Duke Never Comes Early

[bytor]

Woolie Wool said:

For an example of actual old-fashioned masculinity, here's "The Code of the Knights", part of Lord Baden Powell's handbook that became the basis for the Scouting movement:

Beautiful! :~)

Censorship is not the way, though.

Choice.

[kristus]

Enjay said:

Do you have a source for that? If it's real I'd love to be able to use that myself.

It was something I was told as a part of a lecture at my Uni last course I did. So I could probably dig it out.

[Woolie Wool]

bytor said:

Beautiful! :~)

Censorship is not the way, though.

Choice.

Censorship by whom? Calling someone out and accusing them of being offensive is not censorship if you don't have the power of law behind you. Of course Australia's going to ban it, but Australia was going to ban it anyway so it's not like anything changes. Remember freedom of speech cuts both ways--if you can say something, others can say something about what you said.

[Maes]

Woolie Wool said:

Shouldn't manly men beat up people who can actually fight back?

Try tell that to the countless bullies, hooligans, chavs, squarebadges, mercs, etc.

I'll agree that the culture of machismo, which the Duke is a parody of, is quite different than the virtuous Hollywood-type hero you described, and closer to the vices and more flaws that are usually ascribed to the villains.

But in real life the distinction is often blurred, and a certain "macho attitude" is condoned and even expected from certain professional e.g. professional wrestlers, martial artists, cops, soldiers etc. You will almost never find the spotless Hollywood-type paladin hero you depicted in real life, at least not in roles where physical action, quick thinking, and a certain amount of cojones and assertiveness is needed.

The very same reasons that would lead a man to be as "morally sound" as the Hollywood hero you described, would also prevent him from ever becoming anything close to an action hero (or villain) in real life, sorry. Hell, such a person would not have the necessary cojones and arrogance to become a lawyer, let alone go out and beat bad guys face to face.

No actual cop would just walk upfront a bunch of gangsters fair and square, flash them his shiny badge and tell them "you are under arrest" with a virtuous voice, because he would probably be killed and his colleagues would not back him up because he would be a "liability" to them all. Instead, a seasoned cop would "play dirty" tricks and tactics at the same level as the gangsters (think undercover ops, interrogations etc.)

Similarly, a riot control cop would never throw away his riot gear, shield, body armor, gun, tear gas etc. and challenge a rioter, fair and square, to duke it out in a match of "noble art" gentlemen's boxing. Instead, he would gladly open the head even of an unarmed 16 yo girl with his baton without thinking about it, and, more importantly, without being reprimanded, and without even considering that he has done something "unmanly", like it or not.

OK, I digressed a bit, but like it or not, Duke is a macho hero in all senses of the word, he's not a civil rights activist (hell, even THOSE are more vicious, aggressive and assertive than the Hollywood type hero you described!) or Mother Teresa.

However, he's not an anti-hero either, as his "flaws" come out mostly as an exaggerated sexist parody of machismo rather than e.g. having had a dark past with drugs, a personal tragedy/trauma or some heinous crime behind him.

TL; DR: The Duke is simply that: an egomaniac, narcissistic macho thug, a relic of another era, and we love him for that. That certainly doesn't make him a "hero for all the family" in the good, clean, Hollywood sense, but certainly not a dark and negative anti-hero, either.

[DoomUK]

Maes said:

or Mother Teresa.

Some might beg to differ on that one. At least Duke doesn't masquerade as anything but an obnoxious, thuggish jackass.

[Maes]

DoomUK said:

Some might beg to differ on that one. At least Duke doesn't masquerade as anything but an obnoxious, thuggish, unsympathetic jackass.

Interesting read, I can actualy agree to some of his points, as I find such "benevolent figures" too good to be true myself, and I can't help but think that there's a darker underside even to them, usually more disturbing than what your average street thug would have to hide.

[Belial]

Woolie Wool said:

Also saying that something is tasteless, offensive, or stupid is not censorship, it's social disapproval. People have the right to be tasteless assholes, and other people have the right to call them tasteless assholes and refuse to buy their game. And that's what I'll do.

[Csonicgo]

TEAM DICKWOLVES HERE


Lol, Feminists.

[Creaphis]

There can be artistry in tastelessness. Tastelessness is another tool that can be used to call up new emotions, to make us think about our society and its norms, and to give us insight into different ways of living. Duke Nukem Forever won't necessarily be an artistic masterwork, but the fact that it's challenging our sensibilities even before release is commendable. Yes, it's perfectly appropriate to feel somewhat disgusted by the idea of slapping babes to keep them in line, but that might just be the whole point, just as the point of the civilian-slaughtering scene in Modern Warfare 2 was to be disgusted by your actions.

