Things about Doom you just found out

[printz]

Processingcontrol said:

Hey, Xane123:

Can you get rid of the huge-ass sig please. It's annoying.

Thanks.

Copyright is one of the worst creations EVER and I wish it would DIE!

Yes it's annoying. Copyright is an important law and everyone who breaches it is a lousy deceiver.

[elic]

I wasn't referring the thing about copyrights, It's just that all sigs that are over a few lines just make it harder to read threads. Thank god they don't allow image ones here...

[Xane_MM]

(note: huge post; done only to avoid double-posting)

Processingcontrol said:

Hey, Xane123:

Can you get rid of the huge-ass sig please. It's annoying.

Thanks.

Sure. Will hide; Actually, edited to make smaller and not rant on crappy copyright crap.

printz said:

Yes it's annoying. Copyright is an important law and everyone who breaches it is a lousy deceiver.

Yeah, I guess... It interferes with everything. Well, I guess I'll stop going off-topic... It's just it's annoying how limited it is.

Anyways, I really need to "find out" something about Doom, but I've been around my PWAD so much that I haven't been in the main Doom games to find something...

Processingcontrol said:

Thank god they don't allow image ones here...

Yeah, else I bet people would abuse it and break all kinds of rules... In this forum, I've learned that images aren't that important. (smilies aren't needed and images shouldn't be used often)

Gez said:

Yeah, but here the problem is in the sprite itself. There are several other Heretic sprites that are glitchy.

Reminds me of Strife, how some of the weapon sprites have a yellow line under them.
EDIT: Glitchy sprite is BEASI5:

[Acid]

I just realized that even if you kill an enemy from the back, it plays the death animations from the front :O

[Xane_MM]

BloodyAcid said:

I just realized that even if you kill an enemy from the back, it plays the death animations from the front :O

This is annoying to me. If I use "freeze" in the ZDoom Console, then I kill an enemy, I see it magically turn to face me. I don't think 3D Models do this, do they?

[NiuHaka]

no 3d models do not do this because the monster does not actually change direction. The reason it does this is because the death animation only has one direction. So the death sprites are kind of like any other item or decorative object where no matter what angle you view it from it will always appear to be facing you. It would be possible to have death animation frames for all 8 directions but that would be a huge undertaking.

[Avoozl]

I found out crushers can destroy items.

[Acid]

NiuHaka said:

no 3d models do not do this because the monster does not actually change direction. The reason it does this is because the death animation only has one direction. So the death sprites are kind of like any other item or decorative object where no matter what angle you view it from it will always appear to be facing you. It would be possible to have death animation frames for all 8 directions but that would be a huge undertaking.

I knew this, since I play with sprites and decorate often. I just never paid attention to the fact that a zombie pulls a 180 when they die. (Might sound contradictory, but it's a pretty big oversight)


Edit:

[Xane_MM]

NiuHaka said:
no 3d models do not do this because the monster does not actually change direction. The reason it does this is because the death animation only has one direction. So the death sprites are kind of like any other item or decorative object where no matter what angle you view it from it will always appear to be facing you. It would be possible to have death animation frames for all 8 directions but that would be a huge undertaking.

BloodyAcid said:
I knew this, since I play with sprites and decorate often. I just never paid attention to the fact that a zombie pulls a 180 when they die. (Might sound contradictory, but it's a pretty big oversight)

Yeah, I kinda had an idea of the "*****0" sprites, where "0" means it will be seen from all directions and how "1-8" are the directional sprites. It's like howmy custom monsters always face you. They use only the "0" frames, to be technical. Still, id could've atleast gave them a set of them dying away from the player, but even that was apparently hard to do back then. (Wow, those computers... Amazing Doom could run on them!)

[NiuHaka]

Xane123 said:

...Wow, those computers... Amazing Doom could run on them!

My computer barely could. Couldn't run Duke 3d when that came out. Doom was about the most it could handle. That and magic carpet 2. That computer had a 1 gig hard drive. Massive in those days... crazy.

