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Katamori

Do you make more WADs in the same time?

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Sometimes happens, when I already made a WAD in progress, I had another idea, and I started that, but I forgot the previous work. Now I want to make a megaWAD, but I have another idea, and I want to make both stuff without abandon anything.
What do you think, it' possible? Have you ever finished 2 or more megaWADs in the same time?

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Well, IF it's possible, you could merge some of your more compatible ideas you've made up. I personally think you shouldn't juggle more than three WADs at the same time unless you really can do them at once. Most people take forever with just one.

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To avoid feeling burnt out, it may actually be best to have more than one project in progress at any given time. An "ideal" wad design process includes concept work, rough gameplay drafting, early gameplay testing and revisions, resource licensing and production, designing architecture and scenery, texturing, decorating, getting external input, late gameplay testing and revisions, compatibility testing, and etc. Each of these stages can become boring on their own so you could take a break by working on another project at some other stage of development.

Of course, the design process that most people use nowadays is "open editor, draw sectors, place monsters, upload" which isn't quite as time-consuming, so having multiple projects in progress so that each one can be a break from the other isn't quite as important.

Only crazy people make megawads.

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Vaporizer said:

I personally can't understand why everyone wants to make their projects into 32 maps long megwads. Does megawad mean "automatically awesome" or something.

Exactly. I can't imagine Equinox having more than it's 13 maps it already has. It's so perfectly crafted, there'd be no point in adding another level or two. Megawads are cool, but sometimes a simple 5-map level set can be much more than a 32 megawad.

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Creaphis said:

Only crazy people make megawads.


It's true. Just do something small so people don't forget you exist.

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Well, I'm crazy :Đ but I decided that a long time ago: I want to make a megaWAD, and I'll make!

Also, thanks for your advices.

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I'm not sure. I really do like megawads because it feels like an entire adventure. It's like you covered a lot of ground and conquered an entire territory, where a short episode is quite literally a short episode.

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Heh...it's a pretty interesting debate.Whenever it's a small level set (1-10) I tend to think "that was awesome,I wish it was longer...".However,with megawads it's the other way around.I tend to get bored,especially as I get to the latter maps,and usually tend to be like "glad this is over with" when I finish them.So I think it's best to have small level sets.

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killer2 said:

Heh...it's a pretty interesting debate.Whenever it's a small level set (1-10) I tend to think "that was awesome,I wish it was longer...".However,with megawads it's the other way around.I tend to get bored,especially as I get to the latter maps,and usually tend to be like "glad this is over with" when I finish them.So I think it's best to have small level sets.


Out of curiosity: what megawads bore you in the latter maps?

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I probably have about 15 times as many unfinished maps as finished ones because I constantly start new ones.

As far as legitimate projects, I usually have more than one. This is probably because I take forever on them and what creaphis mentioned: It can get tedious. Also I think your efficiency goes down if you dwell on the same issue for too long - like coming up with new ideas. Sometimes you really need to take a break.

Another problem, which some members here don't have to deal with, is that thing called "RL" (hint: not the rocket launcher). I was supposed to be working on a map for this project for the last week but then I became preoccupied with school work. So the people who make megawads may be crazy, but also they may have more time on their hads if they happen to be under 17 and/or without a job/school

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Some things are fine as episodes while others are fine as mega WADs. I enjoyed things like Dystopia 3 and Enigma as episodes, but I also like things like Memento Mori and Requiem, where it involves many designers' works. Though there are few who actually undertake mega WADs as a solo project, Scythe and Doom II Reloaded proves to me that it can still be fun; even as an individually developed mega WAD.

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darkreaver said:

Out of curiosity: what megawads bore you in the latter maps?

Epic2,Alien Vendetta,Neodoom,Memento Mori
On the other hand,I tend to enjoy short wads like Bakers Dozen,Hellground,many 1 map wads,Uac Ultra,Claustrophobia,(the walls close in),Deus Vult.I think my ideal play time is 22 maps (20 maps + 2 secret),but it also depends on the maps' length and how different is one from another.

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Katamori said:

Have you ever finished 2 or more megaWADs in the same time?

I can't even finish a single map, and megawads are impossible for such a detail freak like me. Your method of mapping is all too familiar for me, I do exactly the same thing. I start on a map, and when its halfway done I start on something else and sort of abandon the other map I was working on.

Sometimes I miss vanilla mapping, that used to be less time consuming. I think that all the excessive detailing I put in my maps is one of the biggest reasons why I lose interest in it long before its completed. Progress on a map just takes far longer because of all that extra effort you put into detailing.

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dutch devil said:

I can't even finish a single map, and megawads are impossible for such a detail freak like me. Your method of mapping is all too familiar for me, I do exactly the same thing. I start on a map, and when its halfway done I start on something else and sort of abandon the other map I was working on.

Sometimes I miss vanilla mapping, that used to be less time consuming. I think that all the excessive detailing I put in my maps is one of the biggest reasons why I lose interest in it long before its completed. Progress on a map just takes far longer because of all that extra effort you put into detailing.


Is it weird I really enjoy the detailing process? With the way I map now, I don't even bother leaving it to last - I detail as I go.

I also try and make maps that I really, really don't want to see unfinished. I think that's why I used to give up on my older maps - I'd start stuff which, at least in my mind, wasn't all that exciting. There's also what I've just decided to call the 'detailing wall'. You've been detailing for hours, if not days, and shit, it just doesn't feel you'll ever be done. (But man, the feeling if you break through that wall and finish something...)

I'm also really happy I decided to abandon any 'themes' that last for more than one map, and some cases, not even that. It's certainly helped keep me motivated because I'm always excited regarding what I'm mapping, and what I'm going to map next too. Whether or not I'll last the full 32 maps, I don't know, but I'm certainly not bored yet.

