Julian Assange is a WMD in human form

[myk]

fraggle said:
I kind of miss the old site and I'm not really sure why they've changed it.

That's hinted at in the interview. They were getting too much data to go over (possibly lots of misleading or useless data.) They must have gotten particularly good higher level contacts along the way, or specialized skills or resources, and decided it was much more effective and grand to concentrate in that direction that a generic open approach. This makes it less open, at least, if it isn't motivated by some obscure agenda.

Partition36 said:
This is basically security through obscurity, which eventually fails.

But he referred to the moral aspect of everyone acting like they've got shit stains to hide in their undies, and where the leaky stuff (ew) is itself marginalized.

Another problem is that the obscurity is also practiced though bulk information management to deny what's exposed, and by timing. Bullshit data combined with quick actions allow groups with enough power to do things even when it quickly becomes clear their data is wrong. In this sense, obscurity doesn't need to succeed to work.

As Assange says in the interview, hacking and leaking "lubricates" business, giving room for its practice for many purposes. That other hacker that works for the US government "on the other side" appears in the article to illustrate this. There should be many in betweens. After all, the art of hacking is often used to con people, and there's little reason to think enterprises will just use it defensively or for "security". But the way Assange says it, it's kind of creepy.

Quasar said:
Politics is about protecting money.

What you're doing there is bastardizing a term, and in that bastardization, there's an ideological ingredient. The result is that, the nastiness of much of politics notwithstanding (much like the nastiness in many aspects of life), people using the term like that take politics as a whole as something ultimately vile and all that remains to salvage is one's own interests. As Thomas Mann said (probably paraphrasing someone else) politics is everything, and as Plato said, if you don't get into politics, someone worse will most likely do so in your place.

[Quasar]

myk said:

What you're doing there is bastardizing a term, and in that bastardization, there's an ideological ingredient. The result is that, the nastiness of much of politics notwithstanding (much like the nastiness in many aspects of life), people using the term like that take politics as a whole as something ultimately vile and all that remains to salvage is one's own interests. As Thomas Mann said (probably paraphrasing someone else) politics is everything, and as Plato said, if you don't get into politics, someone worse will most likely do so in your place.

Overall that is true. It's just that politics of the modern age have become mostly about protecting the monied interests that elect the politicians.

[Use]

fraggle said:

Does anyone remember when "terrorist" meant someone who - you know - actually carried out terrorist acts? ... That's what the word means, right? When did "terrorist" become a catch-all phrase for "enemies of or threats to America"?

When? That would be Sept. 11, 2001. Now if anything comes along that might undermine anyone's idea of freedom we can ban it, torture it, or imprison it without due process. It's great!

[Graf Zahl]

Quasar said:

Overall that is true. It's just that politics of the modern age have become mostly about protecting the monied interests that elect the politicians.

Hasn't that always been the case? The major difference today is that despite all the attempts it's much harder to keep the ugly stuff secret anymore.

[Csonicgo]

And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall get the truthteller 52 years in the slammer. Mike Huckabee is saying that Bradley should be executed.

And Assange is calling for Clinton's resignation. Wooow.


Can anyone send washington butthurt report forms?

[Mr. Freeze]

Csonicgo said:

Mike Huckabee is saying that Bradley should be executed.

SPOLIERS: No one with a IQ over room temperature takes that fat fuck seriously at all. He's a joke even in his own crowd.

And Bradley could be set free and it wouldn't matter. He's at least getting smacked with a Dishonorable Discharge, which will effectively limit him to sweeping floors for the rest of his life. Additional punishment is moot.

[Csonicgo]

Mr. Freeze said:

SPOLIERS: No one with a IQ over room temperature takes that fat fuck seriously at all. He's a joke even in his own crowd.
.

iirc he nabbed the southern states in the 2008 primaries. that's no joke.

[Graf Zahl]

I think that clearly tells who the real joke are.

[Mr. Freeze]

Graf Zahl said:

I think that clearly tells who the real joke are.

Ding ding ding ding

Huckabee is just another Big Government stooge, but he happens to be Republican. Therefore he can do no wrong, at least according to his supporters.

[Colusio]

A good coder but as said before full of himself

[GreyGhost]

dew said:

the typical american patriot probably won't even notice this, because he's too busy accusing an australian citizen of treason to usa

Heh - they could at least have the decency to wait until we've been formally incorporated as the 51st, 52nd or whatever state.

[Mr. Freeze]

I just heard that Wikileaks has several editors trying to retract information that could lead to the harm of innocents and service members. If that's true, I retract my earlier statements and would seriously reconsider my positions on the matter.