[DeathevokatioN]

Woolie Wool said:

Also saying that something is tasteless, offensive, or stupid is not censorship, it's social disapproval.

It's just a game. You give computer controlled AI that dresses up like girls a pat to keep them in line. Get over it.

[Captain Toenail]

It's a playful pat on the bum. The kind that would make the women in Duke's world giggle. He's not slapping anyone to keep them in line. How people are raging about this I don't know. I do think they may have gone too far with the sexual themes though in one level where you have to find sex toys, there's a hazy line where it's funny and it's a bit pathetic and embarrassing :/

[kristus]

Enjay said:

Do you have a source for that? If it's real I'd love to be able to use that myself.

Here's something. http://outofthejungle.blogspot.com/2007/11/socrates-objections-to-writing.html There's source given at the bottom of the page.

[40oz]

Woolie Wool said:

Shouldn't manly men beat up people who can actually fight back? Slapping helpless women doesn't make him a manly hero, it makes him a dishonorable little pussy who beats on the helpless.

Be it as it may, it should be obvious the kinda satire being delivered here. As you Duke Nukem loving pansies prowl around gaming websites looking up every little bit of info you can find about the game's progress, you repeatedly become sucked into the biggest publicity stunt to ever hit video game culture, showing no resistance to the commercialization of video games. Of course Duke Nukem isn't beating on those that fight back. He beats up on the helpless, i.e., the expansive consumer base that can't resist buying video games that over the past decade have virtually all been the same thing. I mean, just look at this box art. It's literally portrayed from the perspective of the consumer about to wrap their lips around his nutsack. I think this whole thing is really quite hilarious.

[Captain Toenail]

I agree the boxart is terrible, but I think you need to take your foil hat off :p

[DeathevokatioN]

Hahaha 40oz posts are priceless.

I really hope the gameplay is fun, and the layouts aren't linear.

[Jimmy]

DeathevokatioN said:

This might be the reason behind the delay.

http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/03/25/duke-nukem-dustup-games-capture-babe-mode-players-slapping-women/#

One Of Many Possible Responses

[SYS]

kristus said:

There will be "new media fear" surrounding video games until something else that is new comes up to take it's place. This has been the case ever since the written word was invented (An example of the original new media fear was Socrates worrying about the written language making people losing memory because they no longer would have to remember things by heart).

Spell checker hinders one's ability to spell shit correctly, and why remember anything when you can reference Google or the to do list in a smart phone? Not necessarily something to be fearful of, but Socrates wasn't entirely wrong. I'm certain there's sociologists that are fearful of the internet and videogames shaping people into socially inept, sociopathic mongloids, but here we are.

[Technician]

Postal 2 had Capture the babe. It also had hilarious announcements such as "enemy bitch was snatched" and "enemy hoe-bag returned".

I can't wait for Postal 3.

[_bruce_]

Be as macho as you can - but back it up.
There are also female machos out there and they are way cooler than Mrs. boring udder from next door.

[Technician]

Yeah, because Machismo, even when used as an over-the-top parody, is still a evil against females.

[Enjay]

kristus said:

Here's something. http://outofthejungle.blogspot.com/2007/11/socrates-objections-to-writing.html There's source given at the bottom of the page.

Aha! Thank you. It will come in useful. :D

[Whoo]

Not even a fake demo announcement today. Gearbox has broken the rules.

[UnendingRequiem]

Fox News HATES Duke Nukem, that means it must be good

[Radon]

UnendingRequiem said:

Fox News HATES Duke Nukem, that means it must be good

...That revelation came a little too late there sport.

[DoomUK]

Duke apparently has a thing for feces now...

EDIT: And I wouldn't be at all surprised if this actually made it into the game.

[Radon]

DoomUK said:

Duke apparently has a thing for feces now...

EDIT: And I wouldn't be at all surprised if this actually made it into the game.

It's been confirmed by ESRB that it is indeed in the game.

[Csonicgo]

DoomUK said:

Duke apparently has a thing for feces now...

EDIT: And I wouldn't be at all surprised if this actually made it into the game.

Best comment from the site:

What a fuckin' damn asshole shit! 12 year for those fuckin' low graphics and such a throwing shit-mode?

Fuckin' ugly stupid game!

Lol, already people are mad.

[ManCannon]

Whats wrong with slapping women?

[DeathevokatioN]

Hahaha, I don't know whats more funny. The shit. Or the people getting mad over the shit.

When this game comes out I'll record Duke throwing shit at women then send it to Fox News.

[J-selva]

DeathevokatioN said:

Hahaha, I don't know whats more funny. The shit. Or the people getting mad over the shit.

When this game comes out I'll record Duke throwing shit at women then send it to Fox News.

Please do.