Rail gun: one thing that should definitley NOT be put into doomX

[dsm]

One of the things I dislike about the railgun is that it is the only weapon that uses slugs, meaning that it's harder to deplete your supply of ammo for it.

[Cranium]

I have no problem with Doom3 having a railgun as long as it gibs the player just before he pulls the trigger.

SHOTGUNS DAMMIT!

[Fredrik]

Originally posted by Cranium
I have no problem with Doom3 having a railgun as long as it gibs the player just before he pulls the trigger.

SHOTGUNS DAMMIT!

Exactly! =)

[Jeremy]

Xian, lets put it simple.. now I didnt take my time to read everyone elses replies, but heres mine:

DOOM wont have a railgun in it, id KNOWS thats its specific to Quake, and DOOM already has an answer too this: BFG.

I wonder why QuakeII had to have a BFG in it.. they even called it the 20k, which means QuakeII took place after DoomII.. Hmph. It would have been cool if the space marines sent to that planet were from the UAC..

[geekmarine]

Hmm... I never liked the rail gun, but not because of any overt gameplay issues. I just never liked it, is all. It never really struck me as "Wow, what a neat gun!" I never did like the feeling, it just didn't give the same satisfaction as say a double barrel shotgun at point blank range did. I can't really explain, but that's how I feel about it.

[dsm]

Originally posted by Jeremy
I wonder why QuakeII had to have a BFG in it.. they even called it the [b[20k[/b], which means QuakeII took place after DoomII.. Hmph. It would have been cool if the space marines sent to that planet were from the UAC..

Correction: It was called the BFG 10k.
Well, the Q2 marines combat suits look more advanced than Doom's marines, so it'd be ridiculous if they called the BFG for "BFG5k".

[Jeremy]

Oops, guess it is 10k. Which is stupid becuase the gun is TOTALLY different in QuakeIII, that shoulda been the BFG11k or somthing..

But QuakeII should have had reference to the UAC, it would have made it more fun.

[Ultimate Demon]

I want a Super Shotgun ( like the one in doom2 ) and not a Shotgun. Sure it would do 2-3 times more damage but i like the reload animation.

[sirgalahadwizar]

Apparently from what ive heard - The quake series takes place in a parallel universe to that of the doom series.

That doesnt mean they cant have similar technology (so the ability to make BFG-like weapons are common to both dimensions).



The Q2 marine's combat suits looked heavier than doom's marine combat suits - not more advanced (there's a difference between slapping more metal on the suit and putting together a lightweight suit with hi-strength materials).

The railgun is supposed to be a long range double-barrel shotgun, whereas if you get hit then you take all of the pellets down the throat, and if you dont get hit then oh well... Puts the same amount of energy of a double barrel shotgun blast into a single 10-20mm slug (i'd like a .80cal magnum railgun pleez, with hollowpoint uranium slugs :)

Though the railgun is abit of a super weapon, it in no way competes with the bfg on the same level. For all intensive purposes, BFGs from doom and quake2 are far more lethal than railguns.

-----
Guns *I* want in the game:

* rapid-action melee weapon (probably anti-infantry in nature, like a chainsaw).
* SMG (30 shot clip, pistol rounds, 700-1000rpm).
* Canister Rifle (30mm shotgun firing various cartridges...)
* GAT (2400 rpm minigun, pistol rounds, 20 lbs)

* Plasma Rifle (new and improved, with higher plasma velocity and temp., 50 shot capacitor).
* Cell Blaster (like the q2 hyperblaster, just slower).
* Blast Field Gun MK4 (your lovely friend BFG, weighing in at 60 lbs and gobbling up all your cells).

* Explosives Launcher (50mm Grenade launcher, bounce or rocket mode).
* 50mm Grenade, Hand-set (hand grenade).

-----
*SMG - Something like a high-tech uzi.

*Canister Rifle - Shotgun with a mission, delivers pellets, slugs, or explosives.

*GAT - GATling Gun. Belts onto one of the arms, has a handlegrip on the side to hold with the other. Eats pistol bullets like no tomorrow.

*Cell Blaster - Lightweight plasma rifle, does an average 5 damage less than the plasma rifle for each shot (cell), and only fires 2/3 as fast. In effect a slower Q2 hyperblaster. Looks sorta like an OICW (and no, I didnt get this idea from any doom mods, the shape is only for the frame anyway).