[Remilia Scarlet]

In related news, it turns out that Wikileaks was hosted by Amazon's EC2 platform. They've since left (articles here and here, with Wikileak's tweet here) and gone back to Europe with a different host. This probably explains why I've had problems connecting to them this morning.

[Csonicgo]

It's not just Huckabee!

[GreyGhost]

Shoot the messenger or admit to less than exemplary behaviour - that's a tough choice.

[Aliotroph?]

Looks like he thought he was being funny. Though, since conservatives in Canada tend not to believe in due process of any kind, it wouldn't surprise me either way.

[Kirby]

Aliotroph? said:

Looks like he thought he was being funny. Though, since conservatives in Canada tend not to believe in due process of any kind, it wouldn't surprise me either way.

It seems that way, though the way he talks though the rest of the conversation makes it seem like he certainly wouldn't mind seeing it happen at heart.

[AveryMaurice]

As said before, if they did nothing wrong, they would have nothing to fear. I believe what hes doing is amazing, the fact that in a few seconds you can search thousands upon thousands of classified military documents is mind blowing on its own. As to the rape thing, I don't believe it one bit.

As to the ego, Its not uncommon. The founders of the Pirate Bay and the Pirate Party which hosts Wikileaks content share the same attitude.

[Remilia Scarlet]

AveryMaurice said:

As to the ego, Its not uncommon. The founders of the Pirate Bay and the Pirate Party which hosts Wikileaks content share the same attitude.

In the world he's from, I think that sort of ego is a common thing. My only fear (and apparently also that of his mother) is that it will end up getting him into something that's too big for him to handle. But then again, I guess that's where the rest of the wikileaks team comes in.

[Radon]

All in all, I want to buy this guy a drink. By now, most likely our conversation would be under record. I'll take this chance just to say... Interception! Now our side has the ball, Up yours Cheney! :)

[kb1]

Maes said:

Sorry, but Manifest Destiny is long dead, and the only ones truly showing unconditional love and support for the USA are some thirld-world 51-st state wannabes like Albania and Kosovo, and then only because they happen to be particularly favored as of now.

I have unconditional love and support for the USA. It's real easy to talk a bunch of crap, but, how many countries actually attempt to defend other countries? Send troops, food, medical aid, assistance, etc.? How many countries send money to feed and clothe? How many attempt to actually further mankind? Go forth into space? How many countries take American money, aid, and technology for granted? How many countries would let an asshole like Julian Assange exist?

America is completely made up of immigrants. To hate America is to hate yourself. Grow the fuck up, damn. (not necessarily directed at any one person). Today's youth is so bullshitted into believing this garbage. Seek what's in your heart, not some crap someone told you. There's the truth, and then there's 1,000 interpretations that all sound different...but there's only one real truth.

Be prepared to realize that the way you always believed things to be just might not be the way they actually are.

[exp(x)]

kb1 said:

It's real easy to talk a bunch of crap, but, how many countries actually attempt to defend other countries? Send troops, food, medical aid, assistance, etc.? How many countries send money to feed and clothe? How many attempt to actually further mankind? Go forth into space? How many countries take American money, aid, and technology for granted? How many countries would let an asshole like Julian Assange exist?

I don't know, why don't you do some research and tell us how many countries do that stuff. Not that all of it is quite as noble as you think.

[GreyGhost]

kb1 said:

how many countries actually attempt to defend other countries?

If there's no threat to national security, nothing to be gained and no mutual defence treaty involved - none at all.

Send troops, food, medical aid, assistance, etc.?

As a part of UN-mandated peacekeeping and relief operations - dozens.

How many countries send money to feed and clothe?

More than you probably realise - it's the easiest way to send aid.

How many attempt to actually further mankind?

<citation needed>

Go forth into space?

Who could forget Sputnik? Guess who'll be doing all the heavy lifting after April 2011.

How many countries take American money, aid, and technology for granted?

The UN doesn't take that money for granted, aid recipients usually can't afford to be choosy and technology's available to all - for a price.

How many countries would let an asshole like Julian Assange exist?

If you're familiar with the proverb "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" you can answer that yourself. In any case the Administration's hamstrung by it's own laws and protocols, so apart from issuing an executive order to the CIA for Assange's termination with extreme prejudice or shutting down the DNS root servers, there's not much that can be done to silence him.

[dew]

kb1 said:

Be prepared to realize that the way you always believed things to be just might not be the way they actually are.

the irony of this could be mined and weaponized.

[Remilia Scarlet]

kb1 said:

America is completely made up of immigrants.

