The Doom Confessional Booth

[baja blast rd.]

I'm mildly amused whenever someone casually mentions a run taking "a few hundred attempts" with a tone suggestive of that being a lot. E.g. from a quick search, someone talking about a NM Doom 1 episode run: "He probably made a hundred attempts and posted the one where he got lucky." Have even seen 'dozens' instead of 'hundreds' in these contexts. That run might look impressive, but it took DOZENS of tries! (Oh the formerhumanity.) 

 

Similarly exit rates. 1% isn't too bad. That usually means a few exits (at least) in a few hours of recording. Time spent? 30-60 minutes is hardly anything. 3-6 hours is still a pretty damn modest time commitment for a run. Lunch break for a week, heh. Some truly dedicated runners have stuff measured in triple-digit hours. 

[GarrettChan]

6 hours ago, rdwpa said:

E.g. from a quick search, someone talking about a NM Doom 1 episode run: "He probably made a hundred attempts and posted the one where he got lucky." Have even seen 'dozens' instead of 'hundreds' in these contexts. That run might look impressive, but it took DOZENS of tries! (Oh the formerhumanity.)

Actually I'm curious about this thing but I don't know what to search, but oh well. I think the one who talked here is not even into speedrunning, so this person can comment like this without noticing being sort of... stupid, I guess. 6 hours are usually the time for me to gradually get into more control of the map (for a average like 5 min length map) and tweak details in order to improve. For now I guess I haven't taken a map serious enough to surpass the 10-hour mark, sad.

[Nine Inch Heels]

26 minutes ago, GarrettChan said:

For now I guess I haven't taken a map serious enough to surpass the 10-hour mark, sad.

In my case it's not about taking a map serious or not... I don't think I should put in an arbitrary amount time when there is always a certain amount of RNG involved... If I give a map more than 10 hours, then it's because I really like the map, at which point it's not about anything other than me enjoying myself.

 

I think the idea that a run is only good if someone spent X hours worth of real time into Y minutes worth of demo time is slightly misguided. If you're content with the demo you have recorded, regardless of time invested, you should post it anyway, imo.

 

If what you do is making yourself feel bad in hindsight because you maybe did not give the map enough time, you're on the perfect road to ruining something for yourself that you actually enjoy doing.

 

Besides, overall demo quality you deliver will get better over time automatically if you keep playing. It's like every other thing in life you do on a regular basis. Best not to force things too much.

[damerell]

On 1/20/2018 at 6:48 PM, GarrettChan said:

 For now I guess I haven't taken a map serious enough to surpass the 10-hour mark, sad.

I've been playing since 1993 and I doubt I even have ten hours in the Containment Area.

[taufan99]

Tom Mustaine's song More for TNT: Evilution always gives me goosebumps. No idea why, it just sounds chilling, melancholic, and suspending to me, all at the same time.

[oldandcringe]

1. I hate Doom 3, and ignore its existence at all times.
2. I can't make good maps that aren't based on real places or other maps in other videogames.
3. I haven't released any of the pwads I've created, because they're usually bad or incomplete.
4. I used to test all of my pwads with Brutal Doom
5. My least used weapon is the BFG9000. I'm not a fan, and will usually just use it on the final bosses, thats it.

[mrthejoshmon]

I wanted to go out and speedrun/UV max a bunch of obscure shitty maps nobody cares about /have heard of just for the hell of it and to be the only mong who even bothered.

 

I later realized that doing so would be the most frustrating and painful shitpost I'd ever attempt to make, a worthless shitpost that isn't even slightly funny and that just made me sad.

[franckFRAG]

I like Doom 2 more than Doom 1.

[Dreamskull]

The Pain Elemental is my favorite monster.

[94's the best style]

I can't stand people calling magazines "clips". Though at least it leads to stuff like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REdjjLBaiOs

[Lila Feuer]

I hate it when they call magazines clips IRL and games past Doom clone era. But I like calling the ammo pickups in Wolf3D, Doom and Turok clips because I guess I'm weird.