[LigH]

@ BloodyAcid:

A U-turn is 180°, not 360°. ;)
__

@ Xane123:

My first PC had a 386-SX (without math Coprocessor), 20 MHz. I had to reduce the game window, play with a border of a few cm.
__

Technically, how are invisible pits made? By referencing not the surrounding sector as outside for its linedefs, but a different one (its own)? My memories are very vague, but I believe I read about it...

[Acid]

LigH said:

@ BloodyAcid:

A U-turn is 180°, not 360°. ;)

Glad to know my ability to discern degrees has left me for this summer :P

[Xane_MM]

LigH said:

@ BloodyAcid:

A U-turn is 180°, not 360°. ;)
__

@ Xane123:

My first PC had a 386-SX (without math Coprocessor), 20 MHz. I had to reduce the game window, play with a border of a few cm.
__

Technically, how are invisible pits made? By referencing not the surrounding sector as outside for its linedefs, but a different one (its own)? My memories are very vague, but I believe I read about it...

Well, I have a Windows 2000 laptop that ran Doom95 and it would lag unless the rendering window was decreased, but I didn't like seeing the game tiny.

Also, to make an invisible pit, you remove the textures from the pit's walls, right? Then the texture for the floor "bleeds" over the hole and, as seen in WOW.WAD, makes where the Cyberdemon is, invisible (and also creates a huge HOM :()

Well, at least, I'm thinking of what that WAD did, but I don't know about "self-referencing" and all that advanced stuff; I just use source port features. ;)

[Scypek2]

To make self-referencing sector, change sidedef references on its linedefs, so they'll reference to inner sector only. Then you may change the self-ref sector height, but the floor/ texture will remain on the surrounding sector level. Self-ref sectors may sometimes leak, so it's better to surround them with another sector, I think.

[Archy]

Xane123 said:

Well, I have a Windows 2000 laptop that ran Doom95 and it would lag unless the rendering window was decreased, but I didn't like seeing the game tiny.

Off topic but if you still use Doom95, I can teach you how to get it working with Mouse Support in Windows NT (4.0/2000/XP/Vista/7... ect) and I could fix the invisible monster graphical glitch as well as fix LMP errors.

Anyways, to add to this thread, I just discovered that SR50 did not work like I thought it did.

----------------------IN BOXED FOR CLARITY!----------------------
I always thought that SR50 (Strafe Run 50) is the technique of pressing both the Go Forward/Go Backward key and the Turn Left/Turn Right key while holding the StrafeOn key and while running... but it is actually:

SR50 (Strafe Run 50) is is the technique of pressing both the Go Forward/Go Backward key and the Turn Left /Turn Right key while holding the Strafe On key and while running, AS-WELL AS holding the Strafe Left/Strafe Right key -- with the Strafe Right key being used if the Turn Right key was used and the Strafe Left key being used if the Turn Left was used.
------------------IN BOXED FOR CLARITY! [ENDED]------------------


This means that keyboard induced Strafe Run 50 was much harder to achieve than I thought, and that many times I thought I was using SR50 (but for some reason didn't notice a speed increase...) but it was actually just SR40.

View a thread on this here:
http://www.doomworld.com/vb/doom-speed-demos/60824-sr40-v-sr50-discussion-split-from-final-doom-demos-thread/

[Xane_MM]

Archy said:

I always thought that SR50 (Strafe Run 50) is the technique of pressing both the Go Forward/Go Backward key and the Turn Left/Turn Right key while holding the StrafeOn key and while running... but it is actually:

SR50 (Strafe Run 50) is is the technique of pressing both the Go Forward/Go Backward key and the Turn Left /Turn Right key while holding the Strafe On key and while running, AS-WELL AS holding the Strafe Left/Strafe Right key -- with the Strafe Right key being used if the Turn Right key was used and the Strafe Left key being used if the Turn Left was used.

Interesting. Also, I do strafe-running... Somehow. It's sorta slow, but I am not speedrunning, so I don't need a lot of speed. I have WASD as my movement keys, so I run, hold down A or D, and push forward. Isn't that SR40 if you hold down a strafe key, run, and forward?

EDIT: This one was probably the problem. Edited.

[Scypek2]

No no no. Straferunning isn't magic, but trigonometry. When you're moving forward at speed A and, at the same time, moving sideways at speed B, then you're moving diagonally at speed
\sqrt A^2 + B^B
which is 40% faster!
You're straferunning thanks to Pitagoras.