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I often find that when I play MegaWads I tend to get bored somewhere in between level 10 to level 20, unless theyre really unique like, for example sonic Doom, where every 2 levels covered a different theme. I much prefer short epsiodes which is another reason why I prefer Doom over Doom2. The only downside is that all weapons/items are lost which did make scythe 2 a bit tedious.

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The first Scythe was very fun. Scythe 2 bored me to death, and the first two episodes of Scythe X were just different variations of the same level with tekgreen, I don't even know how I got to level 7.

If I'm going to play a 32 level megawad, I need variety, in both level design and in gameplay. The last 32 level megawad that felt like an epic adventure was Alien Vendetta, because the themes kept changing and a lot of the levels were very unique and had some very fun action. And while the theme was changing, the quality remained very consistant, and the designs were very memorable and it didn't feel just like a collection of levels thrown together. This is also why I enjoyed DooM 2, because it had variety.

I guess as long as authors keep being anal about theme consistancy with no regard for diversity, I'll continue to hold AV, MM series, Requiem as my all time favorites.

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Sorry for the double post, but I'd just like to add to my previous message that a few really great levels that hit the spot, is better than 32 good levels. Quality > Quantity.

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I don't know why, but the WADs which contains less than 25-30 levels, I feel unfinished work. I hate wtaching the original levels, if I finished the regular levels. Thirty-two places of levels give a great challange for mappers, and lots of facilities for players. So I don't care the quality, because next level may be better!

Also, I don't know many bad megaWAD, only 1337, UAC Military Nightmare, Killing Adventures, Nazi Auferstehung, and some nameless projects (e.g. Beastia 2)

However, I like some WADs, which not megaWADs, e.g. Doomguy's Pimp ventures 2, It only gets worse, facepalm.WAD, D'Sparil Labs (for Heretic), etc.

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Megawads don't interest me. I never play further than the first 10 maps into them before I forget all about them. They never have anything that makes the theme go forward so it's almost always a jumbled collection of maps that have nothing in particular in common.

Despite not actually enjoying Daedalus (so many things wrong with that project it's not even funny), I did finish it. Because there was a reason for the maps to be together.

When I make maps, I usually work on several maps consecutively. Usually I also work on several projects consecutively as well.

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Actually I have my work Five Places 10 level teaser almost done, just fixing some aesthetics on a few levels and finishing the last ones. The levels so far are also semi-classic and semi-basic (excluding a couple of used slants and maybe some scripts), but the E2-E5 levels will be more overdetailed than the earlier ones, so it would consume much more time. IOT not being tedious and still making some basic references, I'll start and develop Ultimate Showdown (a 4-level megaWAD based on the idea of 2002ADO) and will be making it parallelly with the last four episodes of Five Places.

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a 4-episode megaWAD

Fixed now, I'm just too confused due to suckin homeworks.

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kristus said:

Megawads don't interest me. I never play further than the first 10 maps into them before I forget all about them. They never have anything that makes the theme go forward so it's almost always a jumbled collection of maps that have nothing in particular in common.


This is exactly how I feel about megawads now - especially one-man megawads. Even if a megawad has an interesting theme or style it becomes stagnant some time during the slow shuffle to level thirty. For a one- or two-person megawad to keep me interested it has to have lots of variety and extremely strong gameplay (eg. Kama Sutra).

I still enjoy community megawads, though, because of their grab-bag, thematically incoherent nature. You can get the same enjoyment playing these wads as you can downloading random levels from /newstuff - they're a source of constant novelty. Even still, it's unlikely I'll play them all the way through; I'll close Doom once I've had my fill of scattered ideas, and then I might just never load these wads again, as their nature provides me no special reason to do so.

In my mind, the episode format is ideal. Episodes are long enough for there to be room for some progression, but not so long that they need to repeat themselves. Scythe II is one of my favourite megawads - the five-level episode format keep it fresh and interesting. Most of the projects that have made the biggest impressions on me, though, are episodes: Equinox and Back to Basics come immediately to mind.

kristus said:

consecutively


You mean concurrently. Sorry Kristus, I can't always resist my grammar-nazi impulses.

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Creaphis said:

You mean concurrently. Sorry Kristus, I can't always resist my grammar-nazi impulses.

oops

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Heh, I don't have enough fingers to count how many different wads I'm "making" right now. Remind me to finish one of them some time.

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I can only really work on one map at a time. That being said, I do tend to finish maps for other projects before finishing off something else I'm currently working on.

That being said, me working on a megawad is more a reflection of personal desire than on a basis of "what's cool to do," so to speak. After 10 maps, though, I'm beginning to realize what an redonkulous undertaking it really is. Also, I do feel concerned that UR is going to fall into monotony, which is (a small) part of the reason why it's completely stalled right now. I'm trying to think of how I can execute the second episode to have a sort of theme, but a theme that's easy to think up variations for. Right now, it's sort of, "Outdoors: slime, blood, ice" in that order. Which, if I can find a good way to break down those 3 into sub-themes, then I'm set.

Insane_Gazebo said:

Is it weird I really enjoy the detailing process? With the way I map now, I don't even bother leaving it to last - I detail as I go.


I'm not a big fan of the detailing process and that's why I detail as I go.

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dutch devil said:

Sometimes I miss vanilla mapping, that used to be less time consuming. I think that all the excessive detailing I put in my maps is one of the biggest reasons why I lose interest in it long before its completed. Progress on a map just takes far longer because of all that extra effort you put into detailing.


Have you considered mapping for Doom the Way Id Did?

It really forces you to change how you usually approach mapping in favor of creating something that is identical to the feel of the IWADs without actually being the same maps. I think that project has changed my viewpoints of maps these days.

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