[Job]

When I map for Doom, I have to force myself to use height variation. Otherwise, my levels end up too flat and linear. 

[Spie812]

I genuinely enjoy Mock2-style jokewads.

[Revved]

It absolutely annoys me whenever I see a Doom streamer that plays through a megawad (or multi-level wads in general) and pistol-starts each map. I just don't think that's not how the author wanted you to play the wad in that style anyway. Maybe if it was a speedmapping session or just a random wad compilation where there's not a whole lot of thought put into level and weapon progression, then I'd understand, but some wads just really beg the question. Some megawads have maps where it might not have enough ammo going into it from a pistol-start, but would be much easier with having weapons from previous levels. Similarly, some levelsets like Valiant, Scythe, and 50 Monsters obviously force a pistol-start on some levels, but streamers still insist in pistol-starting on EVERY level, whereas if that was the author's intent, theu would've forced a pistol-start on each and every level like they like to do.

[SuperCupcakeTactics]

When I first played Deus Vult II and saw the Hell levels it scared me because I thought it was like the real Hell or something (idk how old I was)

[DoomedFox]

1. I play doom 2 on Hurt Me Plenty because it feels balanced in terms of difficulty. (yet I play doom 1 on Ultra-Violence)

 

2. I actually enjoy doom95's launcher, wish it could have been used in more source ports. 

 

[Dragonfly]

9 hours ago, Revved said:

It absolutely annoys me whenever I see a Doom streamer that plays through a megawad (or multi-level wads in general) and pistol-starts each map. I just don't think that's not how the author wanted you to play the wad in that style anyway. Maybe if it was a speedmapping session or just a random wad compilation where there's not a whole lot of thought put into level and weapon progression, then I'd understand, but some wads just really beg the question. Some megawads have maps where it might not have enough ammo going into it from a pistol-start, but would be much easier with having weapons from previous levels. Similarly, some levelsets like Valiant, Scythe, and 50 Monsters obviously force a pistol-start on some levels, but streamers still insist in pistol-starting on EVERY level, whereas if that was the author's intent, theu would've forced a pistol-start on each and every level like they like to do.

I think you'll find a large chunk of PWADs are designed with pistol starting in mind, especially those of a vanilla/boom format, since by default in Doom, when you die, you lose everything. That is, you have to then pistol-start the map. It's also easier for the map-author to test a map with pistol starts, and also easier to craft a proper experience with pistol starts. Assuming the player will be starting a map armed to the teeth makes it much harder for a map author to balance for without making it impossibly hard for pistol starts, or filling the start with weaponry as per DoomII Map30.

 

Besides, it's player's choice. If they want to 'ruin' their experience, let them! (Also when streaming, you're catering for an audience. A decent chunk of the audience will heckle you for no pistol starts!)

[Bauul]

The only time watching a streamer pistol start has annoyed me is when someone (I can't remember who) tried out Confinement 256. We built a script that automatically pistol started each map, and when you start the game a message says "Each map automatically pistol starts".

 

And yet they still insisted on restarting each map with "map confxx" in the console. It's like they didn't believe our script worked, even though they obviously started with just a pistol and 50 bullets.

[leodoom85]

10 hours ago, Revved said:

It absolutely annoys me whenever I see a Doom streamer that plays through a megawad (or multi-level wads in general) and pistol-starts each map. I just don't think that's not how the author wanted you to play the wad in that style anyway. Maybe if it was a speedmapping session or just a random wad compilation where there's not a whole lot of thought put into level and weapon progression, then I'd understand, but some wads just really beg the question. Some megawads have maps where it might not have enough ammo going into it from a pistol-start, but would be much easier with having weapons from previous levels. Similarly, some levelsets like Valiant, Scythe, and 50 Monsters obviously force a pistol-start on some levels, but streamers still insist in pistol-starting on EVERY level, whereas if that was the author's intent, theu would've forced a pistol-start on each and every level like they like to do.