*Plasma Rifle - Is about 50% more powerful than doom or Q3 plasma rifle, and projectiles travel as fast as Q3 plasma (and each one does minor explosive damage).

*Blast Field Gun MK4 - good ol friend bfg. Looks significantly higher tech than q2 bfg or doom bfg (but not like the Q3 bfg). Still posseses the "blast field" spray attack, along with lightning tracker attacks (like q2 bfg). Explosion impact has a much larger blast radius.

*Explosives Launcher - Launches "bouncy" grenades (explode 2 sec later) or high speed grenades (like the flak cannon from UT, just no "fragmentation" and longer range). Grenades have large blast radius - they're 50mm people.

*Hand grenade - Blows up in 3 seconds instead of 2, bouncing them on the ground slows them down significantly (gets rid of the need for variable throwing velocity, throw them at the ground to get them to stay close).

[IMJack]

The Q2 marine's combat suits looked heavier than doom's marine combat suits - not more advanced (there's a difference between slapping more metal on the suit and putting together a lightweight suit with hi-strength materials).

One thing to think about: The marines in Doom were part of a secuity team, one that was simply guarding the moonbases and wasn't expecting any real action. It'd be a small team, so they could afford to be pretty well-equipped. The Quake 2 marines were part of a huge invasion force, where it was assumed enough grunts would make planetfall that commando-style action wouldn't be necessary. Most of the money spent on each grunt probably went for the Spam-in-a-can drop pods that were supposed to get everyone safely to the surface.

Two different situations, two preperations, two fuck-ups, one obvious result.

[dsm]

* SMG (30 shot clip, pistol rounds, 700-1000rpm).

Hmm, if they make it good I might approve of it, but an assault rifle would make more sense (assault rifles work more or less the same as SMGs - they just have longer ranges) since, that's the typical weapon a marine would carry.

* Canister Rifle (30mm shotgun firing various cartridges...)

Not a chance, gimme the good ol' pump-action shotgun, not some cheesy fast-firing shell using rifle.

* GAT (2400 rpm minigun, pistol rounds, 20 lbs)

Now why would a minigun-like weapon use pistol rounds?

* Cell Blaster (like the q2 hyperblaster, just slower).

I doubt this thing would be of much use if you have the plasma rifle.

*Hand grenade - Blows up in 3 seconds instead of 2, bouncing them on the ground slows them down significantly (gets rid of the need for variable throwing velocity, throw them at the ground to get them to stay close).

That would suck arse - too much realism, and the kind of realism that would ruin fun gameplay. No thanks.
-------------------------------------------

Here are MY weapon wishes (mostly old weapons)

*Knuckle duster - improved version of the old brass kd, this one's a bit like the Q3A gauntlet in that way that it shocks the enemy when you hit them. Should work similarly to the Q3A gauntlet - hold down the fire key to ready a punch and when you get close enough to something you can smash, you punch it.

*Chainsaw - I can live without this one, but it would be cool if it was there - check my Chainsaw thread for info on how I would like this to work.

*Pistol - basic weapon you start out with, this gun isn't particularly powerful at first, but it should fire a *tad* faster than the old pistol. If you find another pistol, you can go akimbo with them, making a pretty decent weapon out of a weapon which sucks at first.

*Single-barreled shotgun - the good ol' imp basher, should work as similarly to the old shotgun as possible.

*Db shotgun - this should be more like Quake 2's, only it should look more like a more futuristic version of the Doom 2 db shotgun, without looking cheesy. I don't wanna go goose hunting dammit.

*Assault rifle - kinda similar to sirghwizard's smg. Has two firing modes, primary: works very similar to Q2's smg, but not quite as inaccurate, still requires burst-fire for maximum efficiency, Secondary: single shot Sniper mode - a sort of weak sniper rifle, 'nuff said (this mode's only available in singleplay).

*Grenade launcher - works similar to the Quake grenade launchers, but once it lies still, it'll work a little like a prox mine, but will only explode when it detects enemies next to it - not the player.

*Rocket launcher - I don't have any specific wishes for this one. As long as it doesn't suck, I'm happy.

*Plasma gun - same firing rate as the old one, same missile travel speed as Q3A's, cooler sounds than both and damaging to player if you fire it into a wall right next to the player.

*Chaingun - Portable destruction, minigun mayhem - fires assault rifle ammo at an insane rate of fire (as high as technically possible!), has a very short spin up delay and an equally short spin down delay - allows for burst fire, which is the most effective as continuos fire will steadily throw the aim off the target.

