickenOrBeef said:

To be honest, your idea just doesn't seem very unique. You didn't propose anything gameplay-wise that would be different than today's other shooters, and instead you focused heavily on detailing an immersive story for Doom. Also, you didn't really detail how the story would be done differently; just that it should make the player care about what he/she is doing.

It's written in a thread about how Doom would appeal to old fans/modern gamers. It's an angle on how it could compete for attention. How it plays exactly as well as internal game mechanics is a little less important in that aspect. I've written plenty about this subject throughout the years in these forums. You can take a look around.

Can you go into more detail on why your idea for Doom 4 would be fresh in today's market and will help strengthen the Doom brand name?

Maybe I'll write you that essay once you contribute more than a handful of posts consisting of 1-3 lines :)
I don't mean to be rude and I would love to discuss game mechanics/action setup etc. with you, but I'm not going to dance for you.

[Doomguy777]

Kaskaum said:

Halo has a faster pace than CoD or BF, just play both games and you'll feel it. Halo has the best option gameplay wise for an arcade-like console shooter.

Don't forget that one things that made classic Doom playable on consoles(Classic Doom are available through online purchase for consoles) despite having fast pace is that in Doom you didn't need to aim, it doesn't matter if the enemy was below you or above you, if you had an enemy below-above you, in a higher or lower platform than you, you just needed to shot and the enemy would be hit.

Quake 3 style gameplay can't be put in a console because as I said before, joysticks can't handle a so fast pace as Q3 as a keyboard-mouse do.

Q3 was made in an time when PC shooter still stand out and made money. But now console AAA games make more money than PC AAA games, the only exception today are AAA MMOs that will have PC as main house for years to come with few a exceptions.

They can't ignore consoles; Rage, although had considered low sales, it sold over 1 million on PS3 and another 1 million on X360, while on PC it sold 200K. If Rage were focused only on PC as Quake and id pretended they still were in 90s - beginning of 2000s and went in the route of the fast paced Quake gameplay, id would have a bigger problem in their cash account.

Q3 was unplayable on consoles, yes it had console versions but it bombed.

He even made fun the fact Doomguy didn't need to aim:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm_MFauHzdo

Steam is one of the few companies that bet on PC gaming, and they went in a right direction offering lower prices to download original games, Valve is making a good profit through steam. They even forgot to make a Half-Life 3.

DOOM isn't Halo. Keep Halo out of DOOM. Quake 3 works perfectly on consoles, you obviously haven't played Quake Arena Arcade on the Xbox 360, and you obviously haven't played Serious Sam on Xbox 360 or Xbox in general.

Also, DOOM is DOOM. DOOM is awesome, stop trying to put Halo in DOOM.....

I DO NOT WANT TWO WEAPON LIMIT! I DO NOT WANT REGENERATING HEALTH! AND I DON'T WANT RESIDENT EVIL OR HALO BULLSHIT IN MY DOOM!

Most people here on these forums are going to eventually have to choose a side.

I choose the DOOM remake/reboot side/DOOM 64 sequel side. You can choose the silly little Halo side if you want to.... but I think most people here are going to choose the DOOM remake/reboot side/ DOOM 64 sequel side.


Halo is terrible, and is extremely overrated. DOOM will always be the best no doubt. Fast-paced gameplay can work on a console. Besides, the PS4 can certainly handle it and so can the Xbox One.

We aren't playing around with last-gen my friend. We are playing with next-gen. Also, on topic the new DOOM should be made for PC's in mind and be made for the PC and Mac. The PS4 should be like the PC version exactly, same goes for the Xbox One. But the only thing is, include auto-aim for the console ports so it's much smoother playing on consoles.


FOR THE LOVE OF DOOM! KEEP HALO OUT OF MY DOOM AND DOOM_RO'S DOOM AND SHAVIRO'S DOOM! AND ALL OF OUR DOOMS! SERIOUSLY, KEEP OUT HALO!

P.S Kaskaum just play a console version of Serious Sam and tell me that fast-paced gameplay doesn't work.... I'm sick'n tired of all of that bullshit like COD, Halo, and Medal of Honor.


Hey everybody look this is what Kaskaum wants.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNiYvqZIBBc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F0AdWBmiQY

[Kaskaum]

I only played serious sam 3 on PC, but game sold very poorly even on consoles, I don't want DOOM to have the feeling of Serious Sam 3 because it felt more like an indie game than a AAA.