I do like to play with pistol start gameplay because it adds an extra layer of difficulty. Even if the map is hard, it provides a challenge. About the streamers (and YTbers too) doing the maps with that gameplay, it's up to them to play the game as they want. Besides, most of the maps are tested carefully to clear the map with a starting pistol anyway, just like Dragonfly said.

[baja blast rd.]

1 hour ago, Bauul said:

The only time watching a streamer pistol start has annoyed me is when someone (I can't remember who) tried out Confinement 256. We built a script that automatically pistol started each map, and when you start the game a message says "Each map automatically pistol starts".

 

And yet they still insisted on restarting each map with "map confxx" in the console. It's like they didn't believe our script worked, even though they obviously started with just a pistol and 50 bullets.

Here's a bit of an alternate take, since I still insist on manually restarting on any mapset with a pistol start script (and in prB+, pressing the reset key after death exits). :) Console resets being an unconscious habit would be useful in general, since not every mapset has a pistol start script. So, one just ignores the existence of the script -- whose primary purpose is thwarting continuous play and enforcing pistol starts as mandatory, rather than saving 5-10 seconds worth of typing effort for someone who is intending to pistol start anyway -- instead of consciously trying to override a very auto-piloty habit every time. Also things like that can have ritual value, a sort of 'mental reset', and it doesn't take too much time anyway, so no real reason to stop doing it. 

 

Edited February 2, 2018 by rdwpa

[valkiriforce]

7 hours ago, DoomedFox said:

2. I actually enjoy doom95's launcher, wish it could have been used in more source ports.

I've always liked that launcher, with its pull-down menu full of PWADs, check boxes and other options. Thankfully there are at least some good launchers out there still like PrBoom's simple startup launcher, or Doom Launcher and ZDL among other ones.

[baja blast rd.]

Favorite and least favorite weapon-monster pairings (i.e., inherently, and based on fights with smaller numbers of monsters, since I can like or dislike any pairing given a good enough or bad enough scenario respectively): 

 

'zerk/chainsaw 

 

Least -> Pinkies. How punching out a dozen pinkies is fun is one of those things people like that is completely lost on me. Imps are better fodder in every way -- gibbable, can actually retaliate. Yes, 'trons, MMs, and cybs are not my least favorite. I like some of those.

 

Most -> HKs/barons. Yes, chainsaw and unberserked fist too.

 

Pistol

 

Least -> Anything other than a shootswitch lol. Not a weapon. 

 

Most -> N.A.

 

Shotgun

 

Least-> Tough one since I either dislike or merely tolerate the shotgun against most things that have more than 50 HP, but probably cacodemons, even more than barons, because I've seen too many maps that think SG vs. several cacos in an open space is a type of fight. 

 

Most -> Shotgun guy in typical maps; archvile or afrit in a map with barely any health or ammo. <3 Scythe 2 Map 29 <3. Basically if it's not hard and stingy and oppressive I better be in a fast-paced Doom 1 episode replacement otherwise why does my shotgun only have one barrel! Shotgun guy is the proper answer here, assuming there's no particular scenario.

 

Chaingun

 

Least-> Fine, barons. Would rather have to plink down a full-HP cyb because at least then I might have fun trying to place every bullet on the place where babies are made its rockets come from. 

 

Most -> Hard to say. Not a weapon I like too much unless I'm against monsters with 70 HP or lower, or I'm painstunning or holding stuff off at very close range. Probably the arachnotron. 

 

Super Shotgun

 

Least-> Nothing. While not the best weapon in Doom, I think it has the second highest floor, even ahead of the RL, which I like better overall, just because it's less likely to be done wrong. "Grinding through lots of inert meat of any species" or "fighting badly placed monsters" win by default; but almost all weapons aren't good for that.

 

Most -> Archviles. 

 

Rocket Launcher

 

Least -> Again, a really good weapon. The best weapons don't get a specific monster. "Monsters that are unreliable to hit given the projectile's low speed" wins out  -- stuff like individual revenants in giant spaces, single cacodemons, revenants high up on ledges. 

 

Most -> Archviles!  