So... what about all those Native Americans? You know, the ones we sort of screwed.

[Aliotroph?]

They're immigrants too. They just didn't write anything down, so they forgot.

@kb1: How is hating America hating myself? Because there are Canadians there? Does this mean you shouldn't hate places like Iran because Americans are there? But of course you unconditionally support America's positions, so you have to hate Iran. Your head a splode.

But that aside, I don't hate America. I hate elements of it. Some of those are things I hate about other countries, some are unique, and some are shared by all of humanity. America's biggest win is it has a huge number of people who honestly try to make it the land where you are free to do/think/create as you please.

[Maes]

kb1 said:

I have unconditional love and support for the USA.

Because you're either trolling, incredibly naive, or a shill/agent/psyop executor. And unfortunately, it's never easy to tell who is what.

kb1 said:

but, how many countries actually attempt to defend other countries?

All those inside some form of alliance do, but I don't see how it's pertinent to the issue of kissing the US's ass.

kb1 said:

Send troops, food, medical aid, assistance, etc.? How many countries send money to feed and clothe?

You're lagging behind the times. And even that one plan was neither disinterested nor unconditional. For the rest, the US did exactly the opposite and created much more misery, hunger, dictatorships and persecutions that far outweighed any -limited and heavily causal- aid they might have sent anyone.

kb1 said:

How many attempt to actually further mankind?

As far as I can tell, every nation always tried to divert water to power their own mills, so to speak, but feel free to contraddict me.

kb1 said:

Go forth into space?

Aside from the USA, the former USSR and now Europe, India, Japan and China. And I'm probably omitting a few here.

kb1 said:

How many countries take American money, aid, and technology for granted?

Only those licking their assholes. As I said, none of that is given away in an unconditional and disinterested way.

kb1 said:

How many countries would let an asshole like Julian Assange exist?

Those without exposed nerves to strike and skeletons in the closet, apparently.

kb1 said:

America is completely made up of immigrants. To hate America is to hate yourself.

Ah that bedtime story again...the last of the waves of immigration that "built america" ended up at most 100 years ago, and the last vestiges of immigration ended soon after the Korean war. Today the US is a much more closed system than e.g. the EU and most of the immigration they have to concern themselves with is illegal immigration from Mexico. Quite a far cry from the the romantic stories of immigrants seeking a better fortune elsewhere.

The only European people I ever spoke to that had such an idealized and romanticized view of the US were inevitably elderly people that survived WW II and witnessed liberation at hands of the US troops (and the subsequent aids through the Marshall plans). But newer generations...none has anything positive to say about the US.

Only places like Albania benefitted cleanly from US policies today, but they were poor bastards with nothing to lose that decided to jump on the winning bandwagon anyway, so they don't count. Oh and maybe Israel. All the rest would likely thrive with the US out of the way.

[Never_Again]

kb1 said:

...but there's only one real truth.

Be prepared to realize that the way you always believed things to be just might not be the way they actually are.

Like the real truth is spelled لا إله إلا الله

[Sharessa]

I have complete love and support for America, as a country. The government, on the other hand is full of fail and is ripping the country to fucking shreds. It needs a swift kick in the nuts, and I think this could be just the thing to do it.

[myk]

kb1 said:
Send troops, food, medical aid, assistance, etc.? How many countries send money to feed and clothe? How many attempt to actually further mankind? Go forth into space?

Many, and often without the economic or patronization benefits accrued by central powers when they do it. Others gain much less from it, as they don't have a bunch of military bases around the world to ensure their place as "world cops" and their military hegemony.

How many countries take American money, aid, and technology for granted?

And the associated conditioning? Indeed, that it's taken for granted is a problem that should be taken care of.

How many countries would let an asshole like Julian Assange exist?

Note that killing him would have pretty nasty side effects, potentially worse than anything he could say, thus limiting any intent to do away with him. It's not due to kindness that he isn't eliminated. And since he's revealing "dirty laundry" that is mostly from other countries or organizations, the US isn't the only country or entity that might believe to gain something from shutting him up.

America is completely made up of immigrants. To hate America is to hate yourself.

Why is that, the aborigines were exterminated completely? Heh, I thought there were some left, at least a while ago :p

Today's youth is so bullshitted into believing this garbage. Seek what's in your heart, not some crap someone told you. There's the truth, and then there's 1,000 interpretations that all sound different...but there's only one real truth.

Be prepared to realize that the way you always believed things to be just might not be the way they actually are.

Haha, thank you kind sir, not many shoot their own arguments in the foot in such a blatantly fundamental manner. You nuked them off the face of the planet!