Game having plot doesn't mean a linear CoD like game, Far cry has open world and good plot.

It seems the trend nowadays is going open world, Metal Gear Solid 5 will be open world, and Halo 5 according to MS rumors will have open world too(maybe 343i felt threatened after seeing everything Bungie is doing to Destiny).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSXQMC3mQBw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IimVEA1GzAM

[Kaskaum]

If you look at this particular walkthrough of Halo 1, you can notice some level of intense action, actually here you have a bigger number of monsters together than most Doom 3 moments, that's why I would choose Halo approach to consolize DOOM in a way that it works on consoles:

http://youtu.be/90-8dTwn7-4

[Doomguy777]

Kaskaum said:

If you look at this particular walkthrough of Halo 1, you can notice some level of intense action, if fact here you have a bigger number of monsters together than most Doom 3 moments, that's why I would choose Halo approach to consolize DOOM:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90-8dTwn7-4

You don't get the idea do you? DOOM isn't an open-world game, and DOOM isn't linear either. It has levels with secret areas and the levels are big and are linear but have different areas and are kind of like a maze.

Don't take the Halo approach to consolize DOOM. Don't even bother trying to consolize it. Maybe add controller support and the like, but for crying out loud don't make it like Halo. This is a good example of what I would like to see from next DOOM game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-UjRPWHQa0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5u0rESeUgI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b4x9lpF8K4

[Kaskaum]

Doomguy777 said:

You don't get the idea do you? DOOM isn't an open-world game, and DOOM isn't linear either. It has levels with secret areas and the levels are big and are linear but have different areas and are kind of like a maze.

Don't take the Halo approach to consolize DOOM. Don't even bother trying to consolize it. Maybe add controller support and the like, but for crying out loud don't make it like Halo. This is a good example of what I would like to see from next DOOM game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-UjRPWHQa0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5u0rESeUgI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b4x9lpF8K4

Just face the reality, otherwise id will go bankrupt(although Zenimax is now banking them). PC can't sustain them alone anymore like it did in the 90s. Neglecting the console versions of DOOM means a suicidal decision in the current AAA gaming market.

They need to make it playable on consoles, I always played Serious on PC as well as D3 on PC. But SS is far, too far from being a top AAA shooter.

But if my PC don't run D(4) decently, based on the official requirements I plan playing it on PS4.

[Kaskaum]

After seeing some D3 mods of D1 and D2, I really hope they don't go to Mars again(I know that d2 happened on earth, but graphically it didn't show earth for you at all, the impression is that it was on mars - hell due to the usage of same graphics and textures as D1), try to make the game in a futuristic dystopian Earth.

[ChickenOrBeef]

Shaviro said:

It's written in a thread about how Doom would appeal to old fans/modern gamers. It's an angle on how it could compete for attention. How it plays exactly as well as internal game mechanics is a little less important in that aspect.

But how does your idea grab attention? With that post, you're not describing anything unique. All you're describing is a story-driven shooter that uses the aesthetics of Doom.

I'm advocating for an emphasis on certain aspects of the classic Doom gameplay. You've challenged those ideas by saying nothing from the classic gameplay should be used. So now I'm asking you what would be a better idea. I think that's a fair question.

[Five Magics]

Doomguy777 said:

But no, you guys are so relentless, so cruel, so alien, that you must change the very game that is DOOM.

Calm down kiddo, It's just a video game. No need to start crying over other peoples opinions.

Believe it or not Doomguy777, not everybody thinks the same way you do. And thank fuck for that, so get the hell over it.

[Kaskaum]

If Destiny crushes CoD: AW in sales as some analysts predict, its time for Infinity Ward and Treyarth to go to the open world route + coop in CoD too (although Activision will win either way because they publish both games).

I feel that Destiny will bring everything that I always thought Rage lacks:

- Focus on community(open world in which all players live(MMO) + FPS + classic RPG elements);
- A lot of coop dungeon content like missions(simpler missions with 3 player group and harder ones with 6 player group);
- RPG elements as I stated above: different classes, many skills depending on your class which allows different specs, level, weapons and armors progression.

[Shaviro]

ChickenOrBeef said:

But how does your idea grab attention? With that post, you're not describing anything unique. All you're describing is a story-driven shooter that uses the aesthetics of Doom.