*BFG 9k - more or less same as Q2's without the green lasers.

- other than that, I hope id will put a few new things in the game - the railgun is NOT new, and I never liked it enough to want it to be in a Doom game.

[IMJack]

I still believe Doom X will be far more focused on close-combat, in-your-face, where-the-hell-did-that-thing-come-from-oh-dear-god-its-got-my-leg than most FPS games. I'm thinking kinda like Aliens TC, where you couldn't see the monsters until they were biting you and stealing your pants. Some weapons, like a rocket launcher, super-machine-gun, or railgun simply aren't suited to this kind of encounter. (Unless id wants to fuck with our heads, give us rocket launchers and railguns for tight hallways and shotguns and chainsaws for a Tribes-style cross-country mosh.)

This is what I'm thinking:
~ Chucking a helmet: Every modern military has, at one point, written in its ops manuals that when there is no other weapon available, one's helmet will suffice.

~ Knuckle duster: Beats chucking a helmet. You should be able to aim for a critter's jaw, and put them down long enough to make your escape or reach higher ground. And most bigger monsters shouldn't have glass jaws.

~ Chainsaw: It doesn't have to be a chainsaw. Any kind of heavy personal construction/destruction tool would work. Maybe a Star-Trek-style laser saw. We're havin' burgers tonight!

~ Pistol: Gotta have a sidearm. One property I'd like to see is a higher damage multiplier when a pistol is used on an enemy's weak points, compared to other weapons. Large-caliber hollow-point pistol rounds and such.

~ Shotgun: Vital. My thought was that the Doom shotgun should be like the Half-Life shotgun, with the main fire being one barrel and altfire being both barrels. Decent magazine, but you gotta reload by hand.

~ Carbine: It's two weapons in one! On top, a small, rapid-firing assault rifle. On bottom, a shotgun attachment. A full reload for this thing will last you some time, which is good 'cuz it'll take forever to reload.

~ Chaingun: For when you absolutely, positively have to kill every fragger between you and the reenforced wall right the fuck now. Should be fairly random and very powerful.

~ Assault cannon: Point. Click. Dig yourself out of what used to be a building. Repeat.

~ Grenade launcher: Fires impact grenades. Like a poor/sane man's rocket launcher.

~ BFG: Pure fucking energy. You should have a little more control over what level of pure fucking energy, too. This thing has been in development for a while.

~ Quietus: Because you never know what might turn up in Hell.

This is what you get when I stay up till 0500 on a school night.

[dsm]

Only thing I have to say to that Is: I HATE HL's type of alternate fire - I can never get used to a second fire button in addition to the ctrl key. I prefer RtCW's type of alt fire - the alt fire key just activates alt fire, and then you fire the alt fire mode with the regular fire key - much easier and not so damn complex.

[Zaldron]

Depends on the weapon. A pistol switching between auto, full auto and burst should work like RTCW's, while a rifle with an attached grenade launcher (as an example) should fire the round when you hit the alt key. No point in adding more wasted time than your own reaction time.

[dsm]

Zaldron said:

Depends on the weapon. A pistol switching between auto, full auto and burst should work like RTCW's, while a rifle with an attached grenade launcher (as an example) should fire the round when you hit the alt key. No point in adding more wasted time than your own reaction time.

This is one reason why I'm allergic to attached grenade launchers in an FPS. Like I hinted at above: No need to make the game more complex than necessary.
I've played a few games with no alt fire at all which beat games like Half-life anytime. Why Doom for instance ;-)
I hope that Doom 3 will have very little HL feel to it if anything at all.

Had it not been for RtCW's type of alt fire, I would be stubbornly against alt fire in general. Unreal is a prime example of ridiculous alt fires that are of little use imo.

No, if alt fire is to be in the new game, it has to be kept strictly like RtCW's: A mode which you prime before using it, so that you don't have to shift your finger a notch to press another key at a critical moment and id should stay away from adding weapons like attached grenade launchers or other weapons which require a second fire button.

[Lord FlatHead]

dsm, maybe you just should reconsider your control setup. Has it occured to you that you don't HAVE to "shift your fingers a notch" to use alt-fire ? Most people bind primary fire to the left mouse button, and alt-fire to the right mouse button. This is pretty intuitive - I can imagine that using a key on your keyboard for firing in a game like Half-Life feels a bit odd.