[Xane_MM]

Scypek2 said:

No no no. Straferunning isn't magic, but trigonometry. When you're moving forward at speed A and, at the same time, moving sideways at speed B, then you're moving diagonally at speed
\sqrt A^2 + B^B
which is 40% faster!
You're straferunning thanks to Pitagoras.

...So, is what I'm doing "straferunning", since I'm going forwards and sideways at the same time? (I seem to go slightly faster)

[Archy]

Xane123 said:

...So, is what I'm doing "straferunning", since I'm going forwards and sideways at the same time? (I seem to go slightly faster)

Yes, it is.

[Xane_MM]

Archy said:

Yes, it is.

Well, that's awesome! I wish keyboards today weren't programmed stupidly to not allow more than 3 keys to be pushed at once; I'd love to do higher straferunning sometime, but my straferunning is good enough for what I do; one of my Doom levels has a long "hallway" and it takes forever to get around it without straferunning.

[DuckReconMajor]

If that is an issue, when you get a new keyboard, look for one with a high key rollover.

Scypek2 said:

No no no. Straferunning isn't magic, but trigonometry. When you're moving forward at speed A and, at the same time, moving sideways at speed B, then you're moving diagonally at speed
\sqrt A^2 + B^B
which is 40% faster!
You're straferunning thanks to Pitagoras.

What about SR50? Also, when you SR50 are you going faster than MAXSPEED?

[Archy]

Scypek2 said:

No no no. Straferunning isn't magic, but trigonometry. When you're moving forward at speed A and, at the same time, moving sideways at speed B, then you're moving diagonally at speed
\sqrt A^2 + B^B
which is 40% faster!
You're straferunning thanks to Pitagoras.

DuckReconMajor said:

What about SR50? Also, when you SR50 are you going faster than MAXSPEED?

He just described SR50, as SR50 is 40% (actually 41% according to wiki) faster. SR40 is just 28% faster.

Equation for SR50:
\sqrt 50^2 + 50^50

Equation for SR40:
\sqrt 50^2 + 40^40

http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Straferunning said:
SR40 results in a speed of √(40² + 50²) = 64 (128% of normal run-forward speed) at an angle of arctan(40/50) = 38.7 degrees (to the right of directly forward)...

It [SR50] results in a speed of √(50² + 50²) = 70.7 (141% of normal run-forward speed) at an angle of arctan(50/50) = 45 degrees.

[DuckReconMajor]

Oh. I got it mixed it up, thinking it was from √2 = 1.41

[Xane_MM]

DuckReconMajor said:

If that is an issue, when you get a new keyboard, look for one with a high key rollover.

Rollover? I didn't know that was what the problem was; I thought it was programmed into the system to be annoying (like how overheating computers rudely shut down without at least saving data! >:-() Well, at least now I know why too many buttons can't be pushed. Thanks.

EDIT: Edited quote to make it only refer to the part.

[LigH]

@ Xane123:

Please. For the Netiquette's sake.

Do not full-quote where it is not absolutely necessary.

If you quote something at all, quote only the part you refer to.

If you refer to everything, just call the author's name.

[Xane_MM]

LigH said:

@ Xane123:

Please. For the Netiquette's sake.

Do not full-quote where it is not absolutely necessary.

If you quote something at all, quote only the part you refer to.

If you refer to everything, just call the author's name.

OK, edited post to show only the part I'm referring to...

[DuckReconMajor]

I think he was talking more about this post. Personally it doesn't bother me that much, but it does help when you're only responding to part of someone's post. You were talking to the whole post so just saying @Archy or just posting what you were saying (your post was right below his/hers) would have been sufficient. The main issue is quoting images.

[Xane_MM]

DuckReconMajor said:

I think he was talking more about this post.
(...)
The main issue is quoting images.

Fixed the right post. It's a good thing I don't quote images. I think I just post them sometimes.

[Acid]

I just found out that the Stimpack isn't symmetrical, as in the white button flap is 1 pixel to the left :/

[Scypek2]

You can align grey BIGBRIK and first two STONE textures together, that looks pretty cool.