The angle doesn't have to be unique to be successful. If all you got out of it was "story-driven shooter with the aesthetics of Doom", you should go back and read it again :) I'm describing a certain angle in game storytelling that focuses on the experience. In this case, going with less of a "one man kicking the ass of hell" and more with a personal side to the invasion, depicting the devastation and the loss. All this from the eyes of the player. If you're going to completely skip all the details in the pretty long post, I don't see the point of writing another detailed post for you on game mechanics.

I'm advocating for an emphasis on certain aspects of the classic Doom gameplay. You've challenged those ideas by saying nothing from the classic gameplay should be used. So now I'm asking you what would be a better idea. I think that's a fair question.

I don't know where you got that from. Earlier in this thread I wrote about a few aspects of classic Doom you could bring forward. It was even in a reply to one of your posts - to which you agreed. What aspects are you advocating to put emphasis on?

[DooM_RO]

Doom is a gameplay-driven game but I have no objections to a story. However, story-driven shooters have a tendency to break the flow of the game because the thing they are trying to tell is "soooo" important (Like in Bioshock Infinite). How could id make a good story without compromising the gameplay and its flow?

[Avoozl]

Doom technically already has a story, there's just certain parts of it which you don't see happen.

However things like witnessing the world slowly changing to a demonic form before your eyes would be cool, but of course Doom 4's story won't be like Doom 2's.

[Doomguy777]

Five Magics said:

Calm down kiddo, It's just a video game. No need to start crying over other peoples opinions.

Believe it or not Doomguy777, not everybody thinks the same way you do. And thank fuck for that, so get the hell over it.

It's just a video game.... eh? From what I know, and from what the community knows... DOOM is more than just a video game. DOOM is an experience. The original DOOM was just so good, so amazing. It was an experience. Not a video game. The same goes for Wolfenstein 3D, Quake 1, and Half-Life 1.

Yeah I know not everybody thinks like me. Some people here just don't want innovation. Some people just want DOOM to become another stupid modern cookie-cutter shooter (stares at Kaskaum). I loved Black Mesa for Half-Life 2 by the way, it goes to show what kind of reimagining DOOM needs....

[Shaviro]

DooM_RO said:

Doom is a gameplay-driven game but I have no objections to a story. However, story-driven shooters have a tendency to break the flow of the game because the thing they are trying to tell is "soooo" important (Like in Bioshock Infinite). How could id make a good story without compromising the gameplay and its flow?

Doom was one thing. Doom2 was another. Doom3 was way different. Doom(4) will probably be even more different. Doom *is* not. Doom *was* something and Doom *will* be something. What defines Doom is now 1 and 2 decades old and the way the video game industry has changed over time, those things will mean less and less as they don't really apply to how the world looks today.

I'm all for looking at what Doom was and bring forward some of the traits, but only those that will suit whatever new direction or angle you(id) would set up. As to how they could create a good story without compromising the "gameplay", well I still don't acknowledge the word "gameplay" as anything other than a simplified term for the entire experience you have playing the game. I don't see it as a separate module, but rather the conclusion of the work you've put into the game. It's the only way that term makes sense. The story is and should be a part of the "gameplay". Whatever you want to convey in the story should be reflected in your gameworld on screen. Preferrably in the order of "Subject, don't show" over "Show don't tell" over "tell". The features and different play styles should be derived from your story setup. If part of your story is deimos disappearing from the sky, then show deimos disappearing from the sky. Better yet, have the player be ON deimos while it happens and subject him to whatever changes in logic, action and movement this "going to hell" trip has.

If your story isn't intrusive, then I'm not sure you have one at all. This of course doesn't mean that you should have a cutscene every 5 meters of hallway. That's a rather absurd assumption. There are as many ways to tell a story as there are stories to tell. As for how explicitly they could do this, well a keywords could be;

1. Depend less on constant bombarding action like in Wolf TNO and Bioshock Infinite.
2. Leave more to the player to explore.
3. Go with a lower number of different locations (Wolf has many) and less (but more substantial) key points in the story.
4. Only leave first person view when absolutely necessary.
5. Work towards having as little monologue-time towards the player as possible (bad examples being HL2, Quake4 and Prey). Push the info out into scripted backdrop scenes and more condensed dialogue.

I think what lies at the core of all of this is to work at blending the whole experience a little more, so it's less of "SHOOTIN' TIME" and "STORY TIME" and more of a seamless experience.