[dsm]

I have experimented a lot with different control setups and my problem is that I never use any of the mouse buttons to fire a weapon, because I use both mouse buttons to move.

Here's my setup (so far the setup I'm most confident with and which I perform best with):

Mouse:
I use both mouse buttons to move either forward or backwards - the third mouse button is used for zooming in Q3A - I haven't found other uses for this button which could be effective (I tried to use it as the sprint button in RtCW once, but found that it felt awkward).

Keyboard:
Ctrl - fire primary
Shift - walk/run (in every other FPS than RtCW)
(Caps Lock - walk in RtCW, I haven't found a better key yet)
Alt - strafe modifier, I rarely use this button, but sometimes it becomes useful - at least in some games.
Z & X - strafing left and right
Space - jump
A - alt fire mode activate/fire
S - use key
c - crouch
r - reload

There are other keys I use in RtCW as well, which are not listed here.

Now the best thing would be if I could place the alt fire closer to the ctrl key - problem is that there are no keys next to my ctrl key (I use the left side of the keyboard) which work.

Just right to ctrl is the Windows button (enables me to open the start menu in Windows) - cannot be used in a game, either because it doesn't work or because it just jumps out of the game to open that start menu.
Above ctrl is the shift key which I use to run/walk (sprint in RtCW) - can't change the usage of this key.

Just right to shift is the '<' key - doesn't work in the games.
So far, I've been unsuccessful at finding a better alt fire key than 'a' and your suggestion might be good, but I've tried using a mouse button as a fire key, and the result was that my movement ability got seriously hampered by that.

[Lord FlatHead]

Well that's definetly an odd set-up. Why don't you just use the arrow keys or WASD for movement, like 90% of the population ? I'm sure it'll be more convenient once you get used to it. But hey, whatever works for you is fine.

[dsm]

Tried that, reduces my overall perfomance - but we're all different and nothing shows people's difference than each individual's control setup in an FPS ;-)

[sirgalahadwizar]

DSM:

The minigun uses pistol bullets because they're cheap and standard, and you'd probably end up finding more of them laying around. A real-world reason is recoil, 9mm pistol bullets dont have much recoil - especially when fired from a gun weighing 20 lbs, that way you can truly have an infantry-standard minigun.

Now if we replaced the Smg with an assault rifle, a minigun shooting rifle bullets wouldnt be bad either because this is just a game ;)

The canister rifle is more powerful than a shotgun. It's like a m-203 with a magazine capacity more than 1, and the ability to fire pellet attacks in addition to explosives. As far as pellets go, it'd be well powerful enough to compete with the SSG, but it outshines it since it can also shoot xplosives and all sorts of other stuffs. (and it would still sound like a shotgun anyway).

Cell Blaster -> cheapo energy gun. For the bean counters at the UAC. Who knows, put it into the hands of the former humans?

The Plasma Rifle is a heavy weapon, about the size (and weight) of an M-60 machinegun (except wider). Why not have a smaller version as the cell blaster (heh, designed obsolecence, they still need at least two energy weapons other than the bfg though).

I think they should *elaborate* on the green laser thingy from the Q2 bfg, definatly makes shooting a bfg more interesting (since you get immediate effects). Though the green lasers aren't very spectacular - maybe lightning beams like Q3's lightning gun would be better.

-----
Keyboard bindings:

I'll make my own thanku, I dont want iD making it to where you must use a specific config for it (they prolly wouldnt, but you never know).

[IMJack]

The minigun uses pistol bullets because they're cheap and standard, and you'd probably end up finding more of them laying around. A real-world reason is recoil, 9mm pistol bullets dont have much recoil - especially when fired from a gun weighing 20 lbs, that way you can truly have an infantry-standard minigun.

My only question is: How do the rounds load? Even tho pistol rounds would be everywhere, you probably wouldn't find them already in belts, and loading a belt with rounds by hand would take a long time. You could use a drum, like the old Thompson SMG, but then you'd be forced to reload every hundred rounds or so (a hundred rounds in a minigun is about a second of continuous fire, IIRC).

IMHO, the pistol and the minigun should have seperate ammo types.

[dsm]

The minigun uses pistol bullets because they're cheap and standard, and you'd probably end up finding more of them laying around. A real-world reason is recoil, 9mm pistol bullets dont have much recoil - especially when fired from a gun weighing 20 lbs, that way you can truly have an infantry-standard minigun.