 

Plasma Rifle 

 

Least -> Another good weapon. It's in the second-highest slot which can be slightly misleading -- it actually has the third highest DPS and is way behind the RL (385 plus splash, which can be 600+ per rocket easily against tightly packed stuff, vs. 262.5), so fighting lowish threat blocks of meat isn't fun.

 

Most -> PR is like a superpowered electrical projectile chainsaw, and using it to fend off ravenous monsters at close range is fun. The ideal "total HP" for lower-threat incidental fun is actually somewhat low, and making that fun is more about stringing together lots of varied mini-skirmishes, in contrast to the RL which is good for spamming in larger low-threat fights. I don't feel like discussing "favorite weapon-situation pairings" too much so I'll leave it at that. Individual monster: archviles, duh. 

 

BFG 9000

 

Least -> LOL 

 

Most -> Everything! Every tier, every density (even gratuitous BFG shots that grab that ledge revenant and that drifting caco and those zombiemen over there are really fun, maps with too much cell ammo = good). Having to hit stuff with the ball and get good damage RNG is one of the few ways to make it suck. Individual monsters? Lone cybs of course, for all sorts of two-shots, and . . . you guessed it 

 

Spoiler

Archviles.

 

Edited February 9, 2018 by rdwpa

[T-Squared]

I never was able to figure out how to get through MAP20: The Courtyard in Doom II until a few years later.

[GarrettChan]

18 hours ago, rdwpa said:

Least -> Another good weapon. It's in the second-highest slot which can be slightly misleading -- it actually has the third highest DPS and is way behind the RL (385 plus splash, which can be 600+ per rocket easily against tightly packed stuff, vs. 262.5), so fighting lowish threat blocks of meat isn't fun.

The last time I did wonder SSG vs Rocket Launcher on one Cyberdemon, but I didn't think of Plasma Rifle, but according to this 262.5 DPS, Plasma Rifle should be the best in these 3. In the first few years of playing Doom, I always thought Plasma Rifle is definitely useless when you have the BFG, but now I felt that was sort of stupid since Plasma Rifle still has strategic uses in some situations.

[Catpho]

I always found only 2 secrets in map 32 of doom2 and i always thought that i maxed secrets that map,despite totals saying otherwise until now XD

[scifista42]

4 hours ago, rdwpa said:

DPS ... RL ... 385 plus splash

That 385 already includes splash applied to the monster that was directly hit by the rocket: (90 impact damage + 128 splash damage) * 35 tics per second / 20 tics rocket firing delay.

1 hour ago, GarrettChan said:

The last time I did wonder SSG vs Rocket Launcher on one Cyberdemon, but I didn't think of Plasma Rifle, but according to this 262.5 DPS, Plasma Rifle should be the best in these 3.

Yes, on the Cyberdemon, it is, since without splash damage, the RL only does 157.5 DPS and the SSG even less.

Edited February 9, 2018 by scifista42

[Guest Unregistered account]

4 hours ago, T-Squared said:

I never was able to figure out how to get through MAP20: The Courtyard in Doom II until a few years later.

The Courtyard is Level 18. Are you referring to the shootable door at the start?

[baja blast rd.]

Yeah that's splash against other things.

 

[GarrettChan]

19 hours ago, scifista42 said:

Yes, on the Cyberdemon, it is, since without splash damage, the RL only does 157.5 DPS and the SSG even less.

According to the calculation, for RL, it takes slightly less than 30 seconds to take down a Cybie on average; for SSG, it takes slightly more than 30 seconds to take down a Cybie.

 

However, there are some other factors to consider though:

1. You may miss a rocket and some pellets from SSG;

2. You can't get too close to fire a rocket since you may take splash damage from your own rocket;

3. It seems I have a higher chance to miss a rocket rather than to miss many pellets from a SSG blast.

 

Therefore, I usually would choose SSG over RL for single Cybie in running maps.

[rehelekretep]

@GarrettChan same - i also want to save my rockets for when the splash is useful, and you can usually pick up more shells than rockets in a map.