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Blastfrog

Episodes 2 and 3 originally swapped?

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Something I've been wondering about: in Doom 1, were episodes 2 and 3 originally swapped? I think this because of 3 things:

The Cyberdemon is stronger than the Spider Mastermind
E2M2 was E3M2 and E3M5 was E2M5 in the press release beta (actual evidence suggesting these episodes may have indeed been in a different order at one time)
This matches up with the Doom Bible: Tech (Evil Unleashed), Hell (Lost in Hell), and Hellish Tech (Knee-deep in the dead). The final version was Tech (Knee-deep in the dead), Hellish Tech (The shores of Hell), and Hell (Inferno).

What do you think?

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You know, you do bring up some points worth thinking about. Then again with the bible comparison, Episode 3's namesake became current Episode 1.

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Sodaholic said:

This matches up with the Doom Bible: Tech (Evil Unleashed), Hell (Lost in Hell), and Hellish Tech (Knee-deep in the dead).


I guess, in that sense, DOOM³ was more in line with Tom Hall's original vision than DOOM was. Imagine that!

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I don't think there was any conscious episode swapping going on. The actual decision to go Phobos-Deimos-Hell was probably made early on when the plans diverged from the Doom Bible, and the map-changing was something along the lines that the second two episodes weren't as carefully planned as the first one (remember that Petersen was hired on the late-end of the development process) and maps were more or less put in wherever they seemed to fit at the time.


I just have a hard time imagining the Hell episode in any other place than the 3rd ('tis a fitting end setting). It's the maps that were swapped, not the eps.

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Well, weather fighting Spider Mastemind or Cyberdemon is easy depends much on enviroment. E2M8 killing of Cyberdemon is easy by just rocket spam on him in "ITTYD" difficulties, but a bit harder in UV since there's lost souls. E3M8 killing the Spider Mastermind needs to go on each side taking rockets and provide infighting deal to limited ammo, and sometimes it may recieve hitscan attack too. Of course, but taking a BFG at early stages can led E3M8 very easy. But somehow I do think that E3M8 a bit harder on UV because of hitscan attack and limited ammo. E2M8 just taking good care of lost souls first is already OK.

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Processingcontrol said:

I agree with what Xaser said, it's hard to imagine E3 before E2.

Also, the BFG appears in Inferno but not the Shores of Hell.


Interestingly though, the BFG is in the Shores of Hell on Playstation...

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The PlayStation also has DOOM II monsters and textures in the DOOM 1 episodes, so what's your point?

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One thing I've always found interesting is that the lumps for the Deimos Lab and Deimos Anomaly intermission name graphics are found at the end other registered name lumps, meaning they were probably added later.

In the pre-beta, the SKY2 patch/texture has blue mountains with Earth behind them. Makes me wonder if E2 was originally supposed to take place on Earth's moon, which would explain those two lumps being redone with new names.

There are only two sky textures defined though, so you can't really use them to say which episode was which. the SKY3 patch is an edit of SKY2, without the Earth. SKY4 is an awesome sandy landscape with thunderheads in the sky, clearly an earlier concept for Hell. SKY5 has four frames of animation, starting off as an extremely dark blue variant of SKY4 and brightening to the same colors from lightning strikes.

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Dragonsbrethren said:

SKY5 has four frames of animation, starting off as an extremely dark blue variant of SKY4 and brightening to the same colors from lightning strikes.


One of the DOOM alphas had data for animated skies? Oh, that would've been neat. At least DOOM 64 finally made that a reality.

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Megamur said:

One of the DOOM alphas had data for animated skies? Oh, that would've been neat. At least DOOM 64 finally made that a reality.

64's skies were overkill. I'd have settled for a scrolling bitmap.

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Dragonsbrethren said:

SKY4 is an awesome sandy landscape with thunderheads in the sky, clearly an earlier concept for Hell.

They look like the Inferno bird's eye view horizon.

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Dragonsbrethren said:

SKY4 is an awesome sandy landscape with thunderheads in the sky, clearly an earlier concept for Hell.


Can anyone link me to a picture of this?

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Megamur said:

I disagree.


It has like a hundred frames while most of the textures have 2 to 4

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40oz said:

It has like a hundred frames while most of the textures have 2 to 4


It wasn't "frames" at all. They were smooth, scrolling clouds, moving independently from the mountain range in the distance. It was a great effect that did a nice job of creating depth.

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40oz said:

It has like a hundred frames while most of the textures have 2 to 4

Aren't they procedurally generated? It's just the Absolution TC that actually uses a zillion bitmaps to animate the sky.

Unless your point is the fact that it's super-smooth while other animations aren't. To which I just give a bit "eh." I can't even remember what animated textures D64 has, if any.

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Xaser said:

I can't even remember what animated textures D64 has, if any.


Most of them were scrolling, not animated. The only animated textures I can remember off the top of my head were the faces that would occasionally scrunch up and look evil-er.

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