More or less what IMJack said, though I would have agreed with you three years ago, but pistol ammo to a belt fed gun is just cartoonish - and the chaingun should be belt fed - fast firing, belt-fed machineguns have their own special charm to them - they rock!

The canister rifle is more powerful than a shotgun. It's like a m-203 with a magazine capacity more than 1, and the ability to fire pellet attacks in addition to explosives. As far as pellets go, it'd be well powerful enough to compete with the SSG, but it outshines it since it can also shoot xplosives and all sorts of other stuffs. (and it would still sound like a shotgun anyway).

Hmm, a weapon like this has the same problem as a gun with an attached grenade launcher: It resembles real life weapons too closely, which I don't like in a game like Doom (seems kinda wrong to put real life weapons in such a over-the-top game like Doom imo). Another issue is that it sounds like a too damn complex weapon for my tastes. Imo weapons in Doom 3 should only have a max of one alt fire mode along primary fire - and not every weapon should have alt-fire (making an alt fire for the chaingun is bound to suck).

Another thing I wouldn't like about leaving out the shotgun, is that shotguns have their own special charm - it wouldn't be an id game without a shotgun in a game set in the future (RtCW is NOT set in the future!). Besides, this is Doom Goddammit - if just one single of the old weapons is missing, several fans of the original games would be pissed off.
But I could accept that canister rifle as another gun sharing the same weapon class as the two shotguns (a la RtCW and HL's weapon classes) - maybe it should share weapon class with my above mentioned assault rifle since it's more powerful than the shotgun ;-)

Cell Blaster -> cheapo energy gun. For the bean counters at the UAC. Who knows, put it into the hands of the former humans?

No comment = don't care.

The Plasma Rifle is a heavy weapon, about the size (and weight) of an M-60 machinegun (except wider). Why not have a smaller version as the cell blaster (heh, designed obsolecence, they still need at least two energy weapons other than the bfg though).

It doesn't look all that big to me, and I usually picture the plasma rifle as a small, compact and highly effective gun. But that's just me, so I'll shut up about that now ;-)

I'll make my own thanku, I dont want iD making it to where you must use a specific config for it (they prolly wouldnt, but you never know).

What's this got to do with anything? Just because my setup bears a vague resemblance to the default id setup, doesn't mean that I demand that everyone else uses the default setup.
Or did I miss something here?

[Ultimate Demon]

I want a Double barreled Shotgun instedd of a Rail gun.

[Sharessa]

Doom 3 should have:
1) Melee Weapons
A) Brass Knuckles - Not very powerful
B) Chainsaw - Pretty nasty, but I have no idea why you'd find it in the game
C) Laser Saw - Not as nasty as a chainsaw (cleaner cut), but more logical
D) Demon Sword - found in Hell, pretty damn powerful
2) Sidearms
A) Pistol - Like a glock, but more futuristic
B) Large Pistol - More like a Desert Eagle
C) Plasma Pistol - Like the plasma rifle but slower and less powerful, this assumes plasma technology is fairly common
3) Medium-Sized Firearms
A) Shotgun - Like in doom, pump action
B) Sawed-off Shotgun - Cuz we need one :)
C) Flamethrower - Zombie Burner
D) Minigun - Like in Predator
E) Plasma Rifle - Can switched from fast but weak to slow but powerful
4) Large Weapons
A) Grenade Launcher - Exactly like the one from AvP
B) Demon Staff - Hellish magic weapon
C) Demon Arm - Bioweapon, like the Hivegun from Half-Life, but more gruesome and not as lame
5) Non-firearms
A) Basic Hand Grenades - 15' blast radius
B) Frag Grenades - 8' Blast, throws shrapnel
C) Cyber-Chakram - Throwing disk, like the one from AvP
D) Molotov Cocktail - Ranged flame attack
E) Snarks - j/k
6) Add-Ons
A) Knuckle Spikes - Adds more damage to knuckles
B) Hell Crystal - Inserted into demon sword to infuse it with demonic flames
C) Summoning Crystal - Inserted into demon staff to allow you to summon a demon with altfire
D) BFG module - When added to the plasma rifle, allows you to pump it up to max power without fear of a catostophic meltdown

I'm not saying that all of this should be in the game (unless it was a pretty long game), but at least a couple from each category would be cool.