[DooM_RO]

Tired of all the annoying Fallout retards on your Doom and Wolfenstein videos?

This video is for you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qh48Zeqh2s

[Kaskaum]

DooM_RO said:

Tired of all the annoying Fallout retards on your Doom and Wolfenstein videos?

This video is for you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qh48Zeqh2s

Fallout makes more money and currently has more fans than Doom and Wolfen together, Fallout is a 10+ million selling mark game as well as Elder Scrolls.

The point is if id can not only bring Doom this the current gen, but also makes a shooter that can brand a generation as Half-life - Halo were to PS2 - XBOX gen, Bioshock and Halo 3 were to PS3 - X360 gen.

[DooM_RO]

Nono. My point is that on ever Wolfenstein and Doom video there are always a few retards who say "Why not Bethesda make Fallout 4 instead DURR", completely ignoring the fact that Bethesda are just publishers.

[Kaskaum]

DooM_RO said:

Nono. My point is that on ever Wolfenstein and Doom video there are always a few retards who say "Why not Bethesda make Fallout 4 instead DURR", completely ignoring the fact that Bethesda are just publishers.

They want a new Fallout at all costs that why they get angry for a Doom announcement instead of a Fallout, and selling wise, Fallout reaches 10 million+ mark, Wolfen sold at most 1.5-2 million in all platforms.

Wolfen was well received by critics, but still didn't reach the level of a Bioshock(1) to be a most wanted game for players.

[DooM_RO]

I've been thinking, Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons melds gameplay and story very beautifully, neither substituting one for another. Do you think Id could do something similar? I am not saying they should have two protagonists and should involve saving your father or whatever, my point is that the game has both elements in harmony with each other and PLAYING the game is never a chore (like in Bioshock Infinite). The story makes the gameplay better and vice-versa.

Kaskaum said:

They want a new Fallout at all costs that why they get angry for a Doom announcement instead of a Fallout, and selling wise, Fallout reaches 10 million+ mark, Wolfen sold at most 1.5-2 million in all platforms.

Wolfen was well received by critics, but still didn't reach the level of a Bioshock(1) to be a most wanted game for players.

Fallout 3 is MASSIVELY overrated.

[Marnetmar]

Doomguy777 said:

It's just a video game.... eh? From what I know, and from what the community knows... DOOM is more than just a video game. DOOM is an experience. The original DOOM was just so good, so amazing. It was an experience. Not a video game. The same goes for Wolfenstein 3D, Quake 1, and Half-Life 1.

Yeah I know not everybody thinks like me. Some people here just don't want innovation. Some people just want DOOM to become another stupid modern cookie-cutter shooter (stares at Kaskaum). I loved Black Mesa for Half-Life 2 by the way, it goes to show what kind of reimagining DOOM needs....

Go away.

[Obzen]

If a game like Titanfall can work on consoles, with its incredibly fast movement speed and wall-running and double jumping, why the hell can't Doom be fast? Why does Doom have to convince the player to be emotionally invested with an engrossing story? Doom has always told it's story through level design and atmosphere, excluding Doom 3. I am very curious why so many seem to think that an over the top arcade/action shooter should conform to the stylings of story driven FPS/RPGs.

People seem to assume that because a certain type of game is popular that every other game should be just like it, otherwise it fails. Who thought Borderlands was going to take off before it came out, right smack in the middle of CoD mania? How about a game like Deus Ex: Human Revolution? A stealth-action RPG that should be the definition of niche? How about Demon's Souls? A brutally hard and slow paced dark-fantasy action game pretty much devoid of story?

Doom's sensibilities and original design philosophy are already established to carve out a very unique section of gaming. There is a huge hunger out there for games for gameplay's sake. All you need to do is look at the success the Demon's/Dark Souls games have had. This can apply to Doom, and really is the only way I can see this franchise being successful. id Software already are well aware they made a mistake with Doom 3 by chasing the "mainstream" and incorporating "modern" mechanics and narrative. I don't see how they could possibly make that mistake twice.

[DooM_RO]

Doom 3 was not modern at all...

[Obzen]

In a pre-Half Life 2 world, it was plenty modern. Linear, story-driven, heavily scripted, drew influence from Half-Life and System Shock 2... the two games that really shaped what was considered a "modern" shooter circa 2003/2004. By today's standards, it's still pretty old-school, yeah.