[dsm]

D) Demon Sword - found in Hell, pretty damn powerful

I would've liked something like that in a game like Quake1 but not in Doom. Doom focuses on human made weaponry and I prefer it that way - at least in Doom that is.

D) Minigun - Like in Predator

You don't mean to tell me that you don't want id's artists to use their imagination? Putting a minigun that looks just like a modern minigun would be rather dissapointing. Naw, I'd prefer them to use their imagination AND make it look similar to the old chaingun. If you're only referring to firing rate, THEN I'd be with ya all the way ;-)

E) Plasma Rifle - Can switched from fast but weak to slow but powerful

Oh no, not another suggestion for a lame Unreal-like alt fire mode - we've got the BFG, we don't NEED the plasma rifle to be anything else than a special rapid-fire weapon.

B) Demon Staff - Hellish magic weapon
C) Demon Arm - Bioweapon, like the Hivegun from Half-Life, but more gruesome and not as lame

B: No...way, this is Doom, not some lame-ass Heretic/Hexen clone.
C: NO...WAY (Mk.II), that hivegun sucked badly as a weapon and moreover, bioweapons are almost always 100% lame - gimme some proper human-made weapons and spare me for all that organic/magic weapon shit.

Now to me, it's crucial that the id guys not only keep every single weapon from the original (I could live without the chainsaw as long as they replace it with something equally cool and useful, but not without any of the other weapons), but make any new weapon fit to the existing weaponry - I might be able to accept a weapon like sirgalahadwz's canister rifle for instance, but only if it doesn't replace the shotgun and only if it doesn't come with an unbalanced alt fire mode like an attached grenade launcher - if grenade launching really has to be an alt fire, it should be the damn rocket launcher's alt fire imho.

There, that's my basic opinion on weapons. You may flame me now.

[Ultimate Demon]

Dsm, do you mean Shotguns, Chainguns, Pistols and Rocket launchers in Doom3? I would only use a Double barreled Shotgun in Doom3....

[Sharessa]

dsm said:

You don't mean to tell me that you don't want id's artists to use their imagination? Putting a minigun that looks just like a modern minigun would be rather dissapointing. Naw, I'd prefer them to use their imagination AND make it look similar to the old chaingun. If you're only referring to firing rate, THEN I'd be with ya all the way ;-)

Meh. I just picked a minigun and went with it. They're all good.

C: NO...WAY (Mk.II), that hivegun sucked badly as a weapon and moreover, bioweapons are almost always 100% lame - gimme some proper human-made weapons and spare me for all that organic/magic weapon shit.

I was thinking 'hive gun' more in the basic concept...bio weapon that respawns ammo. My idea for the attack would be a dart that sticks into the enemy, burrows, then explodes. Kinda like the cerebral bore, but not as deadly.

[Sharessa]

dsm said:

Oh no, not another suggestion for a lame Unreal-like alt fire mode - we've got the BFG, we don't NEED the plasma rifle to be anything else than a special rapid-fire weapon.

My idea was that the power level would go up a notch each click of the altfire. There would probably be about ten clicks (max) with the last one or two being reserved for the BFG. If you try to use them without the BFG module, the gun overloads and explodes. Hehehe.

[dsm]

Ultimate Demon said:
Dsm, do you mean Shotguns, Chainguns, Pistols and Rocket launchers in Doom3? I would only use a Double barreled Shotgun in Doom3....

You're kidding right?
No single barreled shotgun in Doom 3??? Are you outta your mind??? (j/k)
No, the single barreled shotgun is just as important as the Double barreled. Why? Because it's effective for medium range attacks - the double barreled shotgun ain't worth shit at medium range; it's the most enjoyable gun to kill imps with hands down - even the Double barreled shotgun ain't that satisfying to kill imps with, and finally; the sound combination of a powerful sounding blast (but not as powerful as the db shotgun) combined with the damn satisfactory *chuck-chack*-sound.

Oh yeah, and I forgot to mention that a single barreled shotgun looks cooler than a double barreled.
I want BOTH shotguns in "Doom 3" - they both have their uses and cool concepts. End of shotgun discussion.

was thinking 'hive gun' more in the basic concept...bio weapon that respawns ammo. My idea for the attack would be a dart that sticks into the enemy, burrows, then explodes. Kinda like the cerebral bore, but not as deadly.

Your 'attack idea' is cool, but it is the very concept of a weapon with respawning ammo that sucks imo. Sorry Danny, I just get sick at the mere thought of such a weapon in connection with a Doom game.